Which subwoofers would you like to see being tested?

[enrique]

would like to see how the martin logan Grotto compares to others.

[paulspencer]

I'd like to see the Rythmik sub tested with different settings - same sub tested, just set to 20 Hz low damping - a better fit to HT and better for comparing to the other subs, esp. with distortion.

I'd also like to see AE speakers AV12 tested. A great bang for buck sub for HT.

I'm a little surprised not to see Shiva, Tempest or Avalanche DIY subs!

[tonyvdb]

I wonder if some testing could be done to A/D/S (Analog and Digital systems) I have a sub from them (MS3) that I bought 15 years ago and am still happy with it even though it was built for Music not Home theater use as they simply were not common then.

[paulspencer]

Ikka, kudos to you for providing such an awesome resource for the rest of us. It's a great deal of work you've done to put up these tests. I'm sure it's been said many times, but I want to add my appreciation.

[jasenj1]

Paradigm. They just released the DSP series which I believe replaces one or two of their other lines of subs. And they completely redid the PDR series.

- Jasen.

[alexadams77]

I don't know if this has been mentioned in previous posts or not, but I would like to see the actual db difference with running one sub (PB13/other) compared to running duals (2 x PB13/other). I've heard a lot of people mention that you'd only see roughly 6 db difference, but I'd like to see someone actually test this theory out. Or a link to the results if it's already been done.

[mike c]

alexadams77 wrote:

I don't know if this has been mentioned in previous posts or not, but I would like to see the actual db difference with running one sub (PB13/other) compared to running duals (2 x PB13/other). I've heard a lot of people mention that you'd only see roughly 6 db difference, but I'd like to see someone actually test this theory out. Or a link to the results if it's already been done.

those people would be correct.

AVTALK has done tests on dual CHT-R's compared to single CHT-R's

[avaserfi]

alexadams77 wrote:

I don't know if this has been mentioned in previous posts or not, but I would like to see the actual db difference with running one sub (PB13/other) compared to running duals (2 x PB13/other). I've heard a lot of people mention that you'd only see roughly 6 db difference, but I'd like to see someone actually test this theory out. Or a link to the results if it's already been done.

As Mike said those people would be correct, but more importantly than gaining more output is the fact that with proper placement and set up you will have a much better room response due to the nature of the waves and how they interact with each other.

[Ilkka]

ThomasV wrote:

Anything by the "new revolution" ED or Epik would be great.

Yes, both have really interesting new products. Unfortunately neither of them currently ships over seas. Also Epik's amplifiers are not 230V compatible.

Let's hope for a change.

[Ilkka]

paulspencer wrote:

I'd like to see the Rythmik sub tested with different settings - same sub tested, just set to 20 Hz low damping - a better fit to HT and better for comparing to the other subs, esp. with distortion.

Unfortunately I don't have that unit in my possession anymore, but I'll see what I can do. I did measure the frequency response using every possible setting (will post them soon) but not distortion.

20 Hz/low damping doesn't yet change the frequency response much. Only around 1 dB down at 20 Hz and 2 dB down at 10 Hz. I would recommend 28 Hz/low or 28 Hz/mid for a larger difference.

[Ilkka]

tonyvdb wrote:

I wonder if some testing could be done to A/D/S (Analog and Digital systems) I have a sub from them (MS3) that I bought 15 years ago and am still happy with it even though it was built for Music not Home theater use as they simply were not common then.

Sorry but I couldn't find a Finnish importer for A/D/S so it's pretty difficult to test them unless they agree to send me one directly from the factory. I can always ask though...

[Ilkka]

alexadams77 wrote:

I don't know if this has been mentioned in previous posts or not, but I would like to see the actual db difference with running one sub (PB13/other) compared to running duals (2 x PB13/other). I've heard a lot of people mention that you'd only see roughly 6 db difference, but I'd like to see someone actually test this theory out. Or a link to the results if it's already been done.

I have tested it indoors but not outdoors. It's actually quite trivial question. There's no doubt that the difference wouldn't be 6 dB when located near to each other (preferably no more than 1/4-1/3 wavelength of the crossover frequency, meaning ~1m/3-4' when using 80 Hz crossover).

[Ilkka]

avaserfi wrote:

As Mike said those people would be correct, but more importantly than gaining more output is the fact that with proper placement and set up you will have a much better room response due to the nature of the waves and how they interact with each other.

Actually it's not given that two non co-located subwoofers would always give a flatter FR. Depending of the room acoustics, getting a flatter FR may/will require some heavy subwoofer workout and also accurate measurements.

[bgilly]

Would it be possible to get some testing done on a SVS PC-16-46+.

I know many people have these because they wanted a bottom feeder with port area to boot....but I cannot find testing done ANYWHERE....especially by someone like you! I think I've read most every test and post you have out there....I'm a guy with a lot of respect for what you do.

Thanks

Brad

[mike c]

bgilly wrote:

Would it be possible to get some testing done on a SVS PC-16-46+.

I know many people have these because they wanted a bottom feeder with port area to boot....but I cannot find testing done ANYWHERE....especially by someone like you! I think I've read most every test and post you have out there....I'm a guy with a lot of respect for what you do.

