The Official $2,500 Speaker Evaluation / Home Audition Event - Page 13 - Home Theater Forum and Systems -

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post #121 of 1088 Old 10-19-13, 11:48 AM
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Re: The Official $2,500 Speaker Evaluation / Home Audition Event

Reading several of the replies so far I can already tell this event will be a big success. Sonnie, you truly seem dedicated to the community here. Love that Cedar Creek Cinema space, you've created - great name too !

Like everyone else, I'm looking forward to the reviews, but mostly I hope everyone involved enjoys themselves and becomes that much better off for having participated.
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post #122 of 1088 Old 10-19-13, 11:50 AM Thread Starter
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Re: The Official $2,500 Speaker Evaluation / Home Audition Event

Muser wrote: View Post
One thing about shootouts is that it looks like you’re asking each product to do the same thing, which implies “fairness” or a level playing field. Except that everyone has different taste. This might manifest as a preference for one type of material for the participants in this “shootout”, i.e. action movie, drama, fantasy, etc. This is going to be true of all reviewers, so don't take this personally.

If you subject all of the systems to “one” type of movie, you might miss out on qualities that will revealed by and appreciated by a different type of listener. You may well reveal to your readers what your preferences are, but that may not be the same profile of preferences as your readers.

If you can, I’d suggest that your evaluations be further focused on reporting that might read “On drama with a lot of dialogue, the X system, dialogue intelligibility was higher making for a more relaxed, intimate experience; while on action movies the dialogue intelligibility didn’t matter, but the speakers shortcomings on macro dynamic swings was more evident; and finally, with music videos . . . .
We will be watching several different movies with the home theater system we will be reviewing, but for the two-channel evaluation speakers, it will be strictly music. I may toss the $20,000 speaker system into my home theater system, but that will be later on after the evaluation.

For music listening, we use several types of music.

|Tch0rT| wrote: View Post
I'd love to be a part of a shootout like this! Those MartinLogan's in the back sure make the ElectroMotion ESL's look small LOL. It'll be interesting to see how the ML EM ESL's compare to the Magnepan's (well the others too).
I know it... don't they. I was thinking the EXACT same thing when I was setting them up and standing back from them to take the photo. It is amazing how much smaller they are. Those Maggies are pretty big too.

RLouis wrote: View Post
No reason to limit this concept to speakers. Could also do receivers at various price points (low, mid, top end) and TVs/displays. Although TV are a bit tougher because of the complication of calibration for best performance. I'm sure people would love to see a properly staged apples-to-apples competitive comparison of the major top end AV receivers. Denon, Pioneer Elite, Onkyo, Yamaha, Anthem, maybe Cambridge if avaialbe
I have done a couple of receiver reviews (Denon 4520 and Yamaha 3010) and man... those things take a LOT of time to review properly. The setup alone is very time consuming. I think we would need at least a full day with each one to make a fair comparison... as there are too many features to compare. I think it would boil down to comparing features and room EQ results, otherwise I think they all have about the same amp sound when played "Pure" or "Direct".

cavediver wrote: View Post
This looks like a great speaker evaluation. I'm looking forward to the results. I'm assuming you're evaluating the speakers by themselves full range without the addition of a sub? Also, I'd like to see a list of the music you're going to use for the evaluation.
Yes... full range and no sub. We will list the music as soon as we nail it down.

The_Nephilim wrote: View Post
I was wondering since you are using a Oppo and it proally has SACD/DVD-Audio capabilities are you going to play and multichannel disks either SACD or DVD-A??
I have a couple of each, but have not given it much thought since this is two-channel. However, it maybe that we can squeeze in some time for an SACD song. We try to streamline the listening process by having all of our music on a single source so that we don't have to get up and change media.

only126db wrote: View Post
I wonder if, it may sound crazy, but if internal cabinet design could be explored and commented on. I am sure most people would think when reading about opening up a set of $2000+ speakers to see its guts, I just find it interesting what the big players do to the guts, if they brace them, if they are double baffled, material thickness etc etc etc.
That would get rather time consuming and perhaps something that would be more suited for a reviewer who is going to have a set of speakers for 30 days or more with plenty of time to do so. Not a bad idea though.

