Help with the Black Widow PFG DIY Projection Screen - Home Theater Forum and Systems - HomeTheaterShack.com

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post #1 of 96 Old 04-16-13, 05:56 PM Thread Starter
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Question Help with the Black Widow PFG DIY Projection Screen

After the end of this years college football season I made a decison that I needed to change my current DIY projection screen to something that allows more ambient lighting without the lose of color and contrast. I reviewed several builds and decided on the Black Widow PFG route. It didn't turn out any better than what I had before. Please tell me what I did wrong.

My screen is 115", 16:9 ratio. I used 3/4" MDF with 1-1/2" black velvet borders. I installed RGB LED lighting around the perimeter. The lighting works well its the paint that failed me.

First I went to Menards and purchased some high quality primer. I cover the MDF with 3 coats making sure to show no roller marks. Next I took the picture you show on the Black Widow Thread and informed the counter I needed 1 quart of this Pittsburg Paint "Burmuda Beige" (427-2-Grand distinct flat latex as base). The paint number she gave me matched the picture I pulled from the website to the letter except for the Red/Yellow/Brown Oxide numbers (red=3, yellow=6, Brown=10). My numbers read as Red=3, Yellow=1, Brown=1. Do they need to match and what would cause them to be different?

Next I ordered from Amazon, 2-4oz Auto-Aluminum Fine bottles. The paint numbers on the bottle were 4101-4Z. That should be right on with what you recommended.

I mixed 1 quart of Bermuda Beige with the 2 bottles of Auto-Aluminum (8 oz) and mixed it with an electric drill. This is where the problem comes up. The paint is not grey!! It was even said by other people it is still slightly Beige to off-white. What did I do wrong? The ratio should be right to cover a 115", 16:9 screen. 1 quart of Bermuda Beige and 8 oz of Auto-Aluminum.

I am looking for advice because I want to re-paint it soon. Any help would be a help.

Thank you.
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post #2 of 96 Old 04-16-13, 07:12 PM
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Don
 
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Re: Help with the Black Widow PFG DIY Projection Screen

Quote:
aiwa2child wrote: View Post
After the end of this years college football season I made a decison that I needed to change my current DIY projection screen to something that allows more ambient lighting without the lose of color and contrast. I reviewed several builds and decided on the Black Widow PFG route. It didn't turn out any better than what I had before. Please tell me what I did wrong.

My screen is 115", 16:9 ratio. I used 3/4" MDF with 1-1/2" black velvet borders. I installed RGB LED lighting around the perimeter. The lighting works well its the paint that failed me.

First I went to Menards and purchased some high quality primer. I cover the MDF with 3 coats making sure to show no roller marks. Next I took the picture you show on the Black Widow Thread and informed the counter I needed 1 quart of this Pittsburg Paint "Burmuda Beige" (427-2-Grand distinct flat latex as base). The paint number she gave me matched the picture I pulled from the website to the letter except for the Red/Yellow/Brown Oxide numbers (red=3, yellow=6, Brown=10). My numbers read as Red=3, Yellow=1, Brown=1. Do they need to match and what would cause them to be different?

Next I ordered from Amazon, 2-4oz Auto-Aluminum Fine bottles. The paint numbers on the bottle were 4101-4Z. That should be right on with what you recommended.

I mixed 1 quart of Bermuda Beige with the 2 bottles of Auto-Aluminum (8 oz) and mixed it with an electric drill. This is where the problem comes up. The paint is not grey!! It was even said by other people it is still slightly Beige to off-white. What did I do wrong? The ratio should be right to cover a 115", 16:9 screen. 1 quart of Bermuda Beige and 8 oz of Auto-Aluminum.

I am looking for advice because I want to re-paint it soon. Any help would be a help.

Thank you.
First, Welcome to HTS!

Second, you did nothing wrong!!! Your paint store did!!! The color they gave you was NOT PPG 'Bermuda Beige'!

The image from the main Black Widow™ thread here shows the tint formula for a gallon of paint. The tint formula for a quart of paint divides those tint amounts by 4.



The tint for a gallon is:
Red Oxide - 3/48 oz.
Yellow Oxide - 6/48 oz.
Brown Oxide - 10/48 oz.

The correct tint formula for a quart would be:
Red Oxide - 1/96 oz. + 1/192 oz.
Yellow Oxide - 1/48 oz. + 1/96 oz.
Brown Oxide - 2/48 oz. + 1/96th oz.

I'm sorry your store messed up the color the way they did. They should at least replace the mis-tinted paint for free, but you're still out the cost of the AAA-F and the work and frustration.

A specific color of paint can be made from differing tint formulae, but it requires different tint colors be used to make the final color. They used the same tints as the gallon shown here, but they got the proportion of tint colors totally wrong! Blunders of this magnitude happen, but not often and there is no excuse at all since you used a PPG paint! You would think they would get there own color right. The paint they sold you would have a sever red push even after the AAA-F was added.

The AAA-F you got was the correct paint.

