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ElitePRO-60X5FD and PRO-70X5FD Discussion Thread

519K views 3K replies 144 participants last post by  g997 
#1 ·
The Elite PRP-605XFD and PRO-70X5FD.

Intelligent Variable Contrast
RGBY+Y Pixel Color Technology
Precision Color Plus Pixel Technology
Gen-Ten LCD / UV2A Brightness
FluidMotion Smoothness
Full Array LED Backlighting
Local LED Dimming

Kevin Miller's Review.
"The PRO-60X5FD, a full array LED backlit LCD panel with Local Dimming Technology, produces superior blacks to the vaunted reference Pioneer Elite panels, and is definitely one of the best performing most color accurate flat panel displays available today."

This is my 1st post so I'm unable to list any URL's but I just thought I'd post a few pointers to get the conversation going. If you find any new news or professional reviews on this display please post it here. Additionally if you own the Elite or plan on getting one I'd love to here what you have to say, thanks.


CNET Settings:

Below you'll find the settings we found best for viewing the Sharp Elite PRO-60X5FD in a dim room via the HDMI input at 1080p/24 resolution. Your settings may vary depending on source, room conditions, and personal preference. Check out the Picture settings and calibration FAQ for more information.
http://news.cnet.com/8301-17938_105-9996461-1.html

--Picture Settings menu

AV MODE: MOVIE THX
Intelligent Variable Contrast: Local Dimming On
OPC: Off
Backlight: +1
Contrast: +32
Brightness: +1
Color: 0
Tint: 0
Sharpness: 0

--Advanced sub-menu

C.M.S. -Hue
R: 0
Y: +3
G: +4
C: +2
B: -3
M: +3

C.M.S. -Saturation
R: +3
Y: -2
G: -1
C: +1
B: +1
M: 0

C.M.S. -Value
R: +2
Y: +2
G: 0
C: -12
B: +3
M: -2

Color Temp sub-menu:
Color Temp: Low [grayed out when 10 Point is "On]

[10 Point Setting Off]
R Gain (LO): +1
G Gain (LO): -5
B Gain (LO): -3
R Gain (HI): +2
G Gain (HI): -4
B Gain (HI): -4

[10 Point Setting On]
Position +1: R Gain +2, G Gain 0, B Gain 0
Position +2: R Gain 0, G Gain -4, B Gain -3
Position +3: R Gain 0, G Gain -5, B Gain -5
Position +4: R Gain 0, G Gain -3, B Gain -2
Position +5: R Gain 0, G Gain -4, B Gain -4
Position +6: R Gain 0, G Gain -3, B Gain -5
Position +7: R Gain -2, G Gain -5, B Gain -5
Position +8: R Gain -1, G Gain -6, B Gain -6
Position +9: R Gain 0, G Gain -5, B Gain +5
Position +10: R Gain 0, G Gain 0, B Gain -1

Motion Enhancement: 120Hz Low
Quad Pixel Plus: Off
Active Contrast: Off
Gamma Adjustment: 0
Film Mode: Off
Digital Noise Reduction: Off
Monochrome: Off
Range of OPC: [any]
 
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#2,097 ·
Theatredaz said:
Well maybe I'm not sitting far back enough...how far are you sitting from the set...anything closer than 6ft and the poor transfer in the scene is more noticable...than sitting 10FT-12FT back from the display etc.
I sit 7-8', depending on which seat I take. I got closer to the screen and don't see that effect. I'm sorry but even wuth the film grain, I've got a pretty sharp, stable picture thru this scene and the rest of the movie. Something just doesn't right with the way your picture looks. Is anyone here else having that weird issue?
 
#2,098 · (Edited)
Yes my display has the flashing effect in dark scenes, the bluray review actually quickly states how it drops in resolution when there are dark scenes and was due in part that the film used in some scenes was sephia in tint etc

Otherwise the scene where captain america symbol is seen underneath the ice was amazingly sharp and has some amazing photo realism. The review goes on to say that the rest of the movie during bright scenes was just stunnning (as I've yet to watch more into the movie due to the flashing) ( which I found reaches deeper into the start of the Movie.)

What is there to really like about the movie> it can't get sharp detail right in some bright scenes...the film grain becomes more apparent throughout the movie without being overly distracting, but I've checked out the bluray review of men in black 2 and it was stunning to see there was little film grain but...amazing photo realism to the film transfer ...I really would wonder if plasma can render the film grain less apparently than LCD does...and have scenes be less distracting.
 
