bass cabs - Home Theater Forum and Systems - HomeTheaterShack.com

Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 36 Old 01-20-07, 01:42 AM Thread Starter
drf
drf
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Somewhere else.
Posts: 1,249
bass cabs

I am thinking of building a bass cab, just wondering what allignments people curently use and what particular sonics they attribute to specific allignments, I am not overly concerned about the particulars of what each size driver should be capable of, but more what peoples impressions are.

For example I was thinking of a single 15" cab with a 2x 12" cab ontop, the idea being low end and a certain amount of projection in the one stack. Maybe even some piezo tweeters to compliment the 2x12"'s ?

cheers

dr f

Last edited by drf; 01-20-07 at 01:44 AM. Reason: spelling
drf is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 36 Old 01-20-07, 05:14 AM
Bryan Nemecek
Inactive
 
Posts: n/a
Re: bass cabs

Quote:
drf wrote: View Post
I am thinking of building a bass cab, just wondering what allignments people curently use and what particular sonics they attribute to specific allignments, I am not overly concerned about the particulars of what each size driver should be capable of, but more what peoples impressions are.

For example I was thinking of a single 15" cab with a 2x 12" cab ontop, the idea being low end and a certain amount of projection in the one stack. Maybe even some piezo tweeters to compliment the 2x12"'s ?

cheers

dr f
Are you are building the speaker box, or buying a box to put a speaker into? Will the box be ported?
Is this bass speaker intended for 'sub' duty?
What will the sound duty of the 2x12's be, to produce 'full range' sound?
You mentioned tweeters, will this system be actively or passively crossed-over?

You may want to post your question over in the "DIY Speakers and Subwoofers" area.

B-DoGG
post #3 of 36 Old 01-20-07, 11:24 AM
HTS Senior Moderator
 
Wayne A. Pflughaupt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Corpus Christi, Texas
Posts: 9,173
Send a message via Yahoo to Wayne A. Pflughaupt
Re: bass cabs

drf,

Is this for PA use? The reason I ask is that your driver compliment seems peculiar. Usually PA’s use 18” horn-loaded subs, 15” woofs for the mids, and compression drivers for the highs.

Regards,
Wayne
Wayne A. Pflughaupt is offline  
 
post #4 of 36 Old 01-20-07, 04:51 PM Thread Starter
drf
drf
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Somewhere else.
Posts: 1,249
Re: bass cabs

sorry, I meant bass guitar cabinets. I am currently designing a head amp. But I wanted some opinions on the different qualities each particular setup has:

E.g

do 4x10" cabs generally have a crisp sound? and or does a single 15" generally have a boomy quality?

I realise a lot of tone is dependent on many things like driver quality, application and environmental accoustics, however I am just after general feeling or impressions as I haven't had the opportunity to compare varying setups.

My idea with the 2x12"s was a single cabinet with some tweeters to get the higher freq's.

I haven't thought about crossovers because I usually decide/design those to suit whatever driver arrangement I have settled on.


edit: just learning how to use google sketchup, this is something along the lines I was thinking but haven't done any mathes and is not to scale:
Name:  basscab.JPG
Views: 1350
Size:  32.4 KB

Last edited by drf; 01-20-07 at 06:09 PM. Reason: added picture
drf is offline  
post #5 of 36 Old 01-20-07, 08:17 PM
Senior Shackster
Dan
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Australia
Posts: 292
Send a message via MSN to Danny
Re: bass cabs

Question - if it is a bass guitar cab why are you putting tweeters in it? IMO they are unneeded.
Danny is offline  
post #6 of 36 Old 01-20-07, 09:20 PM Thread Starter
drf
drf
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Somewhere else.
Posts: 1,249
Re: bass cabs

IIRC Bass guitar has harmonics upto 2khz, with some snap and edge definition above this (5 to 7Khz is not unheard of). The average 12" driver can breakup at 2Khz. This, to me, seems to leave some of the defining characteristics of the instrument to the mercy of a larger drivers high end ability. So I figure a tweeter or 2 could relieve the drivers of this burden.

Last edited by drf; 01-20-07 at 09:28 PM.
drf is offline  
post #7 of 36 Old 01-21-07, 01:03 AM
Elite Shackster
 
Sonnie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: L.A. (Lower Alabama)
Posts: 22,577
My System
Re: bass cabs

I believe large full range drivers are available aren't they? I'm thinking those who do the Open Baffle type systems.... they use full range 15" drivers. Could you use those okay?
Sonnie is offline  
post #8 of 36 Old 01-21-07, 03:25 PM
HTS Senior Moderator
 
Wayne A. Pflughaupt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Corpus Christi, Texas
Posts: 9,173
Send a message via Yahoo to Wayne A. Pflughaupt
Re: bass cabs

Quote:
Danny wrote: View Post
Question - if it is a bass guitar cab why are you putting tweeters in it? IMO they are unneeded.
Quote:
drf wrote: View Post
IIRC Bass guitar has harmonics upto 2khz, with some snap and edge definition above this (5 to 7Khz is not unheard of).
Not to mention, the highs from large-diameter drivers is very directional and “beamy.” So everything sounds very different to listeners who are in front of the cabinet, vs. listeners who aren’t.

