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post #621 of 1075 Old 11-08-13, 07:28 PM
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Re: The Official $2,500 Speaker Evaluation / Home Audition Event

wow look at the optimal placement so far on page one. Makes you wonder if there are any speakers "besides onwall in inwall" that sound good up close to a wall. The only one I can think of is perhaps the Kilpshorn in a corner
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post #622 of 1075 Old 11-08-13, 07:49 PM
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Re: The Official $2,500 Speaker Evaluation / Home Audition Event

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wow look at the optimal placement so far on page one. Makes you wonder if there are any speakers "besides onwall in inwall" that sound good up close to a wall. The only one I can think of is perhaps the Kilpshorn in a corner
LaScalas sound good against the wall.

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post #623 of 1075 Old 11-08-13, 08:12 PM
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Re: The Official $2,500 Speaker Evaluation / Home Audition Event

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Also Norah Jones CD Come Away With Me, has some good subtleties, have heard this on ML Vantages and sounded great.
Yes. I would sample anything Nora Jones just to hear that amazing voice. Everything else is just a bonus.
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post #624 of 1075 Old 11-08-13, 10:33 PM Thread Starter
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Re: The Official $2,500 Speaker Evaluation / Home Audition Event

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I have heard that this Album in SHM SACD is great, better than SACD + all the others Dire Straits Dire Straits, Making Movies etc.

I have the Brothers In Arms SACD and quite often use this as a reference.

I have heard that anything that Dire Straits Mark Knopfler has worked with has a generally very good sound (how true i don't know but have seen and heard this).

Also Norah Jones CD Come Away With Me, has some good subtleties, have heard this on ML Vantages and sounded great.
I listened to the Love Over Gold (Remastered) and was not even half as impressed with the quality of sound on it as I am with the Brothers In Arms MFSL SACD in Pure Audio mode. I don't know if my ears were stopped up or what. I will try again later to make sure.

Norah Jones is awesome... the entire album is good.


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wow look at the optimal placement so far on page one. Makes you wonder if there are any speakers "besides onwall in inwall" that sound good up close to a wall. The only one I can think of is perhaps the Kilpshorn in a corner
They all sounded good near the wall (some better than others), just not great. You lose that depth of soundstage when they are placed up close to the wall... and that is true of the Klipsch speakers too. Not everyone necessary cares about the depth of soundstage and perception of depth. If they get a wide soundstage, excellent imaging and clarity and either none or maybe a little bit of depth, they are sold, because it sounds very good. However, add to that the depth of soundstage and it adds another dimension. Once I heard it, there is no turning back... now I have to have it. Although those placements without much depth still sound good and would probably please quite a few people. The depth is like adding magic for me... it's my high, so to speak... and I want more of it.

With EVERY speaker we have listened to, we had to get the speakers on out into the room to get that depth. We don't too often hear it at the shows because most of them have their speakers up against a wall. Those that have them out into the room will usually be the ones that stand out the most for us. Danny with GR gets his out into the room... and look what folks are constantly saying about his rooms. There are a few others that get it right, but I honestly have no idea what some of those exhibitors are hearing. In many cases, if I could do no better than what they do with tens of thousands of dollars of equipment, I would not even bother setting it up.

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post #625 of 1075 Old 11-08-13, 11:29 PM
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Re: The Official $2,500 Speaker Evaluation / Home Audition Event

With dipoles, it's especially important because of the rear wave, the reflection of which must be sufficiently delayed. I was surprised to see that the 'optimal placement' for the 1.7s was only 5' off the front wall. My MMGs are 4' in a very nearfield setup in a bedroom, but my 3.7s are 9'9" off the front wall (in an approximate rule of thirds setup for both systems). Regarding the narrow sweet spot, you'd be surprised at the difference the wonderfully narrow ribbon tweeter makes in the larger Maggies. Your MLs address the issue by way of their 'curvilinear' design. The dispersion of the Magnepan ribbon tweeters is practically ideal (omni), which redresses that 'head in a vise' symptom you described quite nicely.

I've been extremely pleased with all of the MoFi and SHM SACDs I've purchased so far, but I also love the 5.1 (phantom center for me, though) presentation of 'Brothers in Arms' on the 20th anniversary Vertigo release. The SHM of the first Dire Straits album is fabulous.
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post #626 of 1075 Old 11-09-13, 12:06 AM
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Re: The Official $2,500 Speaker Evaluation / Home Audition Event

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With dipoles, it's especially important because of the rear wave, the reflection of which must be sufficiently delayed. I was surprised to see that the 'optimal placement' for the 1.7s was only 5' off the front wall. My MMGs are 4' in a very nearfield setup in a bedroom, but my 3.7s are 9'9" off the front wall (in an approximate rule of thirds setup for both systems). Regarding the narrow sweet spot, you'd be surprised at the difference the wonderfully narrow ribbon tweeter makes in the larger Maggies. Your MLs address the issue by way of their 'curvilinear' design. The dispersion of the Magnepan ribbon tweeters is practically ideal (omni), which redresses that 'head in a vise' symptom you described quite nicely.

