Omaha Mall Shooting

**Don** · **12-06-07, 08:17 AM**

What is wrong with people now days. It is sad that this type thing has to happen. 8 inocent people lost their lives for nothing yesterday.
Its getting crazy now days....

**Mike P.** · **12-06-07, 01:05 PM**

The deterioration of society has been happening for years. We're witnessing the results of it. It's a shame.

**Sonnie** · **12-06-07, 02:07 PM**

Oh... but he went out in style...

Just plain craziness.

**mike c** · **12-06-07, 08:11 PM**

err, isn't it about time somebody studied WHY these things happen? i mean, there has to be a solution reached sometime right? otherwise it will keep happening, this is like the nth time this happened this year right?

**Don** · **12-06-07, 10:59 PM**

I agree the has to be a reason why. I mean look at the things these days

Mothers killing their kids
Husbands killing the wives
School shootings

It is really getting crazy.

**drf** · **12-07-07, 03:50 AM**

There are people studying why these things are happening. The problem is that no-one wants to hear it.
Usually it comes down to fundalmentalism and civil libertarian overkill:

-you can't blame the t.v because censorship is against civil rights
-you can't blame the education system because teachers will then be held responsible for parenting short comings.
-you're not allowed to disciplan kids anymore becuase it is either physical or emotional abuse
-your not allowed to teach morals to children anymore because the child is supposed to decide their own.
-you can't ban guns becasue it violates the right of every american to own one. (effects America only)
-you can't arrest someone for being a danger, they actually have to kill someone before the police can move in.

The question is not why aren't they researching why these things happen, the question is where did common sense go and why does the general public seem so scared as to accept that there are boundaries that must be kept in order to avoid these things.

**lcaillo** · **12-07-07, 07:29 AM**

This was an example of a person who was obviously suffering emotionally. Reaching a state that brings one to do such harm to others and oneself cannot be blamed on a single cause, nor can cahnging any of the factors described above assure that these events will not be repeated. There are lessons to be learned and things that may have been done to have avoided the shootings, however. Many of them are actions that individuals could have taken in his immediate environment. They may have made no difference at all, but greater attention to his emotional state and development by his family, and common sense regarding the security of weapons would have likely gone a long way to avoiding these events.

I censor what my kids watch and if they get undesired things from TV it is my fault not TV.
Teachers are not responsible for the emotional health of my children, I am.
I consider it emotional abuse not to provide appropriate discipline and guidance.
Not teaching morals in order to allow a child to determine his own is a faulty notion. Those decisions will not be made in a vacuum, but within the context of what the child does learn. If we allow that learning to be randomly effected by society, we are still teaching morals, just not with any direction. This is foolishness.
Banning guns does not make people safer. Responsible use and security of them does.
This should have never become a police matter if those around him would have been more attentive to his emotional condition. You don't solve problems of depression and anger at society by arresting people.

**Sonnie** · **12-07-07, 10:52 AM**

You can only censor so much of what your children view on TV... you cannot censor what they watch when they are at other homes. The thing they need censoring from the most is the news... that's where the ideas of walking into schools and shooting people come from... not TV programs, not to say that TV programs are any better. Think about it... News is bad! BAD! BAD! BAD! That's why I hate watching it. I would say the News is depressing to most people. The best thing would be take the TV out of the house, but you can't very well take it out of other homes.

I blame education all day long every day that my daughter and millions of other kids walk into their schools. Many of our children spend most of their awake hours in or around the school system than they do us as parents. There is no longer any discipline in schools and while we may be ultimately responsible for our children, it is no help that we have to counter the bad they learn from other kids in school as well as the teachers and faculty can no longer discipline students like they should. And it's not just that they no longer can discipline them... many of the teachers don't care anymore. It hasn't always been like this and things have progressively gotten worse. Just because I'm responsible for my children doesn't mean I can't blame our poorly run education system for making my job harder and in some cases almost impossible. Allowing our students to walk into the schools is how "we allow that learning to be randomly effected by society"... there is no direction in our school systems. It's tantamount to foolishness to allow our kids to even walk into the schools. Many of our friends home school their kids. If I had it to do over again, that's what I would have done. Does it provide a solution for everything, no... but it provides a solution to several things, including exposure to lack of discipline, lack of love, lack of morals, lack of guidance or direction... when my child is not around me.

