AACS Final Adopter Agreement: The Analog Sunset - Home Theater Forum and Systems - HomeTheaterShack.com

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post #1 of 11 Old 12-21-09, 08:34 PM Thread Starter
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AACS Final Adopter Agreement: The Analog Sunset

Hello,
In some posts I have been alluding to the fact that soon Component Outputs will soon be limited to 480 interlaced by this time next year. (December, 31 2010) This is all ramping up to an Analog Sunset where Blu Ray Players will have no analog outputs (component, composite, S-video) by the end of 2013.

Here is the terms for what is coming up this time next year: "With the exception of Existing Models, any Licensed Player manufactured after December 31, 2010 shall limit analog video outputs for Decrypted AACS Content to SD Interlace Modes [composite video, s-video, 480i component video and 576i video] only."

And for December 31, 2013: "No Licensed Player that passes Decrypted AACS Content to analog video outputs may be manufactured or sold by Adopter after December 31, 2013."

This agreement was actually made in June. However, this information was not widely posted. The ironic thing is this does not and will not stop widespread digital copying and will really only adversely affect those who actually legally own and purchase media. Programs like AnyDVD HD will still allow those to illegally copy software.

What is disconcerting is after 2010, individual BD's can be made to down rez Component Outputs to 480i on BDP's made prior to the final agreement.

In truth, most of us have displays with HDMI or DVI. However, there are many early adopters who spent thousands of Dollars on HDTV's that will be functionally crippled by these revisions. In addition, many CI (Custom Installations) use Components due to HDMI performance over long distances and HDMI Handshake issues. I have several friends who are Installers who absolutely abhor HDMI due to the above issues and have done many installations sans HDMI. This is going to be a nightmare for some people. None of whom have done anything wrong or engage in copying, ripping, etc...

Here are some links with more information: http://arstechnica.com/media/news/20...nalog-hole.ars
And another: http://www.ultimateavmag.com/news/no..._from_blu-ray/
More information:http://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2009/06...ood-drives-us-
One more:http://www.audioholics.com/news/indu...component-2010

Cheers,
JJ

HT
Speakers: Martin Logan Vantage (Mains), Martin Logan Stage (Center), Martin Logan Vista (Surrounds), Martin Logan Montages (Surrounds) Hsu Research VTF-15h MK2, Martin Logan Descent i (Subwoofer)
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post #2 of 11 Old 12-22-09, 02:01 PM
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Re: AACS Final Adopter Agreement: The Analog Sunset

Interesting reading JJ and it does not surprise me that analogue will be extinct eventually, and it will more than likely apply to receivers/processors also, as the majority are now using digital input whether it be HDMI or SPDIF...
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post #3 of 11 Old 04-24-10, 04:58 PM
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Re: AACS Final Adopter Agreement: The Analog Sunset

Does this mean 30 years from now, the vinyl crowd is gonna be running $200,000 component systems with the bi-wired video cables suspended 10 inches above the floor on ceramic stands worth more than my life?



Seriously though this is pretty bad.. I feel bad for my friend stuck on component HD with his PS3, he was one of the early HDTV buyers and he isn't exactly loaded
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post #4 of 11 Old 04-24-10, 09:48 PM Thread Starter
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Re: AACS Final Adopter Agreement: The Analog Sunset

Hello,
Thankfully, even with Component and all other Analog Video Connections leaving, it will still be permissible to offer multichannel Analog Outputs for Audio in the AACS Agreement.

I am personally horrified at what they are doing as piracy is not happening with 99.999997% of Consumers. Rather, it is widespread piracy rings in Countries with lax Intellectual Property Laws using Computers. It is so wrong that early adopters of HDTV who spent a fortune for their HDTV are truly losing the ability to view Content at the highest possible resolution.

And again, there have been scores of CI's (Custom Installations) where the Installers avoided HDMI like the Plague as it can be prone to Handshaking issues and loss of signal over long distances. I know several CI's and they are cursing this event as their clientele are going to be quite upset. Moreover, many of the folks who shell out serious sums of money for CI are not afraid to be litigious or threaten it when told they will need to spend thousands rewiring and possibly ordering new equipment.
Cheers,
JJ

HT
Speakers: Martin Logan Vantage (Mains), Martin Logan Stage (Center), Martin Logan Vista (Surrounds), Martin Logan Montages (Surrounds) Hsu Research VTF-15h MK2, Martin Logan Descent i (Subwoofer)
Amplification: Aragon 8008bb, Parasound HCA-3500, Parasound HCA-2205 AT, Parasound HCA-1000a
AVR/SSP: Denon AVR-4520CI
Electronics: OPPO BDP-93
Gaming Consoles: Sony PS4, Xbox 360 S (250 gb)
Display: Panasonic TC-P65ZT60, Sony KDL-55EX500, Sony KD-34XBR910
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post #5 of 11 Old 08-30-10, 02:10 PM
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Re: AACS Final Adopter Agreement: The Analog Sunset

I knew about the HD component video analog sunset. I didn't know about the SD composite analog sunset. Apparently, the BD association wants VOD to be the ultimate winner of the format war. Consumers with analog inputs, be they composite, S-video, or component video will have no choice but to switch to VOD for their content. How much do you want to bet there will be no analog sunset on the VOD cable boxes?

Meanwhile, all the BD+ copy protection schemes are defeated on a daily basis by foreign-based pirates.
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post #6 of 11 Old 09-16-10, 08:24 AM Thread Starter
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Re: AACS Final Adopter Agreement: The Analog Sunset

Quote:
gsmollin wrote: View Post
I knew about the HD component video analog sunset. I didn't know about the SD composite analog sunset. Apparently, the BD association wants VOD to be the ultimate winner of the format war. Consumers with analog inputs, be they composite, S-video, or component video will have no choice but to switch to VOD for their content. How much do you want to bet there will be no analog sunset on the VOD cable boxes?

