Onkyo Hits the Summer with High-End Gear (TX-NR3030, TX-NR1030, PR-SC5530) - Page 4 - Home Theater Forum and Systems - HomeTheaterShack.com

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post #31 of 101 Old 07-09-14, 03:03 PM
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Re: Onkyo Hits the Summer with High-End Gear (TX-NR3030, TX-NR1030, PR-SC5530)

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tonyvdb wrote: View Post
THX is still meaningful. Onkyo has always done much better in bench tests and particularly the Ultra 2 certification is not easy to achieve. Onkyo has had it's HDMI board issues but their amp section has always been the cream of the crop.
Granted, Ultra2 is not easy/cheap to achieve. It's also about 3000cu/ft spaces and larger where the expensive and difficult aspects of U2 are all in the power amp section.

From the THX site (--with my comments):

The Benefit Of THX Certified Receivers

Crisp, clear sound fills your room: THX Ultra2 Plus, THX Select2 Plus and THX I/S Plus certification categories deliver amazing performances based on your room size.
--Select2 and below is easy many AVRs to hit. Just because they don't try doesn't mean they can't do it. Except for the somewhat questionable dynamic headroom spec, it's not hard to hit U2 power specs with higher end AVRS, and easy with separates. Much of the power specs were created decades ago with this was much more of an issue, and home cinema audio wasn't well understood. Unless you're in a 3000cu/ft space, it probably doesn't matter much.

Powerful studio volume: Set your THX Certified receiver to 0 on the volume dial, and experience the exact Reference Level volume used in the movie theater.
--This happens anyway Audyssey cal and most other auto-cal systems.

Effortless performance: THX performs more than 2,000 Bench Tests, to ensure that your receiver plays effortlessly with plenty of power and low distortion in your home theater.
--Again, U2 is hard to meet, but mostly unnecessary. Yes, entry-level and mid-level AVRs might not do as well. But unless you're at reference level a lot, and most listeners are 8-10dB below that all the time, it really doesn't matter much.

Loudness Control: THX Loudness Plus lets you catch every detail of a surround sound mix when the volume is lowered.
--Duplicated, actually improved upon with Audyssey Dynamic Volume and Dynamic EQ, as well as Dolby Volume.

Easily mix and match brands: With a single standardized bass configuration, you can easily and confidently use any THX Certified product together.
--Huh? I haven't found THX AVRs mix any better or worse with other products. THX used to make a bit of an issue about device control compatibility, now that's gone out the window too.

Otherwise, the THX specific features like re-EQ (a mostly confused and dead issue now), decorrelation (hasn't been necessary since DD 5.1), and the above mentioned volume adjusters are duplicated by others.

Funny thing, THX Ultra2 specs mean a LOT more for speakers, but are probably even more rare than in AVRs. Speaker design issues and applications that THX addresses have not changed in 20 years since Home THX was conceived, but they are mostly still ignored today. Of course, they pretty much nuked their own specs with Select...so...oh well.
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post #32 of 101 Old 07-10-14, 01:57 PM
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Re: Onkyo Hits the Summer with High-End Gear (TX-NR3030, TX-NR1030, PR-SC5530)

Wow this is just crazy. Granted, I do spend hours playing with audessey before getting satisfactory results but when its dialed in its among the best. I did like dynamic EQ until I realized it was collapsing the sound stage and adding harshness, and since I added acoustic panels I'm just fine with the flat curve. Onkyo may have seen all the threads about the software pains and realized most happy people are using outboard processors. I bet the majority of these buyers (not us) never take the mic out of the box.

DIY Dedicated Screening Room:/5-6 Person (1 row) Capacity; Double Layer 5/8 DW & Green Glue Sandwich Construction; 5.2 + Heights; Mains: Aperion Audio Grand Verus Bookshelves; Center:Aperion Grand Verus); Surrounds:Polk RC85i In-walls; Heights: Polk MC65 In-walls; Subsual DIY Dayton UM 15s tuned to 20hz in 6.2 ft^3 Enclosure; Projector:Epson UB5010; Screen: Elite Screens Sable 120" Fixed; Receiver: Onkyo TX NR3009; Outboard Amp:: Inuke 3000 DSP (for Subs); Sources: PS3; HD-DVD.
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post #33 of 101 Old 07-10-14, 02:16 PM
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Re: Onkyo Hits the Summer with High-End Gear (TX-NR3030, TX-NR1030, PR-SC5530)

