Which subwoofers would you like to see being tested?

[Ilkka]

Which subwoofers would you like to see tested?

I'd be interested in your thoughts and requests regarding which subwoofers you'd like to see tested.

Please post your ideas and requests right here on this thread.

Though do notice that most of the subwoofers come from the end-users, so we're mainly limited to what people have. Some manufacturers may be willing to lend their subwoofers but that is more of an exception than a rule.

[Ilkka]

Originally posted by aceinc

Has anyone done any testing on the Direct Servo Sub(s) from Rythmik Audio...

I am about to build a 3 cubic foot sub for HT/Music, and I have been impressed with their concept for some time, but I haven't found much in the way of independent testing data on their subs. If you know where I can find objective data, I would be appreciative.

Paul

[Ilkka]

Originally posted by Exocer

This is a very old review, but its a review.
http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volum...er-4-2004.html

The current kits are capable of more output.

[Ilkka]

Ilkka wrote:

Originally posted by aceinc

Has anyone done any testing on the Direct Servo Sub(s) from Rythmik Audio...

I am about to build a 3 cubic foot sub for HT/Music, and I have been impressed with their concept for some time, but I haven't found much in the way of independent testing data on their subs. If you know where I can find objective data, I would be appreciative.

Paul

Hi,

I haven't seen any GP tests done on Rythmik Audio products. I know a guy who has their direct servo sub here in Finland, but sadly he hasn't offered it for a testing (he lives quite far away from me though). I'll of course promise to measure one as soon as it's possible.

[Eddie Horton]

I'd like to see the HSU VTF-3HO and Mark Seaton's upcoming SubMersive.

[adogand6kids]

I would love to see you test the Rhythmic and also any of the servo-controlled subs on the market. Would also like to see a few more tests on sealed enclosure subs.

[Geoff Gunnell]

Well, adding to the VTF-3 HO and SubMersive that Eddie mentioned, hopefully in the next 60 days we'll have the AV123 BMF and MFW-15 and the Seaton modded UFW-12, and the new Ultra driver from SVS.

[SteveCallas]

I'd like to see the SVS 16-49 Plus in all three tuning varieties, sealed, and also in 12hz tune with the highpass bypassed if possible.

I'd like to see the SVS PB10 both ported and sealed.

I'd like to see a PR sub with relatively low tuning (any model will do).

I'd like to see a small DIY sealed sub using a quality 15" driver that is EQ'd flat.


If you could do any of those, that would be awesome, and I would appreciate it very much. I believe you already have tested a 16-49 Plus and a pb10 both ported and sealed, but I can't find it anywhere.

[Vader]

I would like to see tests for the SVS 20-39 PC+ (12.3 driver) in all three tunes. I currently run duals, and the closest I have been able to find are your results for the PB12-Plus/2 20 Hz (Plus 12.3) - AFAIK, that is basically the same thing (am I correct on this??). I would really like to see the differences that would result between the box design vs the cylinder. Also, I have heard that the tuning point of the 20-39 is actually closer to 23 Hz, and that the THD is better in the lower tunes (16, 12 Hz).

[F1 fan]

BAG END Infra 12

PMC TLE 1

SVS SB12

[Exocer]

I'll throw the JL Fathom 113 into the mix. Looks like a killer sub with killer pricetag to match. I'd like to see you test it and bring some truth to the displacement of its driver, many people seem misinformed in that area.

[khellandros66]

Definitives SuperCube line, I'd like to put an end to alot of debate over whether or not they can make a good sub, I know the truth, just others need to know.

~Bob

[SteveCallas]

I'll throw the JL Fathom 113 into the mix. Looks like a killer sub with killer pricetag to match. I'd like to see you test it and bring some truth to the displacement of its driver, many people seem misinformed in that area.

I get the feeling this thing is pretty overhyped. There's a group at that other forum that likes to hype up and really get behind a new sub every 6 months or so, this is just the newest one on the list. Whenever these "awesome" subs get measured, they underwhelm, and that group stops singing its praises, ready to move on to the next one

[Exocer]

SteveCallas wrote:

I get the feeling this thing is pretty overhyped. There's a group at that other forum that likes to hype up and really get behind a new sub every 6 months or so, this is just the newest one on the list. Whenever these "awesome" subs get measured, they underwhelm, and that group stops singing its praises, ready to move on to the next one

I totally agree...this is precisely why I'd love to see Ilkka put it through it's paces...