Meanwhile, all the BD+ copy protection schemes are defeated on a daily basis by foreign-based pirates.
Hello,
Given that it is the HDMI Final Adopter Agreement, it only makes sense that it will apply to all Video Sources.
However, Blu Ray Players have been the components specifically listed in the discourse.

I am thinking this is because they are the only Source capable of outputting Lossless Codecs that are in theory identical to the Studio Masters.

I do think that the Movie Studios do want Physical Content to remain. They just want it to where Copying it at a high resolution is impossible. However, I too am afraid there will be a time where Physical Media is a thing of the past.

I just do not like the idea of having all information on Hard Drives and Servers. Probably why I have never Purchased anything from iTunes. I do Upload my CD's onto iTunes however.
Cheers,
JJ

HT
Speakers: Martin Logan Vantage (Mains), Martin Logan Stage (Center), Martin Logan Vista (Surrounds), Martin Logan Montages (Surrounds) Hsu Research VTF-15h MK2, Martin Logan Descent i (Subwoofer)
Amplification: Aragon 8008bb, Parasound HCA-3500, Parasound HCA-2205 AT, Parasound HCA-1000a
AVR/SSP: Denon AVR-4520CI
Electronics: OPPO BDP-93
Gaming Consoles: Sony PS4, Xbox 360 S (250 gb)
Display: Panasonic TC-P65ZT60, Sony KDL-55EX500, Sony KD-34XBR910
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post #7 of 11 Old 11-20-10, 06:27 PM
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Re: AACS Final Adopter Agreement: The Analog Sunset

Ahh well, big brother IS watching. Eventually the only computers available will be nothing but net terminals using the "cloud." It seems as if everyone in authority, it doesn't matter if its Dems, Reps., Labor, Liberal, Conservative, etc... is working towards this. There is NO privacy on the net already. A place I volunteer at has already gone to "Win terminals," which are truly awful to use. I have used computers since 1983 and I don't like these developments at all.
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post #8 of 11 Old 11-20-10, 07:36 PM Thread Starter
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Re: AACS Final Adopter Agreement: The Analog Sunset

It depresses me too. It will cause problems for a good number of folks.
JJ

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Speakers: Martin Logan Vantage (Mains), Martin Logan Stage (Center), Martin Logan Vista (Surrounds), Martin Logan Montages (Surrounds) Hsu Research VTF-15h MK2, Martin Logan Descent i (Subwoofer)
Amplification: Aragon 8008bb, Parasound HCA-3500, Parasound HCA-2205 AT, Parasound HCA-1000a
AVR/SSP: Denon AVR-4520CI
Electronics: OPPO BDP-93
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post #9 of 11 Old 11-21-10, 08:23 PM
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Re: AACS Final Adopter Agreement: The Analog Sunset

It is really sad that this is being done to the consumers who are not the problems, pirates will still be able to copy and distribute movies, and people who simply wish to make a fair use copy of their own content are turned into criminals by break DMCA.

Another link I would add to your other post is this one from Audio Authority, hopefully more people will read it to better inform themselves and not be preyed upon by dubious salesmen.

http://www.audioauthority.com/page/component
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post #10 of 11 Old 12-29-10, 09:53 PM Thread Starter
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Re: AACS Final Adopter Agreement: The Analog Sunset

Hello,
We are now days away from the first prong of the AACS Analog Sunset Restrictions from being put into place. Any new Blu-Ray Players released after December 31, 2010 will not be allowed to output above 480i/576i via the component outputs. Custom Installers are going to have a busy 2011 as so many Custom Installations used component cables as HDMI Handshaking issues get even worse with the long cable runs that are commonplace in CI's. I have a close friend who is a Custom Installer who travels all over the World catering to the affluent and he is dreading this year. Again, component cables almost never present a problem and work far better with long cable runs.

BDP's that were introduced prior to this date are not affected. This includes BDP's that were released to the General Public prior to the cutoff that are still current models. There is much speculation that OPPO rushed the BDP-93 to market so that it will not be affected by this. Sadly, the forthcoming BDP-95 will be restricted to SD resolution via the component outputs.

Now some of you are thinking thank goodness you have a pre 2011 BDP and are immune from this, but sadly this is not the case. Blu-Ray Discs released after New Years can and might have an Image Constraint Token built into the disc that will not allow your older BDP from outputting HD via component outputs as well. At least this will be on a disc to disc basis, but knowing Studios all of the Blockbuster Movies will have this restriction.

The OPPO BDP-93 will be the last BDP released (12/20/2010) prior to the first stage of the Analog Sunset, Given its comprehensive Feature Set and excellent performance, this BDP really might be a great investment.

In 2 years, all AACS components made after December 31, 2012 will not have any analog video outputs. SD or HD.
For further reading:http://www.audioholics.com/news/indu...component-2010
Cheers,
JJ

HT
Speakers: Martin Logan Vantage (Mains), Martin Logan Stage (Center), Martin Logan Vista (Surrounds), Martin Logan Montages (Surrounds) Hsu Research VTF-15h MK2, Martin Logan Descent i (Subwoofer)
Amplification: Aragon 8008bb, Parasound HCA-3500, Parasound HCA-2205 AT, Parasound HCA-1000a
AVR/SSP: Denon AVR-4520CI
Electronics: OPPO BDP-93
Gaming Consoles: Sony PS4, Xbox 360 S (250 gb)
Display: Panasonic TC-P65ZT60, Sony KDL-55EX500, Sony KD-34XBR910
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