gfrancis0 wrote: View Post
I would absolutely LOVE to see a blind comparison of the CABLES used in this test versus generic, if only a quick one. I notice that you are using XLR cables, which I always thought were only a benefit for longer runs between components, is that the case for this test? If you could at least test the speaker wires versus generic 12 gauge wire from Monoprice or whatever. Not sure how much of a premium the RAM cables command, but it adds up fast when you are running a 7.x or 9.x system. I realize that RAM is a sponsor, but I would hope that you could indulge us. Especially when it comes to digital cables, like HDMI, I fail to see how one cable could be better than another, so long as it actually works, since they transmit only 1s and 0s.
I have never been able to identify differences in cables... not saying they do not exist, but I have not heard any. It would have to be proven to me via a DBT to confirm it. The RAM cables are not very expensive (at least what I consider expensive), although they cost more than the Monoprice cables. The primary reason we suggest RAM is quality of build, quality of parts used, functionality and looks... and they are indeed a sponsor. There are some who are simply not going to buy Monoprice, but will quickly buy Blue Jeans cables because of the wire and connectors used... and the build quality appears to be superior. This is where we believe RAM will be of benefit... to those seeking that type of quality in a cable and having piece of mind about it. Compare RAM before you buy BJC or other similar cables.

I don't think we will have time to do a properly conducted DBT.

I believe one of the benefits of balanced cables is to reject noise and interference... perhaps a more stable signal to noise ratio is maintained, but technically I will defer to someone more in the know than myself.

RTS100x5 wrote: View Post
Coincidentally, I am neck deep in my first paying DIY speaker build for my #1 client.... I have invested apprx $2500 in drivers and xover components from PE... Wishing my design could be evaluated at your event (sigh) I was up til 2 am last night wiring the cabinets as Im pushing for a delivery and install next weekend... I have certainly learned alot from my time spent reading speaker reviews and studying the speaker build projects here at HTS.... Ill be posting up my project soon and am looking forward to reading the results of your evaluations.... Maybe the next trip could have a member sponsored to attend.... Thanks again for all you that contribute... I benefit much as do my clients, and it is highly appreciated... Thanks again Sonnie...
All hope is not lost... as the DIY speaker comparison is something we have discussed and hope to work out. We will continue to discuss it and see what we can eventually come up with. It is good to know you may be interested in having your speaker involved. We will definitely keep that in mind.

squish72 wrote: View Post
I'm mostly looking forward to the $20,000 two channel setup since all of these are simply a dream for me, I might as well dream BIG!
I am most definitely looking forward to this system as well. I have heard it and it is astounding to say the least.

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post #123 of 1088 Old 10-19-13, 11:53 AM
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Re: The Official $2,500 Speaker Evaluation / Home Audition Event

It WOULD be neat to be able to attend that, indeed. I have an HTIB system that meets my needs, but having something like those would be awesome - wish I could afford something like all that.
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post #124 of 1088 Old 10-19-13, 11:55 AM
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Re: The Official $2,500 Speaker Evaluation / Home Audition Event

Wow, I'm green to the gills. I have heard a few of these speakers but have not heard the Oppo 105 yet. I guess I have to live vicariously through all that attend this event. I was hoping there might be a Goldendear tower in the mix this evaluation. Oh well, I know all will have a good time! Looking forward to hearing the results.
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post #125 of 1088 Old 10-19-13, 11:56 AM
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Re: The Official $2,500 Speaker Evaluation / Home Audition Event

I want to extend my thanks and appreciation to HTS for this outstanding event and to the members involved, Sonnie, Wayne, Leonard and Joe. I had the pleasure of getting to know Joe (ALM Family) since he first came to HTS, I was selling an amp (which I regret), no just kidding, he was so courteous and such a friendly guy and I know how much he appreciated the condition of the amp and made that known to me on several occassions, great guy as well as all the staff here at HTS. This place was my first home and always felt welcomed and people seemed to actually care what I had to say, that doesn't happen at a lot of other forums. I am also extremely pleaseed with the $1000 shootout as my speakers were chosen. More forums should follow the lead of HTS and offer a wonderful and informative place to spend some time. Well done guys with the $2500 comparison, is it true that the ARX5 will also be there? This what I heard. Thanks again to all whom have made my feel at home here at the Shack. I look forward to the results of this event, take care my friends.
Best Regards, Jeffrey

