gray balance before taking photos and GTI N8

**mechman** · **06-27-07, 03:56 PM**

Quote:

kenyee wrote:

If you take pictures in RAW, it's probably better to do it in post. If you're shooting JPEG, use manual white balance.
Calibration stays the same as long as the lights stay the same. Some cameras have multiple custom white balance memory, so you can use one for your studio, etc. and just switch w/o doing the color balance again (though most people will color balance for a series of shots).

BTW, for amusement, try color balancing for interior incandescent lighting and then take a picture inside that includes an outside window...blue sunlight is pretty cool :-)

Thanks Ken! That's what I figured, just needed someone to back it up for me. I'm not so sure about shooting in RAW format though. I wasn't very happy with the conversion to jpeg that Photoshop did. And jpeg is what Photobucket wants so...

grrrrr. I'll have more time to experiment later after I figure out the nuances of shooting in RAW with the whibal card. Shooting jpeg seems much easier...

I'll shoot for the blue sunlight next chance I get.

**JimP** · **06-27-07, 09:22 PM**

mech

I think it would be more accurate to shoot in raw and white balance it photoshop because that would take into account color shifts by strong color in other parts of the image.

For convenience, jpeg would be better.

For white balancing on the Direct TV bar, try a manual white balance using the white area to the right of the "DirectTV" logo. To my eye the picture looks a tad warm which is confirmed by taking some measurements. A manual white balance on this other white block might get you a tad closer.

As for the red rope lights around the frame, aaargh.

......by the way guys, does anyone know why sometimes I get the instant email notifications and other times I don't??

**JimP** · **06-27-07, 09:32 PM**

This is the area that I'm referring to.

**mechman** · **06-27-07, 10:17 PM**

Quote:

JimP wrote:

mech

I think it would be more accurate to shoot in raw and white balance it photoshop because that would take into account color shifts by strong color in other parts of the image.

For convenience, jpeg would be better.

For white balancing on the Direct TV bar, try a manual white balance using the white area to the right of the "DirectTV" logo. To my eye the picture looks a tad warm which is confirmed by taking some measurements. A manual white balance on this other white block might get you a tad closer.

As for the red rope lights around the frame, aaargh.

......by the way guys, does anyone know why sometimes I get the instant email notifications and other times I don't??

I'll do it in RAW then and use the whibal card. I'll have to set up the DVE disk and use it though. I know I can get a white image off of one of their calibration screens. I thought it was a tad warm too. The rope lights are actually white LEDs. As to the email notification... I don't know. I'll bring it up though.

As always thanks Jim!

**Sonnie** · **06-27-07, 10:48 PM**

Quote:

JimP wrote:

......by the way guys, does anyone know why sometimes I get the instant email notifications and other times I don't??

This works fine for me and all of my subscribed threads and we haven't had any other complaints recently... that I know of anyway. You do know that you will only get one notification even if there are several replies. Also the notifications go out in batches, so if you visit the forum and a thread you are subscribed to between batch notifications, you won't get a notification. Other than this, I'm not sure what it could be. I promise, we are not pickin' on ya...

... but if it's a forum problem, everyone should experience it.

**JimP** · **06-28-07, 12:54 AM**

Hi Sonnie,

Putting my detective hat on, how often does the system send out emails once a new post is made? For instance, does the system cycle every 30 minutes to see if a post is made and if so, then sends out emails?

**Sonnie** · **06-28-07, 10:44 AM**

I'll see if I can find out... it may be based on a number to send as well.

**mechman** · **07-03-07, 10:09 PM**

OK I've taken my reference images, which I'll post below. There are 6 photos two each of High, Medium, and No ambient light. One set when there was filtered light coming in through the shades and one set taken when it was dark. Top three with filtered outside light coming in - bottom three with no light filtering in through the windows. From left to right, they'll be high ambient, med ambient, no ambient. All shot in RAW format and white balanced using the Whibal card in Photoshop cs2.

Those should be OK for white/gray balancing all future photos taken in the same light conditions, right? Ken? JimP? Do you think I should have taken a closer shot of the Whibal card? Let me know what you two, and anyone else for that matter, think.

For those wondering that's Designer White laminate on the left and Fashion Grey laminate on the right (my screen).

**JimP** · **07-04-07, 12:11 AM**

mech,

In Photoshop CS2, rawconverter, were you using the eye dropper tool located third from the left in the upper tool bar?

If you were and the whibal card was larger than the tool, you should be O.K. To my eye, the grayish whibal card look a little different from one shot to the next.

Is is apparant though that darker areas of the screen are influenced more by ambient lighting than the lighter areas.

**mechman** · **07-04-07, 12:34 AM**

JimP,

Yes, but I was just using the <shift> key to get at it. I did notice when I zoomed in that the RGB numbers varied slightly as I moved it around.

**JimP** · **07-04-07, 12:43 AM**

Mech,

That's not the eyedropper tool thats 3rd item from the left. That's the fourth item that gives you the RGB numbers.

With the eyedropper that's third from the left enabled, you move the eyedropper to what should be a neutral gray and click it. That color balances your photo based on the area that the eyedropper covers.

Are we talking about the same thing??

**mechman** · **07-04-07, 09:19 AM**

I'm basically doing it the way it was shown in the videos from the Whibal manufacturer. I open up Adobe Bridge, browse to the Raw files, double click on the one I want to balance, and this opens up Photoshop with the "workflow" window. On a side note, I'm not all that fluent in Photoshop so please bear with me! In that workflow window if I hit the <shift> key it will switch to the white balancing tool. In the upper right of this pane there's the color histogram and above that are the RGB numbers. It doesn't matter which tool I use, I get the RGB numbers for where the cursor is. Hopefully that's a bit more clear to you, cause it's still a wee bit muddy to me!

**JimP** · **07-04-07, 10:01 AM**

mech,

Just did the routine in CS and it works fine. We're on the same page.

**mechman** · **07-04-07, 11:56 AM**

Jim,

What are you thoughts on using those particular shots as templates for white/gray balancing further screen shots within that type of ambient light?

**kenyee** · **07-06-07, 09:50 PM**

mech, those look good. Did you also lock the exposure on the camera (shutter/aperture/iso)? I noticed the white/gray don't look the same brightness in all pics, but that's probably what it should be. They do look properly gray to me (no weird coloration from the ambient light.
I should do the same with my setup so we can compare results now that I finally have a K10D and full manual control instead of using my F30 :-)

**mechman** · **07-06-07, 10:00 PM**

Quote:

kenyee wrote:

Did you also lock the exposure on the camera (shutter/aperture/iso)?

I don't think I thought of it there. I left it on auto. I do believe the iso was locked at 100 though. When I took my DW and FG shots I just had the iso locked as well. Because of the difference in ambient light I left the aperture at auto. It doesn't appear that they're over exposed much. It's kind of tough not to over expose when shooting a bright image in the dark!

**JimP** · **07-06-07, 11:54 PM**

Quote:

mechman wrote:

Jim,

What are you thoughts on using those particular shots as templates for white/gray balancing further screen shots within that type of ambient light?

Will work only up to a point. Strong color that takes up a good part of the screen will influence the rest of the picture. You'll be in the ballpark, but fine tuning will likely be necessary.

**mechman** · **07-07-07, 07:16 AM**

Jim,

That is not what I wanted to hear!!

When I finish up my first ones and I post them I'll pm you and Ken to have a look again.

mech

**JimP** · **07-07-07, 09:02 AM**

mech,

Don't feel too bad.

I just got finished replacing the window regulator in my Buick and the battery is dead.

**mechman** · **07-07-07, 09:12 AM**

Why can't things be easy all the time!!

**mechman** · **05-10-08, 11:29 PM**

Since we're talking about why screenies don't matter, I thought it would be good to bump this oldie but a goodie which explains some of the things you can do to get an accurate color balance in your photos. While I'm not a big fan of bumping threads for 'hearing one talk to oneself', I think this one deserves to stay fresh in everyone's memory.

**lcaillo** · **05-11-08, 06:46 AM**

Great point. The "screenies don't matter" idea is correct in many ways, but the fact is that they generate interest and people like to share them, and they are fun to share. They are useful for comparisons in the same image such as the screen materials, and for demonstrating artifacts and symptoms. A better understanding of how to do it right can make it more likely that they are useful. They are also more fun and more interesting when done well, and we know how most of us are crazy about finding better ways to do things.

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