Does the paint brand matter?

**Harry Muscle** · **07-05-07, 04:48 PM**

I've been doing tons of research lately for my new screen, so I hope no one minds that I'm asking more questions and some of them are all over the place while I try to piece everything together in my head.

The last thread I read was WBassett's thread about neutral grays and his awesome daytime shots are what I want

... however, I called my local Sherwin Williams store and I'm looking at almost $50 for a gallon of this stuff (if they came in 1/4 gallon sizes then the price would be just fine). I was hoping to spend a little less, especially since most of that paint will be wasted really (ie: wasted money). So I was wondering ... does the brand of paint matter or is it just the color of the paint? For example Benjamin Moore (which I can get locally in smaller sizes) has a color called WHITESTONE (2134-60), which has a RGB value according to www.easyrgb.com/matching.php of 201 204 204 which looks like a very slightly brighter version of the Gray Screen mentioned in WBassett's neutral gray thread. Could I expect similar results to what WBassett is getting for his ambient light viewing or are such results really tied to the paint brand and not just the color?

Thanks,
Harry

**Tiddler** · **07-05-07, 05:38 PM**

This is actually where it all started for me and trying to develop a custom tint for UPW that would be at least close to neutral. It is also what has inspired my recent exploration of the Behr sheens. Don't tell wbassett but I have been on a quest to make a cheaper more readily available Gray Screen knock off.

I'm not saying I have done it but I have certainly given it a good try. I would be very interested in seeing wbassett himself compare a similar shade of near neutral gray mixed up in Behr's UPW Flat Enamel to his Gray Screen. I suspect it would not be quite as good but I bet it would be pretty close.

**wbassett** · **07-05-07, 05:54 PM**

Quote:

Harry Muscle wrote:

I've been doing tons of research lately for my new screen, so I hope no one minds that I'm asking more questions and some of them are all over the place while I try to piece everything together in my head.

The last thread I read was WBassett's thread about neutral grays and his awesome daytime shots are what I want

... however, I called my local Sherwin Williams store and I'm looking at almost $50 for a gallon of this stuff (if they came in 1/4 gallon sizes then the price would be just fine). I was hoping to spend a little less, especially since most of that paint will be wasted really (ie: wasted money). So I was wondering ... does the brand of paint matter or is it just the color of the paint? For example Benjamin Moore (which I can get locally in smaller sizes) has a color called WHITSTONE (2134-60), which has a RGB value according to www.easyrgb.com/matching.php of 201 204 204 which looks like a very slightly brighter version of the Gray Screen mentioned in WBassett's neutral gray thread. Could I expect similar results to what WBassett is getting for his ambient light viewing or are such results really tied to the paint brand and not just the color?

Thanks,
Harry

True Value sells Winter Mountain by the quart for $7-$9 depending on your area. It actually lands inside the D65 circle and is the most neutral thing I have seen right off the shelf. Believe it or not it is actually more neutral than GTI's N8 paint, but GTI is still a very good color and close to D65 neutral shade.

Different paint manufacturers use different bases and some have more clay content than others. The higher the clay content usually the lower the quality. You want something that pours into the roller tray smooth and doesn't 'glop' out like I saw someone recently describe a paint they used. Now that doesn't mean you can't get a good screen coating with it, but it may be harder to work with and roll out smoothly.

As far as the questions, fire away. Everyone will do their best to answer you and help get you a solution you both like and feel comfortable building.

WhiteStone does look like a very close match to Gray Screen. I'll tell you why I went with it over Winter Mountain... it had me curious. The slight red deficiency can help out with incandescent lighting since that type of lighting source tends to lean a bit red/orange. From my testing is seems to help.

What types of finishes does Benjamin Moore have? If they have a matte finish jump on it if you can get a quart and don't have to buy a whole gallon. This may be another nice addition to the N8 grays.

**muzz** · **07-07-07, 10:40 AM**

Bill

I'm still using that Ben Moore- Pebble Beach we discussed-
They have matte and flat available- I bought a Qt..