#2,099 ·
Theatredaz said:
Yes my display has the flashing effect in dark scenes, the bluray review actually quickly states how it drops in resolution when there are dark scenes and was due in part that the film used in some scenes was sephia in tint etc

Otherwise the scene where captain america symbol is seen underneath the ice was amazingly sharp and has some amazing photo realism. The review goes on to say that the rest of the movie during bright scenes was just stunnning (as I've yet to watch more into the movie due to the flashing) ( which I found reaches deeper into the start of the Movie.)

What is there to really like about the movie> it can't get sharp detail right in some bright scenes...the film grain becomes more apparent throughout the movie without being overly distracting, but I've checked out the bluray review of men in black 2 and it was stunning to see there was little film grain but...amazing photo realism to the film transfer ...I really would wonder if plasma can render the film grain less apparently than LCD does...and have scenes be less distracting.
Again, film grain, and drop in frame rate is one thing, but what you see (and we) can see in your videos of your set is another. I cannot stress enough that my set doesn't look anywhere near that bad in that scene. It doesn't pulsate with that white grain look at all. If my Elite did that, I would be exchanging asap. I wish others could check it out also, and chime in here.
 
#2,100 ·
I'm not really posting this to complain about the Elite> I feel this anomoly can be resolved via firmware update...since it only happens in extremely poor low level lighting in scenes that were'nt rendered properly by the camera or something...absolutely no other movies or SD/HD broadcasts does this ever occur...if...I find that in a year that I'm seeing it more way more often in movies...then my Elite Warranty(insurance policy @ 5 Years exchange ~via Delear store I purchased it from) will kick in and I can have my entire set replaced.

* Again I could blame the settings I have as brightness and contrast are increased.
 
#2,104 ·
* As of now this issue with the set is closed...if it occurs again in an enitrety in a movie then I will consider what to do at that point...in the meantime my next plan for the set is to run a High power gaming card into the set and use the set for what I always wanted it for GAMING!!!! Enjoy your sets guys.
 
#2,105 ·
A note to all Elite owners.. Make it a primary objective to call this week to Elite to demand a cyan fix.. Based on my discussions today, it appears they're laid back on the issue. Not to mention, one of the supervisors at Elite indicated a couple months ago that a calibrator got excellent results even with the issue. This may be true, but with that kind of attitude, they may not feel obligated to fix it. I made a call this morning and demanded that one of the supervisors to call me back. You have to get passed the first wave of call screeners by asking for a supervisor, such as Will. This is the only way we'll get an answer or at the very least to get them off their butts to work on a fix, if even possible. If you don't have the number handy, please call 855-ELITE-01.
 
#2,107 · (Edited)
I think part of the problem is that many people who own the ELITE don't see this as much of a problem including myself. We see a great picture with in fact very accurate color when compared to even the reference KURO Plasma display, most of us are very content. If a fix ever does happen I'd rather they take their time and do it right, I don't want it fixing one thing only to mess up another!:nono:
 
#2,106 ·
DJ Mike Fury said:
A note to all Elite owners.. Make it a primary objective to call this week to Elite to demand a cyan fix.. Based on my discussions today, it appears they're laid back on the issue. Not to mention, one of the supervisors at Elite indicated a couple months ago that a calibrator got excellent results even with the issue. This may be true, but with that kind of attitude, they may not feel obligated to fix it. I made a call this morning and demanded that one of the supervisors to call me back. You have to get passed the first wave of call screeners by asking for a supervisor, such as Will. This is the only way we'll get an answer or at the very least to get them off their butts to work on a fix, if even possible. If you don't have the number handy, please call 855-ELITE-01.
Will do, also I will voice concern about the pulsing/flickering, as it remains a bug issue for a lot of owners.
 
#2,109 ·
The degree of the problem after the sets are calibrated just does not seem to be that significant a problem to me. People have spent a lot more for many years to get really high end sets that don't do nearly as well. Perspective....
 
#2,111 ·
Most would consider not having a fix within 7 months, after Sharp promised at the October 2011 Shootout to release one within 4 weeks, as "taking their time".

It might be pretty embarrassing for Sharp not to have the fix in place at the May 2012 Shootout being held in less than 2 weeks.

They shouldn't get a pass just because the display has the ElitE moniker on it.
 
