Anyone use Pioneer speakers with a half heigh 50W Marantz receiver? - Page 3 - Home Theater Forum and Systems - HomeTheaterShack.com

Old 11-10-13, 08:13 AM
Elite Shackster
Charlie

Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 2,539
My System
Re: Anyone use Pioneer speakers with a half heigh 50W Marantz receiver?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...20%20%20%20%20

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc..._-82780027-L0B

Switch to these speakers and you don't have to worry about it, plus in my opinion they sound better.
chashint is offline

Old 11-10-13, 07:26 PM Thread Starter
Shackster
Harry Muscle

Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 77
Using math to figure out how loud my speakers would be?

Over the last few days I've been trying to determine whether my proposed 50W receiver (Marantz NR1603 or similar) would be powerful enough to drive the Pioneer SP-FS52 tower speakers I'm hoping to get. The majority of the answers seemed to have been yes, maybe, and no ... so I'm still trying to figure things out and I decided to turn to my good friend math to solve the problem.

However, since I'm not an acoustic expert I wanted to get feedback on this to make sure I'm not making some stupid assumptions or mistakes.

So here goes the math:

The speakers have a 87db sensitivity at 2.83V and are 6ohms. That means that they produce 87db at 1m when being driven with 1.33W (2.83V @ 6ohms = 0.47amps | 2.83V * 0.47amps = 1.33W). Doing some wonderful logarithmic math we see that going from 1.33W to 50W increases our sound output by 15.75db to 102.75db. However, that's at 1 meter away. I will be sitting 8 feet away or 2.43 meters. Again doing some math we figure out that this increase in distance will drop our db by 7.7db to 95db. Now assuming the exact same sound is being played by both left and right speakers we add 3db to the total volume bringing us to 98db.

So in the end I know that if I put 50W of power into these speakers I will get 98db from them at my sitting distance. Does all this make sense?

Now to figure out if 98db is loud enough without a db meter

Thanks,
Harry
Harry Muscle is offline
Old 11-10-13, 08:17 PM
HTS Hillbilly

I'm a redneck!

Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: L.A. (Lower Alabama)
Posts: 22,554
My System
Re: Anyone use Pioneer speakers with a half heigh 50W Marantz receiver?

I can tell you that during our \$1,000 speaker evaluation event, we had two speakers that did not do well with the 100 watt per channel amp we had... and those two speakers had 86dB and 88dB sensitivity. We did not have enough power for them when we cranked them up to slightly above moderate listening levels.

95dB is pretty loud... and as I stated early on... you should be fine if you don't plan to play music very loud, but if you do plan to play music at louder volumes... if you like to crank it up a bit, then you are probably going to be clipping the amp in the Marantz, and/or underpowering the speakers. It is a risk not worth taking IMO, BUT ONLY if you are planning to play loud music, don't expect to be able to turn it up very loud.

There are quite a few other options out there that you shouldn't have to even consider this questionable pairing. Have you heard the AJ speakers and do you know you will like them? Is there a particular reason you need a half height receiver?

Cedar Creek Cinema

PremierHomeAudio: Denon, Marantz, Onkyo, Yamaha, Sony, Pioneer, Def Tech and more. Shoot me a PM!
Sonnie is offline
Old 11-11-13, 02:35 PM
Elite Shackster

Jack

Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Siesta Key, Florida
Posts: 8,111
Re: Anyone use Pioneer speakers with a half heigh 50W Marantz receiver?

Hello,
I honestly do not think that would be enough power personally. Granted, if the preferred listening levels are far enough below reference it should not be an issue. Also, when factoring everything in, are you planning and or accounting for the use of a subwoofer? Having a subwoofer handle frequencies below 80hz takes quite a strain of the AVR.