Love, morals, discipline and guidance is most definitely important, but it can only do so much because ultimately children do have to make choices. No matter how well you provide that love, no matter how well you teach them morals, no matter how well you discipline and no matter how well you guide them.... the temptation to make the wrong choice can still overtake them from time to time because nobody is perfect. If the that temptation overtakes them at one of those most unfortunate wrong times or wrong places, then devastation could be lurking around the corner. All of the sudden it's like every bit of that love, every one of those morals, every bit of that discipline and every smacking bit of that guidance all went down the drain. Of course that still doesn't take away from the fact we need to love, discipline and guide them.

Guns... well there is one thing for sure and two things for certain... you WILL NOT teach responsible use and security of guns to that emotionally distraught person... and we will never be able to control those who sell guns. A person who plans on shooting a person or people can too easily walk into a gun shop and buy a gun. Who is going to teach that person responsible use and security and it have any influence on that person? It ain't gonna happen. Ask yourself this question, if guns were already banned... and I mean no one but police officers could carry them... would any of those people in that Omaha Mall still be alive today? Think back to all the shooting sprees that have taken place over the years. If guns were banned, would some if not all of those people be alive today? Please... don't tell me that banning guns would not save lives. It most definitely would save at least some lives.

It's easy to pinpoint the faults... it's easy to blame others... we all do it to a certain extent. I would suggest much of it is actually our own fault because we can't all agree... we can't all be of like mind and of the same judgment. Furthermore there are more that don't care than they are that do. There will most likely never be a solution to all of it, not in the earthly realm of life. We'll talk about it, ponder over it, give our opinions and sadly it will continue.

**Don** · **12-07-07, 01:05 PM**

I do have to agree that Banning gun does save live and also would have save the lives of those murdered with gun's. I myself do not allow gun's in my home. Now. There is no way, unless you banned Gun, to keep them out of the hands of insane people. Even if They passed a law banning guns today it would be very hard to keep them out of the hands of insane people because there are to many illegal Guns out there. The Gun that the omaha shooter used was take from his stepfather. Now my question is this, why did his stepfather have that type of an automatic rifle anyway? what do you use it for?
As far as discipline goes, now day's the kids have no discipline because of the laws. Look at the gangs and how many there are and how many members are in those gangs. It is ashamed the way things are going now days.
When I was a kid, you hardly seen a gun used is a fight now day it is an everyday thing.

My heart goes out to those that lost their live in Omaha and best wishes to those injured also...

**drf** · **12-08-07, 01:11 AM**

Quote:

lcaillo wrote:

This was an example of a person who was obviously suffering emotionally. Reaching a state that brings one to do such harm to others and oneself cannot be blamed on a single cause, nor can cahnging any of the factors described above assure that these events will not be repeated. There are lessons to be learned and things that may have been done to have avoided the shootings, however. Many of them are actions that individuals could have taken in his immediate environment. They may have made no difference at all, but greater attention to his emotional state and development by his family, and common sense regarding the security of weapons would have likely gone a long way to avoiding these events.

I'm not too sure if you understood my point or not but I agree for the most part with what you say.

Quote:

I censor what my kids watch and if they get undesired things from TV it is my fault not TV.

Granted, but there is still alot on t.v that even full grown adults are not mature enough to watch. The question is who is responsible when a program broadcast on television insights a crime because the viewer had psychological problems and was permited to watch said program?

Quote:

Teachers are not responsible for the emotional health of my children, I am.

Teachers are just as responsible for emotional health as the rest of society, My point was that we should not hold them personally responsible when they intervene to change what they percieve to be a negative psyche. they should be commended for positive intervention yet nowdays it seems they get sued if a child catches his finger in a door.

Quote:

I consider it emotional abuse not to provide appropriate discipline and guidance.

Exactely, problem is society nowadays sees all forms of discipline as abuse.

Quote:

Not teaching morals in order to allow a child to determine his own is a faulty notion. Those decisions will not be made in a vacuum, but within the context of what the child does learn. If we allow that learning to be randomlyeffected by society, we are still teaching morals, just not with any direction. This is foolishness.

again exactely, unfortunately I am starting to encounter people whodecree that they will not teach their kids about religion, philosphy or moral ethics because it is, in his words, "brainwashing".