#2,112 ·
I think it's obvious originally they had thought the issue was something that could be fix rather easily or quickly. This is why it's a smart idea to never promise a specific fix date for something unless you can deliver the goods on time. This will be another learning lesson but nothing that hasn't happened before.
 
#2,114 · (Edited)
Called Elite support today, and spoke with Will. Came away with the impression that these really are top-tier support people, that they genuinely care about the product and, and about their customers.

Here's a summary:

- They are expecting our calls this week .... so be nice to them ;-)
- Their engineering team is actively working on the pulsing fix.
- Their engineering team is "aware" of the cyan issue, and are definitely still working on it. No promises on that front.
- Their engineering team actively reads the boards, looking for feedback. The more concrete we can be about mentioning issues on specific BD titles, scene numbers, etc, ... the better. That information is useful.
- I told him my expectation was that Sharp would follow through on public promises made from Sharp upper management about providing the update. Sharp fully awknowledges that a public commitment was made.
- I relayed my personal story, where, after noting this very public commitment (in the face of an absolute public-relations nightmare on avsforum at the time), I proceeded to purchase the TV based on this commitment.
- There is a lot of email traffic between the Sharp dev team and Will's support group regarding these two issues.
- Sharp support is "caught in the middle", they reflect feedback, but obviously they can only indirectly influence the dev team.
- Calling puts pressure on the dev team, in the sense that Will can reflect customer feedback.
- I asked if the color issue was a "systemic architectural flaw involving Y-pixel/Quattron tech", or whether this is amenable to a firmware "color decoder" fix. I didn't expect to receive a definitive answer, nor does Sharp customer support really know the answer to this; however, what Will did say was rather interesting: "I've never seen any reports indicating that this isn't fixable" (paraphrasing here). Interpret that as you will ;-)
- I mentioned that I believe the last firmware updated changed a dampening factor which slows down the time it takes to change/flip the backlight state. This means that the "halo effect" tends to be more exaggerated/pronounced since it persists longer due to the change in dampening factor (e.g., longer state change latency). Will said he understood exactly what I was referring to.
- I told Will that this was a fantastic product and that I am very pleased with my purchase. That said, I also told him I expected the fixes to be put in place given a/ the premium price of the product, and b/ the public commitments that have been made.

A firmware update in time for the next shootout would be a true marketing coup for Sharp. Think about the positive impact that would make.

cheers
--craig
 
#2,115 ·
Quote: "I believe the last firmware updated changed a dampening factor which slows down the time it takes to change/flip the backlight state. This means that the "halo effect" tends to be more exaggerated/pronounced since it persists longer due to the change in dampening factor (e.g., longer state change latency). Will said he understood exactly what I was referring to."

This could end up being a trade off in the end, you fix one issue only to settle for another. :rubeyes:
 
#2,119 ·
I think I would stick to CNET, Home Theater magazine (scroll down to the high end models), or one of the many other trade publications that rate it the best.

As Buzz said, PCMag should stick to PCs.

And as Leonard stated earlier:

The degree of the problem after the sets are calibrated just does not seem to be that significant a problem to me. People have spent a lot more for many years to get really high end sets that don't do nearly as well. Perspective....
This is from a gentleman who was in the industry for many years.

Whether they fix it or not, it will still be the best high end flat panel on the market.
 
#2,120 ·
This is from a gentleman who was in the industry for many years.

Whether they fix it or not, it will still be the best high end flat panel on the market.
I agree totally. Until equal or better black levels become available, and correct color throughout the Rec.709 Gamut is verifiable, the Elite will be the king of the flat panels.
 
#2,131 ·
I think the main reason Elite will drop the 4th sub-pixel ^^ is to make room for more pixels in the panel.

-Robert
 
#2,134 ·
Just an update, as I've been out of touch lately; fortunately, since the firmware update 2-3 weeks back, the bottom half of my television screen has not gone completely haywire. However, the halo-ing, ghosting effect is just driving me up the wall. I see it on all types of feeds, hi-def and standard DVD definition, as well. As an example, I was just watching an episode of Star Trek: The Next Generation called "Tin Man," and in the scenes where Data is walking around with his tricorder inside the alien vessel (which is quite dark), there was an enormous halo around his head and the tricorder. I'm glad to hear that I'm not the only one seeing this issue on this TV; hopefully we'll get a "fix" so that I won't be driven completely wild.

On the other hand, what's interesting is that I don't really notice the color problems mentioned on this thread at all. I'm really glad I don't! :) Take care, guys!

Best wishes,
Kent
 
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