Edit: from what i've seen it looks like a capable sub. rather than put it down i'd like to give it an honest chance. absolutely nothing about it's performance is suprising to me...considering what its working with. In a perfect world people would understand the shortcommings of each allignment, that way they'd understand how to properly interpret and compare output graphs.

[Ilkka]

adogand6kids wrote:

I would love to see you test the Rhythmic and also any of the servo-controlled subs on the market. Would also like to see a few more tests on sealed enclosure subs.

AV Talk has already measured pretty much every servo-controlled Velodyne on the market, so I won't bother doing them again. They also have Paradigm's servo subs, so Rythmik Audio's are the only ones left.

[Ilkka]

Geoff Gunnell wrote:

Well, adding to the VTF-3 HO and SubMersive that Eddie mentioned, hopefully in the next 60 days we'll have the AV123 BMF and MFW-15 and the Seaton modded UFW-12, and the new Ultra driver from SVS.

These all are going be very interesting subs, but as you say, they aren't released yet.

[Ilkka]

SteveCallas wrote:

I'd like to see the SVS 16-46 Plus in all three tuning varieties, sealed, and also in 12hz tune with the highpass bypassed if possible.

I'd like to see the SVS PB10 both ported and sealed.

I'd like to see a PR sub with relatively low tuning (any model will do).

I'd like to see a small DIY sealed sub using a quality 15" driver that is EQ'd flat.

How about a true LLT instead of SVS 16-46 Plus? You'd be happy to know that I've created quite a LLT buzz here in Finland. It started when another guy found out that there is a sonotube factory in Finland and the prices are pretty cheap. ATM I know at least 5-6 on going LLT projects. TC-Sound's TC-2000 sale of course didn't hurt either. We'll see what happens.

If you could do any of those, that would be awesome, and I would appreciate it very much. I believe you already have tested a 16-46 Plus and a pb10 both ported and sealed, but I can't find it anywhere.

I've already done the PB10 ported and sealed, I just have to put them back online. Though notice that PB10 has a non-bypassable HPF at ~19 Hz.

[Ilkka]

Vader wrote:

I would like to see tests for the SVS 20-39 PC+ (12.3 driver) in all three tunes. I currently run duals, and the closest I have been able to find are your results for the PB12-Plus/2 20 Hz (Plus 12.3) - AFAIK, that is basically the same thing (am I correct on this??).

I did the 20-39PC+ (12.1 and 12.2) last fall, and Plus/2 (12.1 and 12.3) this spring, so I'm not sure if I will do the 20-39 PC+ (12.3). 12.2 and 12.3 are so close it doesn't really make sence.

Dual single driver cylinders/boxes and single dual driver box aren't the same thing. Their native tunings, enclosure volumes and port areas are different. This leads to noticeable differences in performance. Dual cylinders/boxes are much stronger at the low frequencies than dual driver boxes.

I would really like to see the differences that would result between the box design vs the cylinder. Also, I have heard that the tuning point of the 20-39 is actually closer to 23 Hz, and that the THD is better in the lower tunes (16, 12 Hz).

Although I haven't compared them directly, I can say that there isn't noticeable difference between the box and cylinder desing.

Tuning frequency of the 20-39PC+ (no port plugs) is around 20.5 Hz.

THD is lower at the low frequencies due lower tuning frequency. At higher frequencies max SPL and THD will go worse when you tune it lower. That is how a basic ported system works.

[Ilkka]

Exocer wrote:

I'll throw the JL Fathom 113 into the mix. Looks like a killer sub with killer pricetag to match. I'd like to see you test it and bring some truth to the displacement of its driver, many people seem misinformed in that area.

I already asked the Finnish importer about them, but unfortunately he didn't know when the 240 V versions would be ready. He had asked it directly from the JL Audio a few months ago, but they couldn't give a definitive answer either.

I know that JL Audio will be posting a complete and thorough GP measurement results for all their new subs quite soon. So that's our best bet at the moment.

[SteveCallas]

Ilkka wrote:

How about a true LLT instead of SVS 16-46 Plus? You'd be happy to know that I've created quite a LLT buzz here in Finland. It started when another guy found out that there is a sonotube factory in Finland and the prices are pretty cheap. ATM I know at least 5-6 on going LLT projects. TC-Sound's TC-2000 sale of course didn't hurt either. We'll see what happens.