Quote:

Banning guns does not make people safer. Responsible use and security of them does.

It does to a certain extent, there are murders commited that have been shown to have been preventable if guns were simply outlawed. Although I can see this is a hotly contested stance.

Quote:

This should have never become a police matter if those around him would have been more attentive to his emotional condition. You don't solve problems of depression and anger at society by arresting people.

I don't know the full details about this case, however there have been cases where direct intervention by local Authorities would have prevented such a crime. And here I am refering to those disturbed killers that clearly give off signs of alienation, paranoia and dysfunctionality months prior to the shooting.

**thxgoon** · **12-08-07, 12:51 PM**

Guns have been around for centuries but only recently have these mass shootings taken place. Guns haven't changed - people have

**Don** · **12-08-07, 01:17 PM**

Quote:

thxgoon wrote:

Guns have been around for centuries but only recently have these mass shootings taken place. Guns haven't changed - people have

Your right and this is why it's to late to ban weapons but, Because like I said there is to many on the streets and access to those weapons is way to easy for anyone to get, So it is to late to banned them. But, Some kind of control is needed. Right now there is or hardly is gun control.

As far as Censoring what kids watch there is no way you can do this. You can do it in your house but in their friends house's, in the schools and not while they are hanging out with their friends. that is a different story. You can not keep your kids couped up in the house all the time. Peer pressure is a big thing as a kid is growing up.

Whats good is see adults discuss this topic, the problem is coming up with a solution in Washington, The NRA and in the home.

**lcaillo** · **12-08-07, 02:14 PM**

My point was that the solution is not in Wahsington at all nor is it a gun problem. The problem is a child allowed to flounder rather than being raised properly and cared for. Government cannot manufacture caring families. There have always been and will always be disturbed individuals and parents who don't or won't live up to their responsibilies. We need to understand that we must do all that we can to help people like this, but legislation won't do it.

**Fincave** · **12-08-07, 02:29 PM**

Quote:

thxgoon wrote:

Guns have been around for centuries but only recently have these mass shootings taken place. Guns haven't changed - people have

I have to disagree! The primary use of guns was to kill, nowadays the primary use of guns has not changed, they are still used to kill, wether in self defence, war situations or violent shootings the use or purpose is still the same. Granted some people use guns in a sporting sense. Guns have changed in that todays guns are far more advanced, do a lot more damage, have more stopping power, semi-automatic and automatic weapons exist whereas they did not before, dare I say that weapons are also more prolific today than what they were a hundred years ago. A gun has one main use, to do the maximium amount of damage to the subject that it is being fired at, irrespective of wether that subject is a paper target, a wild animal, an intruder, an innocent child in a classroom, a terrorist.

People have also changed. It is my opinion that 'we' as a society are to blame for what goes on around us. We are ruled by those people that the majority have voted for, we have created the media and they only reflect our moral standards and give us what we want. We are responsible for the faults in national health care systems that allow people with mental problems to either go unnoticed or untreated. We are responsible for the faults in educational systems, we are responsible for glorifying violence wether it is in movies or on the news. We are responsible.

**tonyvdb** · **12-08-07, 05:30 PM**

Its sad to hear these things happen more and more. I myself still believe in proper discipline of my children allot of parents just dont spend any time with there children and dont pay attention to what they do or say and who they hang around with.
By the time some parents realize that there children are mixed with the wrong group it sometimes too late. As a parent we must educate our children (Its not the schools responsibility) in there early years because otherwise once they hit there teens they rebel and simply dont hear us anymore.

**Scuba Diver** · **12-08-07, 08:32 PM**

That sucks! I feel really bad for the parents and love ones of those poor families.

However, I do not believe the gun is the problem.

I grew up with war, fighting, toy guns, BB guns, rifles, shotguns, hand guns, sling shots, knifes, axes, throwing stars, paint ball guns, numb chucks, sticks, and rocks.

People will always find a way to kill. Someone could drive a truck through the shopping center doors and run people over or take out a full cross walk of kids. Yes, he used a gun. Don't think for a second that he would not have done it if he did not have a gun.

This kid was mentaly unstable.

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