I've been extremely pleased with all of the MoFi and SHM SACDs I've purchased so far, but I also love the 5.1 (phantom center for me, though) presentation of 'Brothers in Arms' on the 20th anniversary Vertigo release. The SHM of the first Dire Straits album is fabulous.
Great comments. We appreciate input from an experienced Magnepan user.

We definitely are in agreement that farther into the room is better with any dipole design, at least toward supporting that depth of soundstage effect. We have some detailed notes on the topic that I am hoping to have time to fold into the first post, or perhaps a separate discussion thread, once we get the individual writeups done. If I stopped to do that now, a certain someone in the state of Alabama would drop me in my tracks with his seldom-used death-ray stare. I have not witnessed it yet, and do not intend to!
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post #627 of 1075 Old 11-09-13, 12:11 AM Thread Starter
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Re: The Official $2,500 Speaker Evaluation / Home Audition Event


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post #628 of 1075 Old 11-09-13, 12:34 AM
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Re: The Official $2,500 Speaker Evaluation / Home Audition Event

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They all sounded good near the wall (some better than others), just not great. You lose that depth of soundstage when they are placed up close to the wall... and that is true of the Klipsch speakers too. Not everyone necessary cares about the depth of soundstage and perception of depth. If they get a wide soundstage, excellent imaging and clarity and either none or maybe a little bit of depth, they are sold, because it sounds very good. However, add to that the depth of soundstage and it adds another dimension. Once I heard it, there is no turning back... now I have to have it. Although those placements without much depth still sound good and would probably please quite a few people. The depth is like adding magic for me... it's my high, so to speak... and I want more of it.

With EVERY speaker we have listened to, we had to get the speakers on out into the room to get that depth. We don't too often hear it at the shows because most of them have their speakers up against a wall. Those that have them out into the room will usually be the ones that stand out the most for us. Danny with GR gets his out into the room... and look what folks are constantly saying about his rooms. There are a few others that get it right, but I honestly have no idea what some of those exhibitors are hearing. In many cases, if I could do no better than what they do with tens of thousands of dollars of equipment, I would not even bother setting it up.
Echoing Sonnie's thoughts, all of the evaluators agree that the depth of soundstage - especially when it has high acuity, meaning the sense of distance from the listener to each voice and instrument is crystal clear and could be measured accurately right down to the inch - is the "spark of life" for 2-channel listening, as far as we are concerned. We have heard soundstage depths in the range of 6 to 8 feet (LP is about 12 feet from the screen wall of the room, I believe) with each voice/instrument at its own depth/distance from the LP and each so clearly defined that you want to grab a tape measure or a pole and reach right out and poke it to see if there might actually be something physical there. Once that has been experienced, anything less is simply not satisfying.

We achieved this with three different sets of speakers in the $1K roundup in August, so it does not take thousands of dollars to get there. $1K would probably do it, selecting the right speakers and allowing a bit for some room treatment. Just curious, anyone remember which three speakers pulled it off back in August? I could tell you, but it might be fun to see who remembers what they were. If nobody gets it (or bothers to guess) I will post the answer tomorrow (Saturday - oops, that is today now) night. No peeking, let's see who remembers.
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post #629 of 1075 Old 11-09-13, 12:41 AM
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Re: The Official $2,500 Speaker Evaluation / Home Audition Event

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Yep, that's it.

Back to the writeups. Hint: It just MIGHT be that the first one is fairly close to being posted, and we just MIGHT be doing them alphabetically. Let's see, which letter comes first? A? Or was it S? Or maybe M? Gonna have to Google it!
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post #630 of 1075 Old 11-09-13, 12:44 AM Thread Starter
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Re: The Official $2,500 Speaker Evaluation / Home Audition Event

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We achieved this with three different sets of speakers in the $1K roundup in August, so it does not take thousands of dollars to get there. $1K would probably do it, selecting the right speakers and allowing a bit for some room treatment. Just curious, anyone remember which three speakers pulled it off back in August? I could tell you, but it might be fun to see who remembers what they were. If nobody gets it (or bothers to guess) I will post the answer tomorrow (Saturday - oops, that is today now) night. No peeking, let's see who remembers.
I know... I know!!!

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