Elektra™: a range of screen paints from N8.5 down to ? - Home Theater Forum and Systems - HomeTheaterShack.com

 
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post #1 of 10 Old 12-21-09, 08:46 PM Thread Starter
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Don
 
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Elektra™: a range of screen paints from N8.5 down to ?

As the title says, the Elektra™ screen mixes will run in shades from N8.5 down to a yet undetermined level. That is one of the reasons this mix is here in the Developers forum and not the main forum - it's still in active development.

First a bit about the name - Elektra is Greek and means "the bright, brilliant or shining one" (which I thought apropos for a reflective screen mix). She is one of the Seven Sisters that compose the Pleiades star cluster or constellation forever being chased through the heavens by the giant Orion.

Elektra is also the name of one of my favorite characters from the Daredevil comic book series, played well, IMO, by Jennifer Garner in the movies Daredevil and Elektra (she kicks serious eye as well as tail ).

Now to the mixes proper. They are quite simple from a mixing viewpoint; they consist of the Cream&Sugar™ mix (here) to which is added various amounts of N6 gray paint to darken the mix to various N levels. At this time only mixes for N8.5 and N8 have been determined, which will be detailed below.

A big question is why have this series of mixes when we already have Black Widow™ and Scorpion™? The answer is many-fold. The Elektra™ mixes are an off-shoot from ongoing research into making an International Cream&Sugar™ mix that can be made in about any country on Earth (more about that in due time).

Elektra™ only has a single reflective element in it (Craft Smart Metallic Silver) where Scorpion™ has two, one of which (the Auto Air Aluminum) must be ordered via mail-order or on-line by many people; some people don't want to do that and Elektra™ is a solution for them.

There is the obvious question of which is better, Elektra™, or Scorpion™ and Black Widow™. The answer depends on how you define "better". If you want a reflective mix and have local access to the ingredients of Elektra™ then it is "better" than the mixes you can't or don't want to make because you would have to order the AAA-F. As to which mix performs best, we haven't done testing along those lines yet (remember, Elektra™ is still in development). Per fluid ounce, Elektra™ has a higher percentage of metallic paint in it's mixes compared to Scorpion™ and Black Widow™, but those mixes have the AAA-F in them which is probably a better reflector.

No matter how the testing comes out, Elektra™ is not meant to compete with Scorpion™ or Black Widow™, but rather to be an alternate choice if AAA-F is hard to find and the person making the mix doesn't want to order it.

The bulk of Elektra™ mixes is the standard Cream&Sugar™ mix (it doesn't matter which C&S™ is used - #1, #2 or #3).

The N6 gray paint will eventually be available from both Home Depot and Lowe's.
Even though this sampler is not the Behr flat latex Enamel it will do for coloring these Elektra™ mixes since relatively little needs to be added to C&S™ to darken it to the N8.5 and N8 shades.

Code:
N6 match in Behr Premium Plus ULTRA Interior/Exterior Flat 
8 fl. oz. sampler Medium Base #UL204:
Tint:
      oz.     348 oz.
B -  0        98
C -  0        20
F -  0          5
The Valspar 8 oz. sample is available only in satin finish, for this reason it might make an Elektra™ mix made with C&S™ Ultra hot spot, but that has not been tested yet.

Code:
N6 tint formula for Valspar 8 oz. samples:

Valspar 8 oz. sample #93707 Base 2
101 - 6.375
107 - 0.625
109 - 0.313


If you are making a lot of Elektra™ for a large screen, or making some of the darker mixes to come, you might need to buys quarts of the N6 paint.
Code:
The N6 tint formula for Behr is:
For 1 quart
Base = Behr #1854 (or the Behr ULTRA equivalent - I'm guessing #1754)
Tint:
      oz.     348 oz.
B -  1          6
C -  0        79
F -  0        22
To make Elektra™ N8.5 add 2.25 fl. oz. of N6 paint to 48 fl. oz. of C&S™

To make Elektra™ N8 add 6 fl. oz. of N6 paint to 48 fl. oz. of C&S™

Don't worry about getting the amount of N6 paint exactly right; for example, if you would only put 2 fl. oz. of N6 in to make Elektra™ N8.5 you would not be able to tell the difference with the naked eye.

For ease of measuring the N6 paint, 1 fl. oz. = 30 ml or 2 U.S. tablespoons.

A handy volumetric conversion program can be found here.

A thread showing the mixing and use of Elektra™ N8 is here. It has some great screen photos!

Last edited by Harpmaker; 05-16-11 at 07:30 PM. Reason: Added Valspar N6 tint formula
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post #2 of 10 Old 02-19-10, 08:33 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Elektra™: a range of screen paints from N8.5 down to ?

