PB13-ultra placement problems - Home Theater Forum and Systems - HomeTheaterShack.com

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post #1 of 8 Old 01-05-10, 02:25 AM Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Denmark
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PB13-ultra placement problems

Hi !
I'm now the owner of the pb13-ultra - before that I had the PC13-ultra. I was was very happy with the cylinder - only changed it because I missed the "table" to put things on. Before the cylinder I had the pb12-nsd.

So now to my problem - the sound. In most aspects it sounds great - I use it in the stock tune mode (20 hz) as I like that sound the best, but compared to the cylinder I dont feel I have the same tightness, speed both music and movie wise. I also have the AS-EQ1 and I have a huge problem in the 60-70 hz region. Its not able to fix this completely - still have about 2 db down here - but compared to the cylinder 20 hz before graph - I also had this problem before - but not as much as now.

My sub placement is bad - I know that - woofer is shooting straight into my sofa (about 30 cm from sub to sofa - front right corner) but with the pb we have the ports pointing this way and with the cylinder straight up. I know that the ports dont do upper bass - but only below 30 hz (perhaps 27 hz or so).
The cylinder fires down on a plate which doesn't "eat" your bass - as my sofa does.

So - it's impossible to move sofa (the wife thing) so I'm wondering about other solution:
Turn sub 180 around - firing straight into corner wall and have bass waves bouncing off the wall = no sofa messing with the sound, but is this bad for the accuracy, tightness of the woofer. Do I need to have the woofer pointing towards me ?

I cannot have the sub to the front left corner pointing towards me - but I can place it in parallel with the front wall - firing to the right - straight into the hifi gear/tv and so on - but again - not able to have the woofer straight at me.

Again - the cylinder had the same problem - woofer not pointing towards me + people say that bass waves are not directional. Sometimes I regret ever letting the cylinder go - was super on movies but I missed something in music that my pb12-nsd had. According to what all says about the pb-13 - it's the best - and its all about placement - I know I will have to move it around and try - just wanted to hear you guys oppinion here

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post #2 of 8 Old 01-05-10, 02:51 AM
Join Date: May 2009
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Re: PB13-ultra placement problems

Hi Thomas, the PB13Ultra is a great sub and loved mine when I had it but it is a beast for moving around and placement can be an issue for quite a few people, you suggestions both 1 & 2 are viable and the results may work out well, my big M&K sub works at it's best by facing/firing into the wall as that is how it is designed.

You have the best EQ device on the market IMO atm so it should be able to help on both choices
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post #3 of 8 Old 01-05-10, 08:37 AM
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Re: PB13-ultra placement problems

I found that by placing my PB12-Plus/2 in the CENTER of my Left wall I got the flattest response using my AQ-E1. I really sounds great. Just a thought. Dennis

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post #4 of 8 Old 01-07-10, 02:00 PM
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Re: PB13-ultra placement problems

I really think you should experiment with the tune modes. Although they shouldnt seem to affect the higher region your problems are, you shouldnt discount them. First thing I did with My Ultra after putting it in the best spot I had available, was find the best tune mode. Once you know which works best, your best placed to give the EQ-1 a better springboard from which to work.

Your suggestions will help as well, and the PB is an excellent sub so will work well. FWIW, Ive always found the cylinder seems to be slightly more able to make your feel it, but the box seems a little more composed and accurate. From that I would expect that you cant quite feel the PB as much as you could the cylinder, but its sound quality should be slightly better IMHO.
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post #5 of 8 Old 01-07-10, 02:32 PM
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Re: PB13-ultra placement problems

Another thing to check is the phase sometimes by adjusting it halfway or even 180° can make a huge difference. I played with REW and found that by adjusting the phase I moved a dip I had up or down between about 50Hz and 80Hz where I have the crossover set at.

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post #6 of 8 Old 01-07-10, 02:49 PM
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Re: PB13-ultra placement problems

tonyvdb wrote: View Post
Another thing to check is the phase sometimes by adjusting it halfway or even 180° can make a huge difference. I played with REW and found that by adjusting the phase I moved a dip I had up or down between about 50Hz and 80Hz where I have the crossover set at.
Thats a very good point, especially as the dip is right around the crossover point. Do you use REW, and if so, do you measure you subs response on its own or do you include the speakers. If you havent done one alone then you should. Then do one of just the speakers, and one of the sub and speakers combined, then compare the 3 graphs by overlaying them. If its a phase issue it will stick out like a sore thumb on the overlays.

If your not using REW, you really should consider it, it can help with issues just such as this, and much quicker than doing re sweeps with the EQ-1 after every phase adjustment . good setup before using the EQ-1 will ensure you get the absolute best out of it.
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post #7 of 8 Old 01-18-10, 03:19 PM Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Denmark
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Re: PB13-ultra placement problems

Hi !
Good replies everyone - thanks. The cylinder vs the box - it is the exact same thing I noticed. Very impressed with the cylinder in normal surround but missed something in the music section - not that it was bad - just different than my pb 12-nsd.
The phase thing - shouldn't the AS-EQ take care of the phase ? - I only did the phase 0 - play bass track - then do phase 180 and then same track and compared by ears and sometimes by my RS.
80 hz is the exact same xo I use - very interesting. Looks like I'm going to learn how to use the REW.
Thx a lot you guys !
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post #8 of 8 Old 01-27-10, 12:08 PM
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Re: PB13-ultra placement problems

Hi Thomas
I have the AS-EQ1 and 2 x PB13's . Like you I thought the AS-EQ1 would handle all phase issues and I set the phase to 0. Using REW I found out I had big dip at the 80 hz crossover between subs and mains. I discussed this with SVS and Doug McBride pointed out the the AS-EQ1 will handle phase issues between subs but does not handle phase issues between subs and speakers. I then manually adjusted the phase on both subs (1 at a time) to achieve the smoothest transition at the crossover point and reran REW. I eliminated the dip and achieved a smooth response. Subsequently I recalibrated the AS-EQ1 based on this new phase setting. It made a huge difference at the LP.

I hope this helps
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