Black Widow Ultra™ Development - Page 9 - Home Theater Forum and Systems - HomeTheaterShack.com

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post #81 of 235 Old 12-12-13, 02:20 PM
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Re: Black Widow Ultra™ Development

Quote:
Yiannis1970 wrote: View Post
You can convert lux to lumens:

Lumens = lux x screen surface in square meters.

I believe projectorreviews measured 565 lumens with Mitsubishi calibrated. 120'' are 3,96 s.m. So, 565 : 3,96 = 142,6 lux aka 45 nits from a screen with gain 1. If these numbers are true, i wouldn't use anything below N9 as a base, at least if we are talking about 120''.
my screen will be 105" with a throw distance of 3,50m so i think i will get more lumens but only when light meter arrive i can say for sure

thanks for the info and next week i hope i have the light meter
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post #82 of 235 Old 12-12-13, 03:02 PM
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Re: Black Widow Ultra™ Development

You are welcome.
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post #83 of 235 Old 12-14-13, 07:44 PM
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Re: Black Widow Ultra™ Development

the light meter will take almost 2 weeks to arrive

i think as soon the 2x AA arrive ( for sure next week ) i think i will paint the screen. i read on this forum about a guy that had too a mitsubishi HC3800 with new bulb that use a ELEKTRA N8 106" screen and he was very very happy with the picture quality and say black improve a lot and whites were great compared with BOC and Kilz . personally i find much more anoying those dark grey bars than greyish whites .

here is the post ( post 15) of that guy: http://www.hometheatershack.com/foru...t-cloth-2.html

so, im think use a base s 1500-n (N8.4). when i mix this base with AA the final colour will be more dark right? how much dark will be the final mix?

right now im undecided between base s1500-n (N8.4) or s1000-n (N8.9). both base will get dark when i mix them with AA but dont know how much dark they will get.

Last edited by stryker; 12-14-13 at 07:51 PM.
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post #84 of 235 Old 12-14-13, 11:48 PM
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Re: Black Widow Ultra™ Development

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stryker wrote: View Post
the light meter will take almost 2 weeks to arrive

i think as soon the 2x AA arrive ( for sure next week ) i think i will paint the screen. i read on this forum about a guy that had too a mitsubishi HC3800 with new bulb that use a ELEKTRA N8 106" screen and he was very very happy with the picture quality and say black improve a lot and whites were great compared with BOC and Kilz . personally i find much more anoying those dark grey bars than greyish whites .

here is the post ( post 15) of that guy: http://www.hometheatershack.com/foru...t-cloth-2.html
The Elektra™ mixes used a paint that is unfortunately no longer available. That paint was, to the best of my knowledge, made with an aluminum coated polymer as the reflective component. It worked really well.

Any help with black levels come from the grayness of the mix absorbing light and not from the reflective element used, that is what increases on-axis gain and white levels. However, that added gain is also applied to on-axis black levels as well - this is simple physics.

Quote:
so, im think use a base s 1500-n (N8.4). when i mix this base with AA the final colour will be more dark right? how much dark will be the final mix?

right now im undecided between base s1500-n (N8.4) or s1000-n (N8.9). both base will get dark when i mix them with AA but dont know how much dark they will get.
The s1500-n and s1000-n paints will not get much darker after adding the AAA-F; you may even have to view samples painted of the bases and then samples of the bases + the AAA-F to even see the difference. One of the unanswered questions about the new AAA-F is how much the base paint will hide the aluminum and this may be different from brand to brand of paint. We would GREATLY appreciate any samples from folks testing any Black Widow Ultra™ mixes. The cost is that of mailing a letter. Just PM Mech or myself for our addresses.

Something that has just come to light is NOT to stir the AAA-F into the base paint using a high speed mixer. If very rapid mixers are used the coating on the aluminum flakes could begin to come off and the AAA-F would then darken the mix more like the old AAA-F did. For people that use regular drill stirring attachments and normal "under 1000 RPM" drills, or that mix the paints by hand, this is not a problem.
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post #85 of 235 Old 12-15-13, 05:30 AM
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Re: Black Widow Ultra™ Development

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Harpmaker wrote: View Post
The Elektra™ mixes used a paint that is unfortunately no longer available. That paint was, to the best of my knowledge, made with an aluminum coated polymer as the reflective component. It worked really well.

