The Ten Biggest Lies in Audio - Page 9 - Home Theater Forum and Systems - HomeTheaterShack.com

View Poll Results: Ten Biggest Audio Lies: Agree or Disagree (If you disagree, you must explain why!) Votes are public!
I agree with all of them. (If you vote here... do not vote again.) 131 44.41%
I disagree with all of them. (If you vote here... do not vote again.) 11 3.73%
1. The Cable Lie: Agree 106 35.93%
1. The Cable Lie: Disagree 36 12.20%
2. The Vacuum-Tube Lie: Agree 55 18.64%
2. The Vacuum-Tube Lie: Disagree 61 20.68%
3. The Antidigital Lie: Agree 70 23.73%
3. The Antidigital Lie: Disagree 43 14.58%
4. The Listening-Test Lie: Agree 79 26.78%
4. The Listening-Test Lie: Disagree 34 11.53%
5. The Feedback Lie: Agree 72 24.41%
5. The Feedback Lie: Disagree 29 9.83%
6. The Burn-In Lie: Agree 85 28.81%
6. The Burn-In Lie: Disagree 36 12.20%
7. The Biwiring Lie: Agree 78 26.44%
7. The Biwiring Lie: Disagree 34 11.53%
8. The Power Conditioner Lie: Agree 76 25.76%
8. The Power Conditioner Lie: Disagree 41 13.90%
9. The CD Treatment Lie: Agree 94 31.86%
9. The CD Treatment Lie: Disagree 25 8.47%
10: The Golden Ear Lie: Agree 81 27.46%
10: The Golden Ear Lie: Disagree 31 10.51%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 295. You may not vote on this poll

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post #81 of 287 Old 04-07-10, 11:15 AM
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Re: The Ten Biggest Lies in Audio

Before I changed my IC's to Kimber Silver Streak I had made a bunch of cables that were designed to be directional. They had a signal wire, a ground and a shield. The shield was connected only at the end where the signal originated. The purpose of the construction was to reduce RFI.

ARC SP9 MKIII, VPI HW19, Rega RB300, Marcof PPA1, Shure, Sumiko, Ortofon cartridges: Marantz CD63SE, Yamaha DVD-S1800,, MSB Link D2A, Emotiva XDA-2, Accuphase T101 tuner, TEAC V7010, Emotiva UMC-200: Front speakers: Acoustat Spectra 22 ESL's, DBX223sx, 2 modified Dynaco MK3's, 2 12" Transmission Line Subs, Behringer DSP1124P, 2 Crown XLS-402 Rear speakers: Acoustat Model 1 ESL, Paradigm X-30, 2 Adcom GFA-545, Acoustat SPW-1 Woofer.
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post #82 of 287 Old 04-07-10, 11:22 AM
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Re: The Ten Biggest Lies in Audio

Quote:
planetnine wrote: View Post

The one thing I will take exception to though is the trashing of the bi-wiring methodogy; it is definitely audible in some case and very easily measured.
Isn't bi-wiring where you run two sets of wires off of the same amp terminals and split to the high and low terminals on the speaker (parallel bi-wiring) ?

I bet most of the gains you could get from that would be the fact that you are probably increasing the wire gauge (ie: two sets of 14 gauge wire rather than just one). So that over longer distances it will have a measurable impact. It would be no different however than running a 14 gauge wire to the speaker, tying both ends together and splitting it with two sets of 14 gauge wire a foot away from the speaker. Which is really no different than connecting the high and low terminals together with 14 gauge wire and running tied 14 gauge wired to the amp from either the high or low terminals.

The effect of parallel bi-wiring two 14 gauge wires would be like running one 11 gauge wire to the speaker. The cross-sectional surface area of 14g wire is 2.08mm˛ and is 4.16mm˛ for 11 gauge. Two sets of 12 gauge wire would perform like one 9 gauge set.

Bi-amping I can see, bi-wiring no.
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post #83 of 287 Old 04-07-10, 01:01 PM
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Re: The Ten Biggest Lies in Audio

I had to disagree with the vacuum tube and golden ears "lies."

Vacuum tubes may not be superior to solid state, but solid state is not better than vacuum tube either. It all boils down to the application and the sound you are looking for. The statement "Whatever vacuum tubes can do...solid-state devices can do better" is definitely false.

The premise of the Golden Ear lie argument doesn't really disprove it. The fact that people with training and experience can hear and interpret the information is the point. There are people with varying degrees of ability; I have known some people who wouldn't hear the difference between a top quality hi-fi and a ghetto blaster with a blanket thrown over it. Just because there are many hacks out there doesn't mean there are not legitimate Golden-eared people. I have just run through the aptly named Golden Ears course again and my scores improved dramatically. Yes, this is from training my ears, but I can indeed hear differences clearer now than before, and I am sure there are many people who can hear them even clearer.
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post #84 of 287 Old 07-11-10, 09:46 AM
 
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Re: The Ten Biggest Lies in Audio

A few of those I never heard of before including the one about breaking in cables. I can't imagine why/how anyone could come up with that illogic.