If I may ask, what was your DIY screen before the mis-tinted BW™ was applied?
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post #3 of 96 Old 04-16-13, 08:10 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Help with the Black Widow PFG DIY Projection Screen

Thank you for the help. I was hoping I didn't screw up the mix. I also don't know alot about mixing paint. If you have some time can you explain what the (48,96,192,384). I believe it is ounces but i am not for sure. Again thank for the quick response.
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post #4 of 96 Old 04-16-13, 09:22 PM
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Re: Help with the Black Widow PFG DIY Projection Screen

Quote:
aiwa2child wrote: View Post
Thank you for the help. I was hoping I didn't screw up the mix. I also don't know alot about mixing paint. If you have some time can you explain what the (48,96,192,384). I believe it is ounces but i am not for sure. Again thank for the quick response.
Sure no problem. On the label on the gallon of paint the tints used are listed with a tint letter first (F = Red Oxide, C = Yellow Oxide and I = Brown Oxide) followed by the tint color name and then how much of that tint is used to make the final color. The lines of info are read from left to right horizontally. The areas to the right of the tint name are designated in volumes that equal a fluid ounce then 48ths of a fl. oz. then 96ths of a fl. oz. then 192ths of a fl. oz. and finally 384ths of a fl. oz.

The gallon tint formula calls for adding 3/48ths of a fluid ounce of Tint F then 6/48ths of a fl. oz. of tint C and finally 10/48ths of a fl. oz. of tint I.

To convert this tint formula to make a quart instead of a gallon we simply divide the tint volumes by 4 since there are 4 quarts per gallon.

Instead of using 3/48ths of an oz. (this always means by volume and not weight) of tint F we divide 3 by 4 which equals 0.75/48ths of an oz. At most stores tints can only be added in integer amounts so to add a fraction we must use in integer of a smaller unit. 1/96th of an oz. is the same a 0.5/48ths of an oz and 1/192th oz. is the same as 0.25/48ths oz. so we can get 0.75/48ths of an oz. by using 1/96th + 1/192th oz. of tint.

The same holds true for the other two tints. 6 divided by 4 = 1.5 and 10 divided by 4 = 2.5.

I know this can be a brain-twister, if you still don't understand it just let me know and I'll try to break it down so it's clearer.
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post #5 of 96 Old 04-17-13, 09:14 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Help with the Black Widow PFG DIY Projection Screen

I understand what they are detailing now. Thank you for the information. And thanks again for the correct 1 quart formula for the Bermuda Beige. I have the AAA headed toward the house and plan on repainting the screen this weekend. Hope everything goes right.
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post #6 of 96 Old 04-20-13, 04:26 PM Thread Starter
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Question Re: Help with the Black Widow PFG DIY Projection Screen

Okay, I went to Menards today and tried to get the Bermuda Biege quart paint mix that you recommended. They said they could match the Grand Distinct Flat and match the colorants as you told me. I am attaching a picture of the top of the quart can. They told me that the computer will not display the Bermuda Beige 427-2 number. I do believe the Menards employees are ignorant and dont want to even try to help me. My question is this. Is this going to work?

Thank you for the input
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post #7 of 96 Old 04-21-13, 01:47 AM
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I am just going to post my question here in regards to my BW paint mix.
I just mixed and rolled my first coating on my wall, a 92 screen.

However, when I mixed the Valspar paint and AAA-F, I got a beige mixture, not a grey one. Did I not mix the two enough or there was something wrong with he paint I got from Lowes?

Id be glad to send you samples if you guys want.

Mind you, the image on the screen looks awesome.
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post #8 of 96 Old 04-21-13, 07:46 AM
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Re: Help with the Black Widow PFG DIY Projection Screen

Quote:
olwe wrote: View Post
I am just going to post my question here in regards to my BW paint mix.
I just mixed and rolled my first coating on my wall, a 92 screen.

However, when I mixed the Valspar paint and AAA-F, I got a beige mixture, not a grey one. Did I not mix the two enough or there was something wrong with he paint I got from Lowes?

Id be glad to send you samples if you guys want.

Mind you, the image on the screen looks awesome.
Could you post a photo of the tint label from your Valspar can? It is certainly possible they messed up getting the color right, but it hasnt happened often. Something that concerns me is that this is the 2nd case of a Valspar mis-tint in a short period of time... Im beginning to wonder if Valspar didnt get a glitch in their tinting code database. Paint store databases are updated regularly so this could happen.

While it is possible that the AAA-F wasnt stirred in well enough, its kind of unlikely since it is a thinner paint that the Valspar base paint. If in doubt always stir it some more. By far the best way to stir paint is with a squirrel cage type stirrer attached to a hand drill, but even a kitchen egg beater mixer will work if used on the slowest setting.

After you are sure the mix has been stirred well, feel free to send Mech or myself a sample of it to measure for color. Just PM either of us for our address.
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post #9 of 96 Old 04-21-13, 12:36 PM
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Hi. Here the pics of the label and the mix that I did. As you can see, there is some splash of AAA-F on the side of the can I used.

I will mix them some before I put on the final coat. I did use a mixer I got from Lowe's. I will pm you later for your addresa to send a sample of my mix.

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post #10 of 96 Old 04-21-13, 03:01 PM
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I added 2 4oz bottles of the AAA. I even added a little bit of water in he bottle to get as much AAA out.

I used a mixer that I attached to a drill. It is like a fan of short and long plastic blades. I stirred the mixture up again for a good 15 mins and still no change in colour.

I might have to re-paint it in a few months. But, the picture I am having still looks good.
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