Any help with black levels come from the grayness of the mix absorbing light and not from the reflective element used, that is what increases on-axis gain and white levels. However, that added gain is also applied to on-axis black levels as well - this is simple physics.


The s1500-n and s1000-n paints will not get much darker after adding the AAA-F; you may even have to view samples painted of the bases and then samples of the bases + the AAA-F to even see the difference. One of the unanswered questions about the new AAA-F is how much the base paint will hide the aluminum and this may be different from brand to brand of paint. We would GREATLY appreciate any samples from folks testing any Black Widow Ultra™ mixes. The cost is that of mailing a letter. Just PM Mech or myself for our addresses.

Something that has just come to light is NOT to stir the AAA-F into the base paint using a high speed mixer. If very rapid mixers are used the coating on the aluminum flakes could begin to come off and the AAA-F would then darken the mix more like the old AAA-F did. For people that use regular drill stirring attachments and normal "under 1000 RPM" drills, or that mix the paints by hand, this is not a problem.
ok. i will use a base N8.4 with AA and i will send to you a sample. how much paint do you need? im from Portugal btw
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post #86 of 235 Old 12-15-13, 12:15 PM
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Re: Black Widow Ultra™ Development

stryker,

at post 47 you can see how AAA reacts with a N8 base. At post 24 Mech showed lighter and darker versions.
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post #87 of 235 Old 12-15-13, 02:25 PM
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Re: Black Widow Ultra™ Development

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stryker wrote: View Post
ok. i will use a base N8.4 with AA and i will send to you a sample. how much paint do you need? im from Portugal btw
We only need about a square inch sample to measure with our spectrophotometers. We have found that paint samples should be wrapped in a plain white paper towel; this protects them from the bumps and bruises of shipping as well as from any ink that may be used as a "security" feature on the inside of the envelope.
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post #88 of 235 Old 12-23-13, 03:01 PM
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Re: Black Widow Ultra™ Development

hi again

the AA will arrive on day 26, the lux meter i dont even know when will arrive but for sure will be in 2014.

after i saw some movies on my screen i decide 105" was to big for me ( i was always move my eyes down to read subtitles and up to see the movie) and now i have a 95" screen. projectorcentral give me a image brightness of 20fl.

i think i will use a base N8 instead of N8.5. a base N7.5 (like the original BW) will be to much dark dont you think?

with this dark screen i will have less light reflect on my wall compared the very ligh grey screen i have now right? i already have black ceiling and light brown walls
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post #89 of 235 Old 12-23-13, 04:55 PM
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Re: Black Widow Ultra™ Development

Quote:
stryker wrote: View Post
hi again

the AA will arrive on day 26, the lux meter i dont even know when will arrive but for sure will be in 2014.

after i saw some movies on my screen i decide 105" was to big for me ( i was always move my eyes down to read subtitles and up to see the movie) and now i have a 95" screen. projectorcentral give me a image brightness of 20fl.

i think i will use a base N8 instead of N8.5. a base N7.5 (like the original BW) will be to much dark dont you think?

with this dark screen i will have less light reflect on my wall compared the very ligh grey screen i have now right? i already have black ceiling and light brown walls
Your best bet, if you can wait that long, is to wait until you get the light meter before finalizing what shade of gray you should use since then you will know exactly how bright your image is.

Minimal image brightness is a very subjective thing. Both Mech and I have used image brightnesses between 10 and 12 fL and a N7.5 BW™ screen and been very happy, but I know a few others that needed to have a real 16 fL image for it to be bright enough for them.

While one can tell the difference between screens N0.5 shades apart it takes whole N value differences to make a truly significant difference.
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post #90 of 235 Old 12-26-13, 07:02 PM
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Re: Black Widow Ultra™ Development

hi guys, i have news

couldnt wait for the lux meter arrive, so when i got today the AA i mixed it with a base N8.4 (s 1500-n) and with only two thin coats and stil wet the IQ improve a lot.

the whites still look white but the black/contrast improve a LOT.

when i mix the base with AA i got a final mix very very close to N8. i bought 1L of N8.4 and N8 paint but i end use the N8.4 because i was afraid about white be to grey.

i think i could had use a N7.5 dark base but im very happy now and i suppose the IQ after the paint dry will be better .

amazing stuff guys. in few days i will post a few pics and send some samples to Harpmaker.

Last edited by stryker; 12-27-13 at 07:46 AM.
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