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Wow this is just crazy. Granted, I do spend hours playing with audessey before getting satisfactory results but when its dialed in its among the best. I did like dynamic EQ until I realized it was collapsing the sound stage and adding harshness, and since I added acoustic panels I'm just fine with the flat curve. Onkyo may have seen all the threads about the software pains and realized most happy people are using outboard processors. I bet the majority of these buyers (not us) never take the mic out of the box.
If the majority of buyers never take the mic out of the box, then the number of people using outboard processing is miniscule, not enough to drive a product feature decision.

If anyone actually reads the quick setup graphical instructions they'll run a basic audyssey cal. Far from everyone, but the purchase of a mid to high-end AVR usually indicates a geek, and he would run the cal. Low end, not so much.
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post #34 of 101 Old 07-10-14, 02:50 PM
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Re: Onkyo Hits the Summer with High-End Gear (TX-NR3030, TX-NR1030, PR-SC5530)

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If the majority of buyers never take the mic out of the box, then the number of people using outboard processing is miniscule, not enough to drive a product feature decision.

If anyone actually reads the quick setup graphical instructions they'll run a basic audyssey cal. Far from everyone, but the purchase of a mid to high-end AVR usually indicates a geek, and he would run the cal. Low end, not so much.
You would be surprised.. lots of folks will buy high end (brick and mortar) and are completely clueless. Just like people that buy high performance sports cars (and paid extra for the track package) that will never see track time. Onkyo is probably looking at what move in numbers though - most likely the lower end gear. So the mid level and especially the flagships don't make up for the lions share. Then of what's left, there is us and then those that couldn't care less if onkyo had ypao stamped on the faceplate. Then among us (a very small population mind you ) has moved to outboard or are ready to make the switch - those of us sticking it out have resorted to all sorts of witchcraft and rituals to run the 8 pint measurement. So onkyo is like: why license a product that will not get used by the people who actually care about when the majority of my money comes from the clueless?

Obviously my jibber jabber is pure crazy talk but I cant wrap my head around why onkyo would try to pass off a surround channel eq on what it labels its flagship items. Crazy!!

DIY Dedicated Screening Room:/5-6 Person (1 row) Capacity; Double Layer 5/8 DW & Green Glue Sandwich Construction; 5.2 + Heights; Mains: Aperion Audio Grand Verus Bookshelves; Center:Aperion Grand Verus); Surrounds:Polk RC85i In-walls; Heights: Polk MC65 In-walls; Subsual DIY Dayton UM 15s tuned to 20hz in 6.2 ft^3 Enclosure; Projector:Epson UB5010; Screen: Elite Screens Sable 120" Fixed; Receiver: Onkyo TX NR3009; Outboard Amp:: Inuke 3000 DSP (for Subs); Sources: PS3; HD-DVD.
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post #35 of 101 Old 07-10-14, 02:59 PM
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Don Draper wrote: View Post
...those that couldn't care less if onkyo had ypao stamped on the faceplate. !!
Hilarious!
I agree. Flagship+accuEQ= dingy!(boat)
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post #36 of 101 Old 07-10-14, 03:08 PM
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I'm of the opinion that most people shelling out $500 and up for a receiver are going to be pulling that mic out of the box and running the calibration. I'm also of the opinion that Denon and others that offer Audyssey are fist pumping the air with Onkyo's decision. Not to say that Audyssey is the end all be all but it's my preferred room correction software that I've personally used. YPAO and MCACC have a happy customer following as well as the camp that prefer EQ'ing themselves without the help of room correction software. I'm puzzled by this decision by Onkyo.
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post #37 of 101 Old 07-10-14, 03:16 PM
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Re: Onkyo Hits the Summer with High-End Gear (TX-NR3030, TX-NR1030, PR-SC5530)

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I'm of the opinion that most people shelling out $500 and up for a receiver are going to be pulling that mic out of the box and running the calibration. .
Maybe I was a little harsh there, but I think the folks spending $500 truly don't care what brand of room correction they are getting (even if they do use it). I haven't used ypao in a while but I didn't like what it did when I used it. Seems that it was averaging vs addressing critical room issues. What I did love was the graphical representation it showed of the work it did. I agree with the competition fist pumping. Until I am completely comfy with outboard I can't imagine jumping the audyssey ship after trying the rest. If the next iteration has graphs, my onkyo is in the trash. I imagine by then they will have seen the error of their ways though.

