Black Widow Ultra™ Development - Page 12 - Home Theater Forum and Systems - HomeTheaterShack.com

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post #111 of 237 Old 01-11-14, 01:38 PM
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My wall is a yellowish beige. The projector image is alright with very few situations were the base color is perceived.
I've tested a white patch and another with white mixed with an aluminium paint I got as a sample.
The white patch has, most of the time, the same image as the wall. That was a surprise to me as I expected much clear/lighter image.
The other patch is just darker than the rest ( better blacks but also worst whites).

What should I expect from this Black Widow Ultra? A darker image but also brighter whites? Better overall contrast? Just brighter image (due to AAA)?

Last edited by jopereira; 01-16-14 at 06:55 AM.
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post #112 of 237 Old 01-12-14, 05:26 PM
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Re: Black Widow Ultra™ Development

Quote:
UnDerDoG81 wrote: View Post
Hi,


great thread! I´m new here and am very happy that I found this thread. Thanks for everybody here.
Hi! Welcome to HTS!

Quote:
I have some questions about the Black Widow.

I´m from germany (so, sorry for my english) and want to make an DIY Black Widow. I ordered the AAA paint and think I will get the new formula. I only ordered one bottle with 120ml and hope this will be enough for an 120 inch screen?!
Your English is fine.

No, 120 ml of AAA-F is not enough for your specified screen size as it is only enough to go with 480 ml of base paint making 600 ml of BW Ultra™. Your 120 inch diagonal 16:9 screen has just under 43 square feet of surface area. 600 ml of mix comes out to about 20 fluid ounces, if you double that you get the standard amount of mix (40 fluid ounces). While even 1200 ml of mix might be enough to paint a screen of you are experienced roller, I generally suggest that folks have 1 fluid ounce of mix (30 ml) per square foot of screen surface. People have gotten in trouble before when they didn't have enough mix for their screen and tried to stretch what they did have by applying the mix too thinly which can cause over-rolling.

Quote:
So I have the Optoma hd131xe beamer. It says it has 2500 ansi lumen (not sure if this is true). I want to use the beamer ~80% for gaming and watching movies. But also for 20% I want to use it for 3D. Will there be any problems with the 3D when painting it with an neutral grey and the AAA?
3D is going to be the dimmest image by far. Unfortunately, the review I read of this PJ didn't list any lumen values for 3D usage, but I would expect them to be about 50% of 2D or perhaps less. Pre-calibration lumens in Bright mode and full lamp came in at 1653 which means you would be getting 38 fL of image brightness (assuming a 1.0 gain screen). This is actually too bright for most home theaters, but could come in handy if there is a lot of ambient light present. Switching to Eco mode (6000 lamp hours) only dropped the lumens by 20%. To make a long story short, that PJ even at it's dimmest setting used in the review would still give 17 fL of image brightness, so I think you are good with the standard BW Ultra™ N7.5 mix.

Quote:
And also I´m not sure wich neutral grey I should take if I get the new AAA formula? Has anyone any color code for germany? Must it be matt? Acryl? Or whatever options there are?
I don't know what paint brand you want to use, but get it in a flat or matte finish (gloss level). It must also be water-based and not solvent-based. As for color, try to find a paint brand that can use the RAL Design color codes, if none of your paint stores can do that then see if they can use the RAL Classic color codes (as I understand it they should).

If using RAL Design colors the code would be 000 75 00 which is a N7.5 gray.

If using the RAL Classic colors the code would be RAL 7038 'Agate grey' which is a N7.9 gray (there is no N7.5 RAL Classic color).
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post #113 of 237 Old 01-12-14, 05:38 PM
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Re: Black Widow Ultra™ Development

Quote:
jopereira wrote: View Post
My wall is a yellowish beige. The projector image is alright with very situations were the base color is perceived.
I've tested a white patch and another with white mixed with an aluminium paint I got as a sample.
The white patch has, almost all the time, the same image as the wall. That was a surprise to me as I expected much clear/lighter image.
The other patch is just darker than the rest ( better blacks but also worst whites).

What should I expect from this Black Widow Ultra? A darker image but also brighter whites? Better overall contrast? Just brighter image (due to AAA)?
Black Widow Ultra™ is still a mix in testing, but I can say that so far in our testing the mix that has the most color change is the one using white paint as a base. I just tested one and it came out at N9.1.

Black Widow Ultra™ mixes will be darker than white paint, but they will have brighter whites than a regular paint the same color due to the reflectiveness of the aluminum.
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post #114 of 237 Old 01-12-14, 06:44 PM
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Re: Black Widow Ultra™ Development

Thank you very much Harpmaker for your reply. This answers all my questions

Will report after painting.