Last edited by needspeed52; 10-19-13 at 12:09 PM. Reason: spelling
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post #126 of 1088 Old 10-19-13, 11:59 AM
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Re: The Official $2,500 Speaker Evaluation / Home Audition Event

i think one of the most interesting things about this multi-speaker review is that all these speakers offer something different and will appeal to a wide audience. I also think that when you get to this price range, there certianly arent any losers, there are just varying degrees of winners.

A quick look at the speakers reveals so much about each thats different

Emerald Physics - open baffle 2.5 way design with 15" woofers and a compression tweeter with 12" waveguide, completely unique to me.

Dynaudio - classic minimalist design outside, 3" voice coils on the woofers in a 2-way design(the only 2-way design using a simple 1st order crossover) and a soft dome

Magnepan - a full range ribbon speaker... if im understanding that right? very interesting.

Martin logan - electrostat speakers, with 8" woofer. that appears not to use a crossover

Paradigm - another minimalist design in a 2.5 way speaker but uses metalized drivers with popularity that probably unmatched

SVS - a 3-way speaker with a unique cabinet design involving an 8" woofer and dual 6.5" mids, soft dome tweeter... a company whose fame comes from their awesome subwoofers.

in some ways a few of these speakers are similar, but they are all still very different. I cannot wait to see what the reviewers think of each speaker. As a Dynaudio owner, i hope to see them do well, but the competition is VERY tough.

good luck guys and have fun.

Dynaudio Focus 260, Focus 210C, DM2/6
Marantz SR7007, NaimUniti2, Pro-ject 2xperience, Naim Stageline N
Oppo BDP-103, Hsu VTF2.4 subwoofer
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post #127 of 1088 Old 10-19-13, 12:00 PM
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Re: The Official $2,500 Speaker Evaluation / Home Audition Event

I wish to second the idea of DIY HT speaker systems with maybe the cost constraint being the factor.

Maybe covered elsewhere but in a multi channel setup of HT interested also in differences in seating position and how that affects performance. If you optomize around the center seat that can be a lonely place

Basic suggestion is if you have the listeners move positions side to side and up and back a bit to see how sensitive each speaker system is. Part of the voting could be ease of setup and how easy it is to get good sound at every seating position. Power response and phase control are key to this from my experience.
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post #128 of 1088 Old 10-19-13, 12:08 PM
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Re: The Official $2,500 Speaker Evaluation / Home Audition Event

Wow, what a great looking room! I'm glad to see an "evaluation" done in a properly treated and measured room! (with the graphs to prove it! LOL). I'm looking forward to seeing people's thoughts on the speakers. I myself am looking for a decent upgrade to my Home Theater Speakers, and while I might have the finely tuned and measured room, I'm close! So it's good to see that your evaluation can be in near ideal setup to I know if I were to purchase speakers, they are a known good commodity and it's other areas in my setup that need addressing.

I also wish I could hear that two channel setup...I'm a fan of separate 2 channel setups, and have a hand built SET powering a separate pair of speakers in my theater, with the same Oppo BDP-105 as a source! So I'm looking forward to seeing how you set that up and what your impressions are in a room treated and setup for theater (As mine is as well).

Great thread!
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post #129 of 1088 Old 10-19-13, 12:08 PM
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Re: The Official $2,500 Speaker Evaluation / Home Audition Event

I like the idea of a speaker evaluation rather than a shootout. Looking forward to the results.
What I also like is the idea of converting a 2 car garage into a home theater.
Will work on the wife...
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post #130 of 1088 Old 10-19-13, 12:09 PM
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Re: The Official $2,500 Speaker Evaluation / Home Audition Event

Since starting in 1977, the Danes at Dynaudio have learned a thing or two about building great speakers. There are some fairly positive reviews about the Dynaudio DM3/7. Some of its strengths include build quality, finish, low end response and efficiency. I'm looking forward to the results.
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