DIY Dedicated Screening Room:/5-6 Person (1 row) Capacity; Double Layer 5/8 DW & Green Glue Sandwich Construction; 5.2 + Heights; Mains: Aperion Audio Grand Verus Bookshelves; Center:Aperion Grand Verus); Surrounds:Polk RC85i In-walls; Heights: Polk MC65 In-walls; Subsual DIY Dayton UM 15s tuned to 20hz in 6.2 ft^3 Enclosure; Projector:Epson UB5010; Screen: Elite Screens Sable 120" Fixed; Receiver: Onkyo TX NR3009; Outboard Amp:: Inuke 3000 DSP (for Subs); Sources: PS3; HD-DVD.
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post #38 of 101 Old 07-10-14, 03:57 PM
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Re: Onkyo Hits the Summer with High-End Gear (TX-NR3030, TX-NR1030, PR-SC5530)

I found this..what gives:




AccuEQ
AccuEQ optimizes surround-sound and two-channel audio to suit your listening space. In particular, AccuEQ extracts the best possible performance from your front speakers to make stereo listening more dynamic and exciting. The system analyzes speaker setup and room acoustics from one listening position (which simplifies the calibration process) and optimizes frequency response and output levels for maximum clarity.

DIY Dedicated Screening Room:/5-6 Person (1 row) Capacity; Double Layer 5/8 DW & Green Glue Sandwich Construction; 5.2 + Heights; Mains: Aperion Audio Grand Verus Bookshelves; Center:Aperion Grand Verus); Surrounds:Polk RC85i In-walls; Heights: Polk MC65 In-walls; Subsual DIY Dayton UM 15s tuned to 20hz in 6.2 ft^3 Enclosure; Projector:Epson UB5010; Screen: Elite Screens Sable 120" Fixed; Receiver: Onkyo TX NR3009; Outboard Amp:: Inuke 3000 DSP (for Subs); Sources: PS3; HD-DVD.
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post #39 of 101 Old 07-10-14, 04:15 PM
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Re: Onkyo Hits the Summer with High-End Gear (TX-NR3030, TX-NR1030, PR-SC5530)

I'm not here to defend or criticize Onkyo's decision, but I just don't think that many people outside the "enthusiast" circle care about room correction in their HT. Of all the people I know who own an AVR with room correction capability, none of them have actually set up the mic and done the calibration. This includes guys that are tech savvy and put time into researching their gear (and are aware that the calibration/room correction features are there). I have also generally observed that they will set their speakers and sub down where it's convenient and never move them again. Everyone's circle of friends is different I guess, but nobody I know outside the forum could care less about room correction.
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post #40 of 101 Old 07-10-14, 04:35 PM
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Re: Onkyo Hits the Summer with High-End Gear (TX-NR3030, TX-NR1030, PR-SC5530)

Peter, I agree with you there.

I have a cousin who never buys anything other than Sony receivers. He is on his third Sony after the other two failed and I tried to convince him to try something else but another Sony is in his rack. Im still on the same Onkyo receiver during the entire time hes been through the three.
Some people just dont care.

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Onkyo 805, Yamaha YDP2006EQ, Samson Servo 600 amp
3 EV Sentry 500 monitors across the front, 4 Mission 762i's Surrounds, SVS PB13U sub, Panasonic BDT220, Harmony 1100, Nintendo WiiU
Panasonic PT-AE8000 on a 120" 2,35:1 fixed screen

Living room system:
Sherwood/Newcastle R972, Mission 765's, SVS SBS02's, A/D/S MS3u sub, Yamaha YDG2030EQ
Yamaha KX-393 Tape deck, CDC 805 CD changer, Panasonic BD60, Sony turntable PS-T20
Panasonic TC-P50ST60, HD-PVR & WDTV Live, Harmony 900

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