Dolby Atmos is coming Home! - Page 7 - Home Theater Forum and Systems - HomeTheaterShack.com

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post #61 of 115 Old 07-11-14, 06:48 PM
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Re: Dolby Atmos is coming Home!

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Is this not unusual in it self?
Nope, just Dolby doing a good job of coordinating a product roll-out.

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post #62 of 115 Old 07-11-14, 06:50 PM
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Re: Dolby Atmos is coming Home!

Great job! Cudos to them.
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post #63 of 115 Old 07-14-14, 08:33 AM
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Re: Dolby Atmos is coming Home!

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Only as a last resort, for consumers who can't or won't mount speakers above. Traditional in-ceiling or on-ceiling speakers are still Dolby's first recommendation for Atmos.
Andrew Jones said in this podcast that he actually preferred reflected speakers to in-ceiling speakers when he heard the original Atmos home demo, which was why he designed his Atmos enabled speakers as reflectors. If the ceiling was at 8', I'd tend to agree, the 30 degree wide-band directivity of most speakers would create a fairly tiny footprint, where reflected speakers could create a footprint twice as large and cover more listening positions. Apparently, Dolby has specified a directivity index for Atmos reflected speakers to keep the direct path below the reflected one.

Yes, vaulted/sloped/cathedral ceilings complicate things, but may not completely eliminate reflected speakers from the mix.
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post #64 of 115 Old 07-14-14, 11:07 AM
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Re: Dolby Atmos is coming Home!

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Andrew Jones said in this podcast that he actually preferred reflected speakers to in-ceiling speakers when he heard the original Atmos home demo, which was why he designed his Atmos enabled speakers as reflectors.
Let's not conflate his subjective preference with objective superiority.

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post #65 of 115 Old 07-15-14, 12:57 PM
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I couldn't get the podcast to load...
I hope one of you guys can help me with something. I'm feeling like a moron, cause I'm struggling with how they're gonna throw sound from point A(speaker) to point B(ceiling) to point C(ears), without me hearing point A. Is it phase shifting, mind control, Star Wars technology, megatron, snake oil bath... Or some totally rudimentary principle I've overlooked? The last is just as plausible as any, but I'm struggling with the concept. When treating side reflections, you absorb the 2nd sound source(wall), but even if I wanted it to appear as if the sound were coming from the side wall,(in a traditional install), and not the speaker itself, how could that be made to happen? I'm not saying it couldn't be convincing. But could someone lay out the nuts and bolts for me?
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post #66 of 115 Old 07-15-14, 02:33 PM
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Re: Dolby Atmos is coming Home!

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I couldn't get the podcast to load...
I hope one of you guys can help me with something. I'm feeling like a moron, cause I'm struggling with how they're gonna throw sound from point A(speaker) to point B(ceiling) to point C(ears), without me hearing point A. Is it phase shifting, mind control, Star Wars technology, megatron, snake oil bath... Or some totally rudimentary principle I've overlooked? The last is just as plausible as any, but I'm struggling with the concept. When treating side reflections, you absorb the 2nd sound source(wall), but even if I wanted it to appear as if the sound were coming from the side wall,(in a traditional install), and not the speaker itself, how could that be made to happen? I'm not saying it couldn't be convincing. But could someone lay out the nuts and bolts for me?
I have reservations about this process as well. I think, though, that they're relying on a couple of things.

1) The dispersion of the speaker firing at the ceiling is specified by Dolby, as I understand it, so that the direct sound from that speaker is attenuated quite a bit at the listening position (which should be way off axis).

2) When the ear/brain perceives the same sound coming from two different locations at different times (difference in milliseconds or tens of milliseconds), it tends to assume that the sound that is louder is the source, not necessarily the one that gets there first. There's a name for this phenomenon, but I can't remember for sure what it is. Perhaps the precedence effect? Edit: This information is not right -- see next post

So, if the sound from point A in your example gets to the listener first, but is several dB lower than the sound coming from point B, the perception at point C will be that point B is the source, not point A

Clear as mud . . . And a little bit of conjecture and educated guessing on my part.

Having said that, it seems like a compromise to me in many ways, and I would not rely on it myself. I'd be putting speakers on the ceiling.

Last edited by bkeeler10; 07-15-14 at 02:40 PM. Reason: Correction
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post #67 of 115 Old 07-15-14, 02:37 PM
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Re: Dolby Atmos is coming Home!

And it looks like I have the precedence effect backwards. The sound that arrives first limits our ability to hear other signals within about 40 ms of the first arrival. Even if they are louder (within limits of course).

So much for my theory
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post #68 of 115 Old 07-15-14, 03:01 PM
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Re: Dolby Atmos is coming Home!

Higher frequencies, which are the ones reflecting off the ceiling, are more directional. Lower frequencies, which will radiate off axis from the speaker, are less directional. You're more likely to localize the higher frequencies above you than lower frequencies coming from ear level.

They seem to also be processing the virtual height signal with Dolby Elevation to further give the impression of sounds above you. It's like the kind of virtualization that makes a pair of TV speakers sound further apart than the physically are, but in this case it is to virtualize sounds vertically rather than horizontally.

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post #69 of 115 Old 07-15-14, 05:41 PM
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Re: Dolby Atmos is coming Home!

I still think the actual ceiling speakers will be the way to go. Jon (Chane) has mentioned that he might be able to produce a speaker for ceiling duty that would timber match his Arx's. If he can do it with a small box, it will be a must have (if the technology of Atmos prooves to be as good as we are hoping).
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post #70 of 115 Old 07-16-14, 12:33 AM
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Re: Dolby Atmos is coming Home!

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And it looks like I have the precedence effect backwards. The sound that arrives first limits our ability to hear other signals within about 40 ms of the first arrival. Even if they are louder (within limits of course).

So much for my theory
I'm old-school, so in my head the precedence effect is called the "Haas Effect" though the term is out-dated. Yes, you had it backwards...mostly. You can beat the precedence effect at its own game when the second arrival is hotter than the first by a certain ratio.
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