Thanks

Brad

AFAIK, the 16-46 is not available in 220v which is why ilkka or avtalk hasn't been able to test them.

I don't know if SVS has finally been able to get a 220v 16-46 ready now with their new CE certification

[bgilly]

****...I wish we could have it tested...

[russ.will]

alexadams77 wrote:

I don't know if this has been mentioned in previous posts or not, but I would like to see the actual db difference with running one sub (PB13/other) compared to running duals (2 x PB13/other). I've heard a lot of people mention that you'd only see roughly 6 db difference, but I'd like to see someone actually test this theory out. Or a link to the results if it's already been done.

I don't know if you'll find this much use, but I tried exactly this here. It obviously doesn't have Ilkka's sophistication of measurement

I found that orientation of co-location in the vertical plane actually had more of an effect on the smoothness of response than any other arrangement, but that is with respect to the somewhat smaller (on average) European room.

As regards the SPL gains, 6dB co-located and 3dB for just having a pair in the room was as expected. What wasn't expected was that the gain decreased with increasing frequency until it was negligable at 80Hz+.

Russell

[Ilkka]

mike c wrote:

AFAIK, the 16-46 is not available in 220v which is why ilkka or avtalk hasn't been able to test them.

I don't know if SVS has finally been able to get a 220v 16-46 ready now with their new CE certification

Actually the 16-46PC+ was available in 230V back when SVS was directly selling subwoofers to us Europeans. And I know that there are at least three of those in here Finland.

SVS isn't going to import it to Europe anymore though. Only three cylinder models will be available here: 25-31PCi, 20-39PC+ and PC13-Ultra.

I'm not sure if I will be able to test the 16-46PC+, but I could make some educated guesses about its performance since I have measured the 25-31PC+ and the 20-39PC+.

[bgilly]

I own one and I'd like to see some tests to see how it stacks up to the new PC-13 and PB-13 in 15hz mode.

Which would be better....native 16-46+ with 3 ports firing or a PB or PC-13 with 2 ports firing in 15hzmode...

Wouldn't more port area play an important role?

[Ilkka]

bgilly wrote:

I own one and I'd like to see some tests to see how it stacks up to the new PC-13 and PB-13 in 15hz mode.

Which would be better....native 16-46+ with 3 ports firing or a PB or PC-13 with 2 ports firing in 15hzmode...

Wouldn't more port area play an important role?

The PB/PC13-Ultra without a doubt would be quite a lot stronger (also lower distortion) at every frequency. The new woofer is so much better and stronger than the Plus woofer that even the lesser port area wouldn't affect that much. Of course a native 15-16 Hz tuned Ultra would be even stronger down there but that would require even larger enclosure with those 3.5" ports.

Also don't forget that the new Ultra is much stronger at higher frequencies (at and above 20 Hz) than any of the older Plus cylinders. While it's nice to have good output down to the teens but actually it's the higher frequencies that make you say wow! When you tune a subwoofer lower, you will inevitably sacrifice the output at higher frequencies compared to a higher tuned subwoofer.

[bgilly]

well here is where I am at with my subwoofer situation now.

Last Feb I got the 16-46+ with plans for a 2nd because I'm a bass head. The actually Specs and performance on the Ultra were unknown at that time even by the great guys at SVS...

I like the sub, but just wish I had more BASS in the 20-40hz region than I do. I knew when I bought it that I was going to be missing out on some bass, but I know a 2nd one would solve that headroom issue.

Then I think why spend 950 on a 2nd one when I could spend 1300 on the Ultra-PC and just tune it to 15hz. People have been raving about the 10 and 15hz modes of the Ultra and how great it sounds when tuned to these settings. I just cannot belive the number of amazed people...

So....In your opinion....Should I:

A. Buy a 2nd 16-46+ to pair with my current one and never look back. Would this give me 115-120db cleanly from 15hz to 80hz... (right now I'm pretty clean in that range averaging about 107-109db..)

B. Buy a PC-13 and pair it with my current sub and have the best of both worlds....I would have the 16-46+ which I could leave in native or tune it down to 12hz....which could be the sub I use to dig really deep, while the Ultra could be in 20 or 15hz mode and I could use it to really kill the rest of the freq range...maximizing its amazing freq and spl ability. I could colocate or use different placement and it wouldn't even look funny since they are both PCs and they are identical in height and width.

Thanks ahead of time for your input....I know you don't know me that well, but I really value your input and have read a ton of your information here, on HTspot, and AVS...

oh the choices we have in this fun land of HT!!!

[SteveCallas]

I'm not Ilkka, but two 16-46+s definitely won't get you clean 115-120db capability from 15-80hz, not even close

[Exocer]

Audiophile Liquidator has the NHT W2 (comes with two 14" cubes each housing their own 12" driver) on clearence for $250, I wonder how those perform.

[bgilly]

SteveCallas wrote:

I'm not Ilkka, but two 16-46+s definitely won't get you clean 115-120db capability from 15-80hz, not even close

Wouldn't the room size dictate that more than anything?

I'm talking about a 2000cubic foot room...

[SteveCallas]

Not so much room size as distance you sit from the sub.