One that wasn't mentioned was oxygen free copper cables.
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post #85 of 287 Old 07-11-10, 10:33 AM
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Re: The Ten Biggest Lies in Audio

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A few of those I never heard of before including the one about breaking in cables. I can't imagine why/how anyone could come up with that illogic.

One that wasn't mentioned was oxygen free copper cables.
I think that it would be covered under #1. In my opinion it doesn't make any difference. High end cables look nicer and that's about it.

My pets like the added headroom above 16Khz however...

I think the breaking in of cables followed suit that other components, like speakers or amps, could be broken in (although that is another debate). I work int he IT industry and sell hardware on the side and have had people request that I break in (burn in) their computers. That's something that is a waste of time also.
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post #86 of 287 Old 07-16-10, 02:44 AM
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Re: The Ten Biggest Lies in Audio

I disagree with the Golden Ears lie.
Years ago at band camp, one of the instructors had perfect pitch, not that he could sing in a perfect pitch, but that he could hear any note from any intrument and know what note it is. Not only could he do it with one note, but you could play any 7 notes on a keyboard at one time, and he knows all 7 notes.
He said that he didn't learn this ability, but as a young child, the first time he heard all of the notes played on a keyboard and knew their names, he had this ability.
I believe people with this gift can hear things either more accutely or somehow differently than normal hearing people.
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post #87 of 287 Old 07-16-10, 03:07 AM
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Re: The Ten Biggest Lies in Audio

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I disagree with the Golden Ears lie.
Years ago at band camp, one of the instructors had perfect pitch, not that he could sing in a perfect pitch, but that he could hear any note from any intrument and know what note it is. Not only could he do it with one note, but you could play any 7 notes on a keyboard at one time, and he knows all 7 notes.
He said that he didn't learn this ability, but as a young child, the first time he heard all of the notes played on a keyboard and knew their names, he had this ability.
I believe people with this gift can hear things either more accutely or somehow differently than normal hearing people.
I fail to see how perfect pitch is of relevance at all, except in determining if there is some pitch related anomaly such as wow and flutter. The possession of perfect pitch does not automatically make one a better listener to determine differences between gear.
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post #88 of 287 Old 07-16-10, 03:20 AM
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Re: The Ten Biggest Lies in Audio

As far the expensive speaker cables go,
years ago I read an article from a company explaining why their cables are expensive and why they sound better. I don't know if this is bull or not.
Their story involves frequency time alignment. They said that when using stranded speaker wire, where all strands are of the same gauge, the higher frequencies will travel faster than the lower frequencies. They found out 2 characteristics of signal flow:
1. higher frequencies travel in the center of the cable, lower frequencies travel in the outer ring of the cable.
2. the larger the gauge of wire strands, the faster the signal flows.
So knowing these characteristics they engineered speaker cable that has larger wire strands around the outer ring (this will speed up the lower frequencies), and smaller wire strands in the center (this will slow down the higher frequencies). This will allow the high and low frequencies to arrive at the speaker at the same time.
Also, bending normal speaker wire will cause the strands inside to deform and disturb the proper speed of signal flow. So their cable sheathing was lubricated inside and was designed specially to allow the wires inside to slide easily and not deform as much.
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post #89 of 287 Old 07-16-10, 03:46 AM
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Re: The Ten Biggest Lies in Audio

Quote:
A9X wrote: View Post
I fail to see how perfect pitch is of relevance at all, except in determining if there is some pitch related anomaly such as wow and flutter. The possession of perfect pitch does not automatically make one a better listener to determine differences between gear.
It's not just the ability of perfect pitch, it's the ability to be able to hear a mess of a sound and seperate each sound and decipher it. I don't know about you, but if I hear a bunch of various keys pushed on a keyboard all I hear is noise. I couln't tell you for sure if it was 5,6,7, or 8 keys that were pushed. Not only does he know how many keys, but he knows exactly which ones. As far as I remember he can do this correctly 100% of the time. His brain processes sound differently than 99% of the people out there and I believe that he can hear differences in equipment that we could not.
To me, that's a Golden Ear, maybe not to you.
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post #90 of 287 Old 07-16-10, 10:39 AM
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Re: The Ten Biggest Lies in Audio

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gdstupak wrote: View Post
So knowing these characteristics they engineered speaker cable that has larger wire strands around the outer ring (this will speed up the lower frequencies), and smaller wire strands in the center (this will slow down the higher frequencies). This will allow the high and low frequencies to arrive at the speaker at the same time.
Also, bending normal speaker wire will cause the strands inside to deform and disturb the proper speed of signal flow. So their cable sheathing was lubricated inside and was designed specially to allow the wires inside to slide easily and not deform as much.
I'm sure a technique which doubled their production cost, but increased their retail 20-fold. I'm also sure the specs for their cables included scientific measurements showing their cables provided better time alignment than a coat hanger, so you could see the difference even if you couldn't hear it.
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