please help me decide - pre-pro or preamp?

[alpina]

hi guys,

at a crossroad and need your help - this is my first post here, so please take it easy on me

had a yamaha 2600 (recently sold it) that pre-outs into bryston amps (4b & 6b)

now have to decide between a bryston bp26DA (which doesnt have ht bypass), bp16DA (which does have ht bypass but obviously inferior to bp26 in every other way) or sp2.

if i go preamp option i would more than likely go with a japanese receiver solution for HT solution, perhaps even another 2600 - a very good receiver for video and upscaling, though only hdmi 1.1 compliant.

reason for not going sp2 automatically is that is doesn't have hdmi or the new HD audio formats (not that i can blame bryston as the formats are yet to be determined ) but also because HT technology changes in leaps and bounds and although the sp2 is upgradeable, it is an expensive option when you can simply update your japanese receiver with all the bells and whistles every few years for a fraction of the cost. also the sp2 uses the preamp from the bp25 rather than bp26.

now obviously the bp26 is the bees knees from bryston as far as 2ch listening goes but its only half my solution and getting a bp26 and the sp2 down the track when it has has hdmi and new audio formats makes no sense at all as by that time it will probably have bp26 2ch internals. on a plus, advancements in 2ch preamps are slow and far between them and if i get one, its unlikely that i would change it anytime soon.

forgive the rambling

any advice / assistance appreciated

cheers,

julie

[Phil M]

Julie,

Any questions on Bryston you can contact CEO, James Tanner directly by email:

jamestanner@bryston.ca

He is probably the most helpful guy in the industry, and very customer responsive (he'll get back to you within a few hours). This is not a back door approach, all customer enquiries go to James from their website. He'll be more than happy to go through the different Bryston options.

I'm not sure from your post what your priorities are, but can tell you what I've done on HT processors and preamps.
I had a BP25 and 4BBSST, very happy and then bought a Rotel 1098 processor - the 2 channel sound was terrible after the BP25. Even though its labeled 'bypass' I discovered that almost all HT processors have some digital processing through their 2 channel inputs.
To fix this I tried a BelCanto PrePro 6, Ayre K5-xe and McCormack MAP1 all preamps with HT bypass, they all sounded great but eventually bought a Modwright SWL9 tubed preamp with HT bypass. The Rotel 1098 stayed in the system for the DD and DTS processing duties.
I've now moved on with an integrated amp that does not have a HT bypass. The solution is to have the processor preamp output for front left and right go into a spare input on (such as aux) on the preamp and have a volume level that has already been fixed during the setup of the processor. I have a piece of tape on the amp, and when I switch to HT I just put the amp (or preamp in your case) at the fixed voume level and the processor volume controls all channels. Difficult to explain, but trust this helps.

[alpina]

Phil M wrote:

I've now moved on with an integrated amp that does not have a HT bypass. The solution is to have the processor preamp output for front left and right go into a spare input on (such as aux) on the preamp and have a volume level that has already been fixed during the setup of the processor. I have a piece of tape on the amp, and when I switch to HT I just put the amp (or preamp in your case) at the fixed voume level and the processor volume controls all channels. Difficult to explain, but trust this helps.

Hi Phil,

Thanks for response. little confused by your last paragraph though

Its a shame that the BP16 has HT bypass and the BP26 doesn't

My biggest drama remains that most of my listening is skewed towards HT listening. For HT would a SP2 be superior to say a yamaha 2600 (which would have video switching too, plus amps that I dont need)? If not, perhaps a BP26 (hooked up in the manner you described with a 2600 is the way to go?

Cheers,

Julie

[brucek]

also the sp2 uses the preamp from the bp25 rather than bp26.

I believe the BP25 and BP26 differ only by the inclusion of the MPS-2 power supply and some cosmetics. The amplifier is essentially the same, so I don't know if that's an issue.

I suspect the answer to your question could be argued either way. How important the quality of two channel and HT to you will be the deciding factor. The difference between the SP2 bypass and BP26 standalone for analog will be small, but may be sufficient to tip you that route. The HT processor differences in audio quality between the SP2 and a "japanese receiver" may be significant enough to tip you to the SP2. Certainly the integration problems will move you to the SP2. Any thoughts of bypassing a BP26 through another device negates the advantage of the BP26.

Purchasing an SP2 with its spectacular analog preamp section would provide you with great two channel, great HT, and flawless integration. The economics in the short term may favour the single SP2 solution, depending of course on the quality of the japanese receiver. It's a shoot trying to predict or protect yourself in the long term. In the medium term I suspect you'll see the SP2 acquire HDMI 1.3

Anyway, the integration issue would be enough to choose the SP2 as a single standalone solution. Don't discount the upgradability of the SP2 - it's a significant bonus.

brucek

[alpina]

brucek wrote:

It's a shoot trying to predict or protect yourself in the long term. In the medium term I suspect you'll see the SP2 acquire HDMI 1.3

Anyway, the integration issue would be enough to choose the SP2 as a single standalone solution. Don't discount the upgradability of the SP2 - it's a significant bonus.

brucek

maybe it's patience that i need

julie

[Phil M]

Sorry Julie, my coffee hadn't kicked in when I replied - and I confused myself on the last paragraph
Again on the topic of Bryston, James Tanner is the source to go to on questions about the specific differences on his products, future plans, upgrades etc. It's not very often we get the opportunity to have direct access to this type of resource inside a manufacturer, and I would encourage you to drop him an email with your questions.

The caffeine is now flowing, and I can try and explain a little better how I integrated a preamp with no HT bypass in my system:

1. Take the front left/right processor outputs, that would normally feed the front left and right inputs of the power amp, and plug them into an spare input on the preamp.
2. Turn the volume down on the preamp and run the test signal from the processor.
3. Select the input with the processor source and slowly turn up the volume level on the preamp until you reach the target level you need (using your ears or preferably a SPL meter).
4. When the volume level is equal to the the other channels you simply mark up the volume level on the preamp - and this becomes the volume level you use in HT mode. Effectively you are manually setting the HT bypass level. To increase the volume when listening to your HT the processor volume is used, and the preamp level is a constant.
5. When you use the preamp to listen to CD's for example, you just use the preamp as normal with its volume controlling the sound level.

[Sonnie]

Hey Julie good to see you made it on in!

Don't run off before you post all your equipment in the Members Equipment Listings and tell us more about yourself in the Members Introduction area too.


Anyone owning Bryston has got to have some nice stuff.

[alpina]

Hi Phil,

That was very clear - many thanks

Really shows the benefit of a good pre-pro from a hassle free perspective

Wonder if there is anyway or benefit of using both the xlr and rca's from the bp26 to both power amp (XLR) and avr (RCA)??? Definitely confusing myself now!

Cheers,

Julie

PS: Have spoken to James on a few occasions on another forum and have found him to be most helpful - thinking hdmi, new sound formats & EQ is still some time away for the SP2.
Bryston are currently working on a cd transport that I think will be very interesting also

[alpina]

Sonnie wrote:

Hey Julie good to see you made it on in!

Don't run off before you post all your equipment in the Members Equipment Listings and tell us more about yourself in the Members Introduction area too.


Anyone owning Bryston has got to have some nice stuff.

Hi Sonnie,

Looking forward to becoming a regular here

I love chatting audio - hubbie is more into it than me but we really do try to share interests so I know my fair share about audio, cars and renovating

Will check out the Members Listing section.

Cheers,

Julie