While I am quite fond of the Pioneers, I do recommend them most to those where music takes close to an equal footing to HT. I am decidedly on that end of things using speakers that can certainly be argued are music centric.
Cheers,
Jack

HT
Speakers: Martin Logan Vantage (Mains), Martin Logan Stage (Center), Martin Logan Vista (Surrounds), Martin Logan Montages (Surrounds) Hsu Research VTF-15h MK2, Martin Logan Descent i (Subwoofer)
Amplification: Aragon 8008bb, Parasound HCA-3500, Parasound HCA-2205 AT, Parasound HCA-1000a
AVR/SSP: Denon AVR-4520CI
Electronics: OPPO BDP-93
Gaming Consoles: Sony PS4, Xbox 360 S (250 gb)
Display: Panasonic TC-P65ZT60, Sony KDL-55EX500, Sony KD-34XBR910
Jungle Jack is offline
Old 11-11-13, 02:53 PM
Elite Shackster
Charlie

Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 2,539
My System
The math is correct.
Good job not to start at 1w, sometimes I wonder if speaker companies are trying to be accurate or sneaky when they use 2.83v on the spec sheet.
Here's one more thing to consider, Pioneer specs the speaker at 130 Watts max. Even if you had the additional power that's only a little more than 3dB additional SPL.
Speakers suffer from compression so chances are you will already be near or at the speaker's maximum useful SPL with the 50w AVR.
Maybe someone else knows the actually max SPL the speaker is capable of.
chashint is offline
Old 11-11-13, 03:00 PM
Elite Shackster

Tony

Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Edmonton, Alberta, Can
Posts: 14,816
My System
Re: Anyone use Pioneer speakers with a half heigh 50W Marantz receiver?

Quote:
chashint wrote: View Post
Maybe someone else knows the actually max SPL the speaker is capable of.
That question can't really be answered, you put that speaker in a bathroom and 50 watts will be plenty to fill it with ear bleeding levels. Put that same speaker in a large living room and good luck with that same amount of power. I can also be certain that that receiver won't come close to pushing 50 watts. Much more like 30 at best.

Home theater:
Onkyo 805, Yamaha YDP2006EQ, Samson Servo 600 amp
3 EV Sentry 500 monitors across the front, 4 Mission 762i's Surrounds, SVS PB13U sub, Panasonic BDT220, Harmony 1100, Nintendo WiiU
Panasonic PT-AE8000 on a 120" 2,35:1 fixed screen

Living room system:
Sherwood/Newcastle R972, Mission 765's, SVS SBS02's, A/D/S MS3u sub, Yamaha YDG2030EQ
Yamaha KX-393 Tape deck, CDC 805 CD changer, Panasonic BD60, Sony turntable PS-T20
Panasonic TC-P50ST60, HD-PVR & WDTV Live, Harmony 900

tonyvdb is offline
Old 11-11-13, 05:28 PM
Elite Shackster
Charlie

Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 2,539
My System
Quote:
tonyvdb wrote: View Post
I can also be certain that that receiver won't come close to pushing 50 watts. Much more like 30 at best.
Its spec is 50w 2 channels driven.
Without measured data to the contrary I don't see how you can arbitrarily knock it down 40%.
chashint is offline
Old 11-11-13, 10:43 PM
Senior Shackster

Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Texas
Posts: 630
Re: Anyone use Pioneer speakers with a half heigh 50W Marantz receiver?

The Marantz receivers tend to be more efficient than a lot of receivers

The Pioneer towers were measured to be 86 db sensitive - they are not 84 db
Also, they stay above 6 ohms across the frequency range - if not playing at
reference levels - then they should sound pretty good for you.

Also, looking at HTD Level Two towers is a good option.

Who or Where, is The Way, Truth and Life?

Speakers - MB Quart VS05, Boston VS260, Snell K7
Subwoofer - Mordaunt Short Aviano 7
Receiver - Tascam PAR-200, Pioneer VSX-30
zieglj01 is offline
Old 11-12-13, 03:06 PM
Senior Shackster

vann_d

Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Denver
Posts: 887
My System
Re: Anyone use Pioneer speakers with a half heigh 50W Marantz receiver?

I have a Marantz slimline (1603 I think) and, for a casual living room system, it is fine and it has better aesthetics than most full size receivers. I've used it with Klipsch RB-15 bookshelf speakers and Infinity Primus P52 bookshelf speakers. It will pump out more than enough SPL to fill the living room during normal TV viewing and background music levels. I've not tried to use it to reproduce a true cinematic experience in the living room but it is not intended to be used in a serious home theater. If you are going to use it in a casual setup, I would not hesitate to recommend it.
vann_d is offline

 Bookmarks

 Tags 50w , figure , half , heigh , loud , marantz , math , pioneer , receiver , speakers

Message:
Options

## Register Now

Random Question
Random Question #2

User Name:
OR

## Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.