Quote:
do 4x10" cabs generally have a crisp sound? and or does a single 15" generally have a boomy quality?
I never could fully get behind the 4-10 arrangement, always seemed to lack in the lowest frequencies.

Interestingly, there is a migration in bass cabinets these days towards 12” drivers, as a “best of both worlds” between the 10s and 15s. I played on a little Aguilar 1-12 w/ tweeter several months ago, and it’s arguably the best sounding cabinet I’ve ever heard. Great extension, even with a 5-string, and very smooth and linear from the low notes to the high, no “boominess” or one-note quality. I want one!

If I was going to do a custom rig like yours, I’d do it like they do with home speakers, not like they typically do with bass cabinets. With bass systems, they typically have the big driver running full range and handing off the upper frequencies to the smaller drivers. What I’d do is run the small drivers as low as they’d play, then hand off the lower frequencies to the large driver. Naturally, this will require bi-amping with a good electronic crossover.

I’d also pass on peizo tweeters, as those things are pretty cheap and nasty-sounding, IMO. I’d go for a good-quality horn-loaded compression driver, like they use in PA systems. Makes perfect sense, especially if you’re going to be patched into a PA system anyway: what you here on-stage will be a better match for what your audience will hear of you from the system.

Another thought, if you’re going to be patched into a PA system with subs, you can dispense with the 15” altogether and let the system carry the bottom end for you. After all, what’s the point of trying to make a 15-incher compete with a pair of horn-loaded 18” subs??

You might want to bounce your question off the guys at the Talkbass Forum. Lots of good, informed advice there.

Regards,
Wayne
Wayne A. Pflughaupt is offline  
post #9 of 36 Old 01-21-07, 11:42 PM Thread Starter
drf
drf
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Somewhere else.
Posts: 1,249
Re: bass cabs

Thanks, I have no problems with bi-amping, to be Honest I much prefer active crossovers/biamping to passive.

Quote:
If I was going to do a custom rig like yours, I’d do it like they do with home speakers, not like they typically do with bass cabinets. With bass systems, they typically have the big driver running full range and handing off the upper frequencies to the smaller drivers. What I’d do is run the small drivers as low as they’d play, then hand off the lower frequencies to the large driver. Naturally, this will require bi-amping with a good electronic crossover.

That sounds like a good idea, I could set out the amp to have a selectable crossover so a 15" cab can be added at a future date. Only problem with that is I didn't really want to build three poweramps for the one head, just two. I suppose I could have a pre out that is low passed, then just add a third amp when using the 15.

Quote:
I believe large full range drivers are available aren't they? I'm thinking those who do the Open Baffle type systems.... they use full range 15" drivers. Could you use those okay?
I could use those, but even the best built 15" drivers will suffer cone breakup after 1-2Khz. In some cases they barely make it to 1Khz before breakup can be measured/heard.
drf is offline  
post #10 of 36 Old 01-22-07, 11:22 AM
Elite Shackster
 
Sonnie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: L.A. (Lower Alabama)
Posts: 22,577
My System
Re: bass cabs

Quote:
Wayne A. Pflughaupt wrote: View Post

Not to mention, the highs from large-diameter drivers is very directional and “beamy.” So everything sounds very different to listeners who are in front of the cabinet, vs. listeners who aren’t.
Quote:
drf wrote: View Post
I could use those, but even the best built 15" drivers will suffer cone breakup after 1-2Khz. In some cases they barely make it to 1Khz before breakup can be measured/heard.
I wonder how the likes of Hawthorne Audio get their OB (open baffle) systems with full range drivers to sound good... and they use those for home theater and two channel. They actually have some pretty good reviews too. I think we have someone who is writing up something on their OB's and it may give us some insight. It just got me thinking that they must have better full range drivers available somewhere.
Sonnie is offline  
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
bass , cabs

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now




PLEASE COMPLETE ALL REQUIRED FIELDS BELOW... THANKS!

REQUIRED FIELDS ON THIS PAGE
YOU MUST COMPLETE ALL OF THESE

Username
Password
Confirm Password
Email Address
Confirm Email Address
Random Question
Random Question #2




User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
PLEASE READ BELOW PRIOR TO ENTERING AN EMAIL ADDRESS!

ATTENTION!

YOU MUST ACTIVATE YOUR ACCOUNT!

Activation requires you reply to an email we will send you after you register... if you do not reply to this email, you will not be able to view certain areas of the forum or certain images... nor will you be able download software.

AN INVALID EMAIL ADDRESS WILL CAUSE YOUR ACCOUNT TO BE DELETED!

See our banned email list here: Banned Email List

We DO NOT respond to spamcop, boxtrapper and spamblocker emails... please add @hometheatershack DOT com to your whitelist prior to registering or you will get nowhere on your registration.


Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML is not allowed!
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

 


For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome