Need Help Building Sub

**letzleta** · **01-11-07, 02:40 PM**

I am trying to figure out what my best option is for building a $500 or less sub. It will be used mainly for movie viewing, but I also enjoy the occasional concert on DVD or cable.

Space is not a problem. This is my first attempt at building a speaker box. And my current speakers are JBL E30's (6 1/2 inch two ways). Specs say they go down to about 50hz.

I need help deciding on a Sub/Amp/Box combo!!! Thanks in advance.

**Sonnie** · **01-11-07, 03:01 PM**

If space is not an issue, I'd consider the LLT with one of the SoundSplinter 15's. The driver is $250... not sure how much the materials are, but you can find amps for under $200 to power it.

I'm sure some of our regulars will chime in and throw some options your way.

**JCD** · **01-11-07, 04:04 PM**

I suspect that the LLT is a better performer, but if you'd like something a little less in size and cost, you could also try this one.

Also, if you have space for an IB, that can be done for very little as well.

Nady XA-900 $150
2x Mach 5 MJ-18 ~$190 (includes shipping from Canada)

Getting up to 4 drivers would be ~$370 -- and would be recommended but busts your budget by $20. Also, my understanding is that there is supposed to be an American distributor for these drivers sometime soon (March?) with their new updated driver so their shipping costs could be a lot lower. Not sure what the pricing would be on the new drivers, but based on the rest of their offerings, it should still be way cheap. Of course, these costs do not include any of the "small items" needed like wiring, MDF, etc.

JCD

**SteveCallas** · **01-11-07, 04:16 PM**

Well a single RLp15 is like $280 - with shipping, let's just say $300. He'd be hard pressed in making a RLp15 LLT for $500 unless he already has the other materials and tools ready to go.

How's about a Dayton Titanic 15" in 280 liters with a 6" port that is 17" long being fed with 500 watts and a 16hz highpass?

**letzleta** · **01-11-07, 04:18 PM**

IB is a possibility.

My basement is divided into two sections by a single Drywall wall with one door, but I am not sure that it provides the necessary separation of the sound waves. I don't know much about IB if you can't tell.

EDIT: More specifically, my basement is cinderblock painted walls with a single framed drywall wall. I know that the bottom step is open below it to the other side of the basement. Do things like that need to be blocked off for the IB to work?

**letzleta** · **01-11-07, 05:33 PM**

Quote:

SteveCallas wrote:

Well a single RLp15 is like $280 - with shipping, let's just say $300. He'd be hard pressed in making a RLp15 LLT for $500 unless he already has the other materials and tools ready to go.

How's about a Dayton Titanic 15" in 280 liters with a 6" port that is 17" long being fed with 500 watts and a 16hz highpass?

This is also a good option, do you have any experience with the Dayton Titanic 15"? How would it compare to Dayton's other 15" models (HO and HF)?

Thanks all for the options.... Keep them coming!!

**Otto** · **01-11-07, 05:57 PM**

Hi tom,

IBs generally want to have the back wave isolated from the front wave. Can you post a pic of your basement? That might give some other ideas for placement if you want to go IB. I did one, and it's a lot of fun, a good project, and prodigious bass. Not to knock the other ideas here either -- the LLT and Dayton will also be fine performers. In the end it'll be up to you to find the best sub for your application. If you are looking for more stuff about IB, there's a lot at the "cult of the infinitely baffled" website.

Good luck!

**letzleta** · **01-11-07, 10:35 PM**

After reading about IB setups, I don't think I can do it with my current basement setup. I don't believe there is good enough isolation of front and rear waves.

So, I guess I am down to what type of box and what sub to use.

The frontrunner so far looks like "Dayton Titanic 15" in 280 liters with a 6" port that is 17" long being fed with 500 watts and a 16hz highpass".

However, I have been hearing good things about the TC-1000 12" and Mach 5 Audio 15" and 18" subs. Anyone have experience with these? The TC-1000 design looks similar to the Dayton Titanic.

**letzleta** · **01-12-07, 10:49 AM**

New option, I have found someone getting rid of a sono sub built for a Dayton DVC 15". It is about 220l tuned to around 17hz. It would run me ~125-150 + sub ~150 + amp. So I assume I would be close to the $500 point.

I have been using WinISD to try and compare the performance of the sono setup vs. the titanic setup, but I have not figured the program out yet.

Performance wise, which option will give me better results? (sono or bigger box)

**adogand6kids** · **01-12-07, 05:48 PM**

Have a look at the rhythmik audio web page. You should be able to build a sealed 12 inch direct servo sub for about $500.

**SteveCallas** · **01-12-07, 10:38 PM**

The Titanic is superior to the DVC. In regards to Dayton subwoofer drivers, order of quality would be Quatro, DVC, Titanic, Reference Series. I didn't suggest the RS drivers because you would want two of them for what I would typically consider sufficient output levels. The Mach 18 might be able to better the Titanic design, but I believe the enclosure would need to be pretty big - I'll check it out tommorrow. I doubt the TC 1000 12" would be up to the task.

**letzleta** · **01-13-07, 10:31 PM**

Quote:

SteveCallas wrote:

The Titanic is superior to the DVC. In regards to Dayton subwoofer drivers, order of quality would be Quatro, DVC, Titanic, Reference Series. I didn't suggest the RS drivers because you would want two of them for what I would typically consider sufficient output levels. The Mach 18 might be able to better the Titanic design, but I believe the enclosure would need to be pretty big - I'll check it out tommorrow. I doubt the TC 1000 12" would be up to the task.

Did you get a chance to compare these subs for me?

**SteveCallas** · **01-15-07, 09:17 PM**

Ok, the Mach 18 would be able to offer more output with a similar FR, but you'd need to go significantly larger, around 450 liters. Personally, considering that this driver can't do much below 20hz, I don't think the size is justified.

I did find a third option that would be inbetween the two on size. Two Ascendant Audio 12" Assassins in 360 effective liters with 500-600 watts and one 8" diameter port that is 22" long. It would offer about 2db more output throughout the sub range.

If that doesn't tickle your fancy, the original Titanic design still looks good.

**letzleta** · **01-17-07, 12:55 PM**

OK, so the Titanic looks like the frontrunner right now.

My question then becomes, how important is box design? For example, are there benefits to downfiring the sub? What about port placement/direction?

Also, most box designs I see are reinforced in some way, does the placement/design of reinforcements make any difference?

**letzleta** · **01-17-07, 12:56 PM**

Also, I remember reading something about replacing cap's in the Bash 500 amp for the highpass. If I am going with a 500watt amp, how do I make sure to get the recommended 16Hz highpass?

**SteveCallas** · **01-17-07, 07:28 PM**

Downfiring offers more protection for the driver in the sense that it's nearly impossible to for kids/pets/you to touch the driver. I also believe - based on numerous in room FR sweeps I have seen - that downfiring generally results in a smoother overall FR. Don't take that as a proven fact, just something I have noticed. Position the port with as much clearance from any obstructions as possible. A sonosub works great for downfiring the driver and giving the port the most clearance.

Contact PE for advice on how to adjust the highpass.

**F1 fan** · **01-17-07, 07:56 PM**

letzleta,the tables for modifying the filter in the BASH amp are at the bottom of the page on the link.It is a matter of changing two resistors.The 1db boost table is the one you should reference.Setting it for 13.9hz should work fine and the one 1db of boost is insignificant.
http://www.partsexpress.com/pdf/300-752.pdf

**letzleta** · **01-18-07, 11:15 AM**

Is it worth an extra $12 to get this amp?
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showd...number=300-806

It is 540W, but has more features, including what I think to be a variable hi-pass.

**letzleta** · **01-18-07, 11:19 AM**

I just read a comment about the Titanic 15"

"I was looking at the Dayton 15'' Titanic driver, but ive heard multiple people say its one note-ish, which I hate."

Is this really the case, and if so, are there better options out there for my situation? For example 2 dayton hifi's are mentioned in that same thread.

**SteveCallas** · **01-18-07, 09:02 PM**

That's ****. One-notish means the in room response isn't very good or the design was poor.

**GPM** · **01-18-07, 10:05 PM**

Greets!

Speaking of the Quatro, here's a 'work in progress' two fold pipe sub that effectively has a better than IB response with near IB BW: http://www.decware.com/cgi-bin/yabb/...330259;start=0
GM

**letzleta** · **01-18-07, 10:42 PM**

Quote:

letzleta wrote:

Is it worth an extra $12 to get this amp?
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showd...number=300-806

It is 540W, but has more features, including what I think to be a variable hi-pass.

Anyone?

**Sonnie** · **01-18-07, 11:01 PM**

What were you comparing it to tom?

**letzleta** · **01-18-07, 11:04 PM**

Sorry, the Bash 500 amp discussed a few posts up. I am confident I could do the capacitor replacement, but if I don't have to for an extra $12, I would rather not.

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