Oh but there comes another question in my mind. Here in the german Black Widow threads, people pre paint their MDF 2 times with an matt white color "(as priming(grounding?)) and "grind"? it that after. Is this really needed? Or can I apply the BW paint directly on the MDF?
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post #115 of 237 Old 01-12-14, 07:41 PM
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Re: Black Widow Ultra™ Development

Quote:
UnDerDoG81 wrote: View Post
Thank you very much Harpmaker for your reply. This answers all my questions

Will report after painting.
That would be great!

Quote:
Oh but there comes another question in my mind. Here in the german Black Widow threads, people pre paint their MDF 2 times with an matt white color "(as priming(grounding?)) and "grind"? it that after. Is this really needed? Or can I apply the BW paint directly on the MDF?
Yes, MDF should be primed with a white primer before painting. The reason is that primer (it might be called something different in Germany) is designed to seal an absorbent surface so that it takes less top-coat paint to paint the item (your screen). It's best to use 2 coats of primer. I don't know what you mean by "grind", the only thing I can think it might mean is that people are sanding their primer to get the surface smoother and remove rolling marks.

If you are rolling your paint use a low nap (5 or 6 mm) roller cover. Do NOT use a foam roller!
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post #116 of 237 Old 01-13-14, 07:17 AM
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Re: Black Widow Ultra™ Development

Quote:
Harpmaker wrote: View Post
That would be great!


Yes, MDF should be primed with a white primer before painting. The reason is that primer (it might be called something different in Germany) is designed to seal an absorbent surface so that it takes less top-coat paint to paint the item (your screen). It's best to use 2 coats of primer. I don't know what you mean by "grind", the only thing I can think it might mean is that people are sanding their primer to get the surface smoother and remove rolling marks.

If you are rolling your paint use a low nap (5 or 6 mm) roller cover. Do NOT use a foam roller!
YES, sanding was the correct word, translator

So my Dad brought me an white MDF from work today. I think on that, I can put the BW directly on? Because the white on the MDF is like an plastic skin. But I think first I should sand it with 320 paper and then clean it with alkohol or so!?

Tomorrow I will start, can´t wait!
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post #117 of 237 Old 01-13-14, 12:29 PM
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Re: Black Widow Ultra™ Development

Quote:
UnDerDoG81 wrote: View Post
YES, sanding was the correct word, translator

So my Dad brought me an white MDF from work today. I think on that, I can put the BW directly on? Because the white on the MDF is like an plastic skin. But I think first I should sand it with 320 paper and then clean it with alkohol or so!?

Tomorrow I will start, can´t wait!
It sounds like your MDF sheet is covered in white melamine or vinyl. In either case I would recommend sanding the sheet and THEN priming the sheet before putting on the BW Ultra™ mix. The reason is that while the BW Ultra™ will stick to the white MDF it WILL scratch off MUCH more easily than if a primer is used.
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post #118 of 237 Old 01-13-14, 01:37 PM
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Re: Black Widow Ultra™ Development

Ok, thank you Harpmaker.

Any suggestions for the prime color? I have no clue about colors, I´ve read in german forums something about Alpina matt white but there are so many different formulas. Latex, Acryl, Water based and whatever :/
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post #119 of 237 Old 01-13-14, 03:06 PM
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Re: Black Widow Ultra™ Development

Good advice for any paint job on any surface is - sand, prime, sand, paint, sand, paint.
Every time you sand your wall will get flatter. Don't sand the roller marks, just sand the entire surface uniformly. The only primer I have used is white, I tend to use Kilz2 because it easy to find, comes in any sized bucket you want and does the job; but I know there are better ones out there.

I recall something about a good flat or matte enamel being the best paint because the enamel tends to level itself well, I don't hear this often though, so I wonder if it is true?
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post #120 of 237 Old 01-13-14, 06:22 PM
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Re: Black Widow Ultra™ Development

Quote:
UnDerDoG81 wrote: View Post
Ok, thank you Harpmaker.

Any suggestions for the prime color? I have no clue about colors, I´ve read in german forums something about Alpina matt white but there are so many different formulas. Latex, Acryl, Water based and whatever :/
I would use a white primer since they are usually easier to come by, but a gray primer would work too.

I tried searching for "alpina matte white" and didn't get any hits on paint or primers, but mostly BMW's. I believe that "Zinnser Bulls Eye 1-2-3 white primer is available in Germany, but I'm not positive. Here is a link for it.

It doesn't matter if the primer is acrylic, PVC, latex or whatever just as long as it is water-based. OK, now that I think on it, since you are not mixing the primer with the top-coat paint it really doesn't matter if the primer is oil-based, solvent-based or water-based! The main thing about water-based primers is that they don't have much odor to them while the other types can be quite smelly.
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