Quote:
mechman wrote: View Post
This is what pyro2 used, right Don? If so I'll put his charts in this thread. I have both a emmissive and reflective set. Should have the charts done by Sunday.
Correct Mech, he used the N8 formula.
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post #3 of 10 Old 02-20-10, 05:55 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Elektra™: a range of screen paints from N8.5 down to ?

Here are my readings for Pyro2's sample:



XYZ = 0.5237, 0.5530, 0.5958

xy = 0.3131, 0.3307

I'm using Lindbloom's spreadsheet and he might use slightly different formulae for these than CalMAN does.
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post #4 of 10 Old 03-13-10, 04:31 PM
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Re: Elektra™: a range of screen paints from N8.5 down to ?

I'm just wondering if Elektra is a good choice for me considering I have AAA coming in the mail anyway. I also wonder what would happen if AAA was used as the agent to reduce N levels. It's just something that's got me curious.

I love how simple Elektra is to make. The fact that you can vary the N6 tint without changing the neutrality of the screen is amazing. It's a great concept.
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post #5 of 10 Old 03-13-10, 11:31 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Elektra™: a range of screen paints from N8.5 down to ?

Quote:
sr1329 wrote: View Post
I'm just wondering if Elektra is a good choice for me considering I have AAA coming in the mail anyway.
That is the $64 question that won't be answered until more testing is done (hopefully soon, but since we do this stuff in our "spare time" I can't give a firm time-line).

Quote:
I also wonder what would happen if AAA was used as the agent to reduce N levels. It's just something that's got me curious.
The problem with using AAA-F to do this is that it isn't by itself neutral in color (and the theory behind Elektra™ is that a neutral plus a neutral equals a neutral), but rather imparts a blueish tint to a mix that must be countered by having a pinkish-beige base color (like that used to make Black Widow™). The more AAA-F used the stronger the countering base color needs to be. It is a good thought though and I will have to admit not testing it, I can't remember if Mech did something like this or not when experimenting with Scorpion™.

The other reason for using a non-reflective N6 paint as the "shade-adjuster" is that it would also dilute the CSMS in the C&S™. Making a mix that is like C&S™, but using a gray paint as a base, resulted in a screen that had a few visible sparkles at normal viewing distances. The more N6 paint you add to darken Elektra™ the more dilute the CSMS becomes to counter this effect.

Quote:
I love how simple Elektra is to make. The fact that you can vary the N6 tint without changing the neutrality of the screen is amazing. It's a great concept.
Thank you. It shows that we spend way too much time thinking about this stuff!

There is another mix on another forum that also uses a "shade-adjuster" paint to darken the mix (they call theirs a "colorant"), but neither the base mix nor the "colorant" is neutral. They don't think color neutrality matters much, we do.
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post #6 of 10 Old 03-15-10, 01:11 AM
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Re: Elektra™: a range of screen paints from N8.5 down to ?

I just discovered the new LG CF181D "light cannon" machine. If I do end up purchasing that beast then it looks like reports of its poor black levels but extremely high luminance in "calibrated" modes will make Elektra the screen mix of choice for it. Imagine having 1200+ "calibrated" lumens at your disposal and a great N6 or N7 Elektra screen that neutralizes this projector's Achilles Heel. It would be a perfect match.
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post #7 of 10 Old 04-28-10, 06:05 PM
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Re: Elektra™: a range of screen paints from N8.5 down to ?

Have you tried using a UPW glossy basecoat or adding polycrylic to the mix?
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post #8 of 10 Old 04-28-10, 07:46 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Elektra™: a range of screen paints from N8.5 down to ?

Quote:
smuggs2001 wrote: View Post
Have you tried using a UPW glossy basecoat or adding polycrylic to the mix?
Answered at the bottom of this post - http://www.hometheatershack.com/foru...tml#post260230
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post #9 of 10 Old 11-04-10, 11:03 AM
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Re: Elektra™: a range of screen paints from N8.5 down to ?

Does anybody know the upc # or product # for the sample container of Behr N6 ? Or do I have to have it tinted to get N6. Was looking for it at HD but didn't see it. Will it say Behr N6 on the label ?
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post #10 of 10 Old 11-04-10, 11:30 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Elektra™: a range of screen paints from N8.5 down to ?

Quote:
e.mann30 wrote: View Post
Does anybody know the upc # or product # for the sample container of Behr N6 ? Or do I have to have it tinted to get N6. Was looking for it at HD but didn't see it. Will it say Behr N6 on the label ?
See the first post in this thread again; you can now see the full name of the 8 oz. sample jar.

As far as I know no store that sells house paints knows anything about Munsell neutral gray values. You must provide them with a paint tint formula.

When you get your paint, the container will likely say something like "Custom color" or "Manually dispensed" meaning it wasn't tinted to a color already in their database or by matching a color sample.
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