Now what? Please give comments

[Wayne A. Pflughaupt]

I've always thought that my ears are not very accurate in terms of sound level between two frequencies. Is there a way to measure it?

Yup. Go to Sonnie’s BFD Guide (see sticky thread on this Forum’s index page) and download some sine wave test tones. Burn to a disc and play back on your system. You’ll be able to easily discern volume differences between the various tones, especially where you currently have peaks vs. where you don’t.

I am still trying to decide if the BFD is worth it. Do you think it would be based on my current response?

Not sure I’m qualified to answer that, seeing as your curve isn’t all that bad. I’d say it depends on how picky you are about your sound. I am, but I’m also cheap. So you might eBay one, like I did. Typically they sell for $50-65. Hard to go wrong at that price, and you can always flip it if you aren’t duly impressed.

Regards,
Wayne

[angryht]

Yup. Go to Sonnie’s BFD Guide (see sticky thread on this Forum’s index page) and download some sine wave test tones.

Can't I just use the signal generator in REW?

but I’m also cheap

Me too.

So you might eBay one, like I did.

I will definately take a look. Thanks again.

[brucek]

Can't I just use the signal generator in REW?

Of course..........

brucek

[angryht]

Thanks.

[angryht]

ok. Here are my results (trying for a house curve without an EQ). The first graph is the sub turned up so 30 hz and 70 hz matched (I think) by ear. The second graph is the sub as flat as I could get it and the third graph is a compromise between the two. I took a few other measurements between but I liked the way the third graph looked so I stuck with it. Does it look better than the flat response? I will do some listening and let you know.

[angryht]

Well, I've watched (listened to) a few movies with the low end boosted (my last graph in the previous post). I am not sure I could tell the difference, most likely because the movies I've watched have been heavy on the dialog. I guess in my mind I am still struggling with the 'house curve concept'. I always thought the goal was to get as flat a response as possible. However, the idea that my ears don't 'listen' that way is quite interesting. Are there any other resources to go through to get a better handle on this?

[angryht]

I went back and read the house curve sticky at the beginning of the this area. The x-curve explained here: http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/1307-post3.html is -5 dB at 20 hz and 0 at 63 hz. Wouldn't the goal be to invert that with my response in my home theater? Shouldn't I just dial in a house curve of 0 dB at 63 hz and +5 dB at 20 hz, draw a straight line from point to point via the house curve funtion in REW and try to match that? Are movie theaters speakers responses set up to invert the x-curve so it 'sounds like' a flat response?

[angryht]

Here is the sub turned down a little bit more to try to match the house curve of 0dB at 63hz and +5dB at 20 hz. I would think this would be better to match the x-curve????? I suppose the big problem is still the big hump at 40 hz.

[Wayne A. Pflughaupt]

I always thought the goal was to get as flat a response as possible. However, the idea that my ears don't 'listen' that way is quite interesting. Are there any other resources to go through to get a better handle on this?

Probably not. I’ve found that Googling “house curve” doesn’t get you much. Haven’t tried any other search engine, though.

I went back and read the house curve sticky at the beginning of the this area. The x-curve explained here: http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/1307-post3.html is -5 dB at 20 hz and 0 at 63 hz. Wouldn't the goal be to invert that with my response in my home theater? Shouldn't I just dial in a house curve of 0 dB at 63 hz and +5 dB at 20 hz, draw a straight line from point to point via the house curve funtion in REW and try to match that? Are movie theaters speakers responses set up to invert the x-curve so it 'sounds like' a flat response?

The X-curve discussion was merely to show that movie industry uses a “house curve” for production as well as playback – i.e., in theaters. You don’t want that curve for your home theater. Movie theaters use the x-curve – not an inverted version of it.

Shouldn't I just dial in a house curve of 0 dB at 63 hz and +5 dB at 20 hz, draw a straight line from point to point via the house curve funtion in REW and try to match that? I would think this would be better to match the x-curve????? I suppose the big problem is still the big hump at 40 hz.

You can certainly try it, although many people prefer shelving at about 30 Hz, not a continuously-rising curve. See Part 1 of the house curve article.

This is all academic, until you get an equalizer. I lieu of that, I suggest setting your curve (which in your case means adjusting the sub up or down) with music as a starting point. That’s a good reference point, because it’s easy to tell when it sounds right because the bass blends with the rest of the signal. Get a good blend there, then try some action movies, not “dialog” fare. You may find you need to then turn it up the sub a little, but that should be about it.

Regards,
Wayne

[angryht]

Thanks again, Wayne, for helping me wrap my mind around this stuff.

Wayne A. Pflughaupt wrote:

Movie theaters use the x-curve – not an inverted version of it.

I'm not sure I understand. If that's the case wouldn't you want to try to match the response of the movie theater which would be just the opposite of putting in a house curve.

[Wayne A. Pflughaupt]

For one, a movie theater, even a small one, is many times larger than your room. Remember, different sized rooms require different curves.

That said, not sure how you arrived at the conclusion that the x-curve is the opposite of a house curve.

Regards,
Wayne

[angryht]

Wayne A. Pflughaupt wrote:

That said, not sure how you arrived at the conclusion that the x-curve is the opposite of a house curve.

I mean at the low end. The typical house curve is higher below the crossover point (~80 hz) and the x-curve cited in the house curve thread (shown below) drops below 63 hz.

[Wayne A. Pflughaupt]

The movie industry has their own version of what a house curve should be, that suits their purposes.

For instance, they may be reducing below 63 Hz to minimize low frequency bleed-through to adjoining theaters.

Again, the X-curve discussion was only meant to show that house curves are necessary both in production and playback. The X-curve itself is of no use in a home theater, unless one happens to prefer sagging lows and highs.

Regards,
Wayne

[angryht]

The X-curve itself is of no use in a home theater, unless one happens to prefer sagging lows and highs.

I guess that is where I get a little confused. I figured since the movies are mixed to the x-curve, that trying to match would be a good idea. Then I thought that since a house curve is boosted in the low end that it was trying to compensate for that drop.

Still a little confused but I think I am getting it.

[Wayne A. Pflughaupt]

Then I thought that since a house curve is boosted in the low end that it was trying to compensate for that drop.

Nope – the house curve is merely a compensation for your particular room – has nothing specifically to do with movies, actually, because you probably need one even if you only listen to music.

Regards,
Wayne

[angryht]

Thanks again, Wayne.

So, does that mean if a person listened to a speaker (and the speaker measured flat) in an anechoic chamber, it would sound good? And the only reason for the house curve is to compensate for the room acoustics?

[Wayne A. Pflughaupt]

So, does that mean if a person listened to a speaker (and the speaker measured flat) in an anechoic chamber, it would sound good?

Couldn’t say – I’ve never heard a speaker in an anechoic chamber.

And the only reason for the house curve is to compensate for the room acoustics?

Well, now you’re getting into areas I really don’t know much about. Acoustics has more to do with a room’s reverberation, or lack thereof, and perhaps treating to minimize the same, if needed. A house curve seems to be related primarily to the size of room, and when you include the mids and highs, your physical distance from the speakers. As I noted in Part 2 of the house curve article, I’m more familiar with the “how” than the “why.”

Regards,
Wayne