Excellent news I'd still be interested in measurements of the 16-49 though because it starts off as a a low tuned sub and offers the ability to tune even lower and even go sealed. I think it's one of the best commercial subs one can use to try and correlate and substantiate the differences - audible and measurable - between using lower tunings and going sealed. The 20-39 Plus testing that AV Talk did with the 20hz and 12hz tune are very revealing in this regard - the 16-49 Plus would be an even better starting point.

As for the LLTs, how much is a TC 2000 15" svc shipped overseas? I thought the cost was a big prohibiting factor. If not, this could be very exciting and get very interesting very quickly They going full bore at ~320 effective liters and ~15hz tuning, or pulling the reigns back a little bit?

[Ilkka]

SteveCallas wrote:

Excellent news I'd still be interested in measurements of the 16-49 though because it starts off as a a low tuned sub and offers the ability to tune even lower and even go sealed. I think it's one of the best commercial subs one can use to try and correlate and substantiate the differences - audible and measurable - between using lower tunings and going sealed. The 20-39 Plus testing that AV Talk did with the 20hz and 12hz tune are very revealing in this regard - the 16-49 Plus would be an even better starting point.

I don't want to sound like Bosso, but a plugged 16-46PC+ won't represent the best possible sealed sub. It was designed as a vented sub, you won't be able to bypass the 12 Hz HPF/EQ etc. I understand what you're trying to accomplish, but IMO this is not the right way. You would need to build/design both subs from the scratch in order to really find/reveal the differences.

But of course I'll measure the 16-46PC+ if I get the chance.

As for the LLTs, how much is a TC 2000 15" svc shipped overseas? I thought the cost was a big prohibiting factor. If not, this could be very exciting and get very interesting very quickly

Actually I'm not sure yet how much the shipping is. I'll let you know asap. Though I know it's not going to be cheap... Too bad that there isn't any good (and cheap!) woofers here in the Europe.

They going full bore at ~320 effective liters and ~15hz tuning, or pulling the reigns back a little bit?

Probably a little bit, ~270 liters and ~16 Hz (simulated) looked good to me when accounting for the room gain. But the TC-2000 isn't the only woofer that's being used. The good ol' RL-p and Tumult will most probably get built too. I'll link you to some construction threads and pics as soon the guys get started. Don't forget that we have around 1' of snow at the moment...and it ain't going to melt any time soon.

[SteveCallas]

Ilkka wrote:

I don't want to sound like Bosso, but a plugged 16-46PC+ won't represent the best possible sealed sub. It was designed as a vented sub, you won't be able to bypass the 12 Hz HPF/EQ etc

Oh, I thought you had a way to bypass the plate amp and use a regular amp? If that's accomplished, all that matters is the size to power relationship to keep it from bottoming while sealed.

Too bad that there isn't any good (and cheap!) woofers here in the Europe.

Don't forget that we have around 1' of snow at the moment...and it ain't going to melt any time soon

No good subwoofer drivers, 1' of snow, and your president looks like Conan O'Brien:




Join us in the land of opportunity Seriously though, no disrepect to your president intended.

[Ilkka]

SteveCallas wrote:

Oh, I thought you had a way to bypass the plate amp and use a regular amp? If that's accomplished, all that matters is the size to power relationship to keep it from bottoming while sealed.

Well yes, I did that to my Ultra (no GP results though). You have to run a speaker wire through the port and connect it directly to the driver in order to bypass the plate amp and its HPF/EQ. But then of course then you are using another amp, so one more variable...

No good subwoofer drivers, 1' of snow, and your president looks like Conan O'Brien:

Join us in the land of opportunity Seriously though, no disrepect to your president intended.

LOL! Though you don't want me to get started on your president...

[SteveCallas]

Ilkka wrote:

Well yes, I did that to my Ultra (no GP results though). You have to run a speaker wire through the port and connect it directly to the driver in order to bypass the plate amp and its HPF/EQ. But then of course then you are using another amp, so one more variable...

I see.

[Vader]

Thanks, Ilkka!

I don't see your tests for the 20-39PC+ (12.1 and 12.2) on the Shack in the subwoofer tests thread. Do you have a link?