For quick reference,here is the PM you sent me in regards to it:

"I couldn't find a match by name, only the number 1597. If that is the right code(EDIT-IT IS), it is in the DB as 200 204 203, and is pretty close to Gray Screen. It's a point high for green, but that should be able to be compensated for by taking green down on the projector end. Red is up a point too from GS, but a point difference is very very close and probably won't make a difference overall."

**wbassett** · **07-07-07, 04:27 PM**

Good to hear from you muzz.

Seeing that you're still using the Pebble Beach screen, what is your overall assessment now that it's been up awhile? With paints typically the image quality gets better once the paint has had a chance to fully cure. I'm assuming since this is still up you're please with its performance?

**muzz** · **07-07-07, 07:44 PM**

Good to see ya Bill, Thanks!

I think it performs pretty well for a quick 2 coats of Grey@ like $8, and 2 coats of Behr 780 Matte Poly@ like $16 (Qt.-OUCH). I DO think that I will be redoing it with the SAME Grey, but this time mixing the Pearl in with the poly (Todds experiments)...
Or something similar.

If you look at Todds swatches- side by side black/white(different mixes) stripes, you will see what I feel I see here, which is kinda grayish whites, the Pearl really seems to look ALOT more like WHITE, without losing alot of the good Grey attributes.

Folks that have seen it, think it looks marvelous, but I KNOW that the whites are a bit Greyish.

I'm watching the Ballgame right now(Red Sox @ Tigers), and while the Detroit uniforms are white LOOKING, I know that it is really a "Dulled"(for lack of a better word) White in reality.

Most folks would never know, and don't get me wrong, for $24 it looks fantastic, and I am happy i switched from the flat white I had before it.
But it IS a grey base, so whites will suffer a bit.

**wbassett** · **07-07-07, 08:31 PM**

Quote:

muzz wrote:

But it IS a grey base, so whites will suffer a bit.

Gray does require Lumens and color balance. If those two items are met you still can have white whites.

Todd has some really good methods and keep an eye on his new experiments and testing that he is doing. If you're happy now I am betting you will ecstatic with some of the new stuff he is working on... so definitely stay tuned!

**muzz** · **07-07-07, 08:46 PM**

I have plenty of Lumens(AX100U)... color balance...... Hmmmmmmmm well, it IS an LCD!! bahahaha
BTW, My Sharp DT-500 Bulb blew up at 650 hrs... during the Sox vs Yankees game.... **** yankees have been causing me grief ALMOST

my entire life!!

**Harry Muscle** · **07-07-07, 09:26 PM**

Quote:

wbassett wrote:

...

What types of finishes does Benjamin Moore have? If they have a matte finish jump on it if you can get a quart and don't have to buy a whole gallon. This may be another nice addition to the N8 grays.

Is a matte finish the same thing as flat? I checked out the Sherwin Williams website (doing research on the Grey Screen color) and the flatest finish I could find in the base you used is Matte. Also on the Benjamin Moore datasheet's the flat paint says that it dries to a matte finish ... so am I correct in assuming that flat and matte are considered the same sheen?

Thanks,
Harry

**Tiddler** · **07-07-07, 09:51 PM**

Matte vs Flat is a good question and I think it may depend on the company. Often matte is used to describe a finish that is fairly flat but is more washable. Therefore it may have some sort of clear matte filler so the surface is not quite so porous. It would stand to reason then that a matte finish is slightly different than a flat finish. As far as home decorating goes the difference is negligible, but for a projection screen it may be significant. Here are some comparisons from the behr Sheen thread to consider:

The Behr UPW Flat Enamel #1850 compared to the Behr UPW Flat #1050

Now here is the Flat Enamel 1850 vs UPW Flat Latex #1050:

Even swapping the panels still shows the #1850 to be brighter than the #1050.

This may only be true for Behr products though. Glidden products may differ as well as the terms used to describe the sheen. Unfortunately the only way to know is to try it. I have focused on Behr products because of their wide availability. Ti try to test all the paints out there would be an overwhelming task.

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