Improving my 2-channel sound - Part 2 (Yes, more help needed!) - Page 2 - Home Theater Forum and Systems - HomeTheaterShack.com

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post #11 of 21 Old 04-01-15, 11:51 AM
 
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Re: Improving my 2-channel sound - Part 2 (Yes, more help needed!)

Measuring the room will help you determine what you need to do to improve the sound.

My Home Living room Theater
Samsung 65" FP, Yamaha CX-A5100, Xilica XP4080, (4) Klipsch RP160MS, (4) JBL 8340As, (2) Yamaha P2500s amps, PS3, XBox One, (1) Asus mini pc, (2) Furman Power Conditioners, Darbee Darcet, and a Project RPM 1.5 Carbon turntable..
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post #12 of 21 Old 04-01-15, 11:55 AM
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Re: Improving my 2-channel sound - Part 2 (Yes, more help needed!)

I've used REW to determine SPL/FR and the like, but I admittedly don't know that much about the Impulse/Delay/Waterfall charts, although I have been trying to gain a better perspective of them by reading up.
I've looked at the boundary/Freq. chart, which is pretty clear, now I guess I need to do the string measurements.
My room has zero treatments, just a sofa and a rug......and it's small, I wish I had 7K to sort out, my current room is just over 1200!

Buying more cheap stuff to get better sound is like challenging a dragon with a pocket knife.
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post #13 of 21 Old 04-01-15, 01:54 PM
 
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Re: Improving my 2-channel sound - Part 2 (Yes, more help needed!)

Quote:
muzz wrote: View Post
I've used REW to determine SPL/FR and the like, but I admittedly don't know that much about the Impulse/Delay/Waterfall charts, although I have been trying to gain a better perspective of them by reading up.
I've looked at the boundary/Freq. chart, which is pretty clear, now I guess I need to do the string measurements.
My room has zero treatments, just a sofa and a rug......and it's small, I wish I had 7K to sort out, my current room is just over 1200!
there are a lot of knowledgeable people that know how to read/interpret the measurements out there. I am not one of them, and i just post up my results in the REW thread and ask for help to get what I need.

My Home Living room Theater
Samsung 65" FP, Yamaha CX-A5100, Xilica XP4080, (4) Klipsch RP160MS, (4) JBL 8340As, (2) Yamaha P2500s amps, PS3, XBox One, (1) Asus mini pc, (2) Furman Power Conditioners, Darbee Darcet, and a Project RPM 1.5 Carbon turntable..
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post #14 of 21 Old 04-01-15, 02:44 PM
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Re: Improving my 2-channel sound - Part 2 (Yes, more help needed!)

I have no idea how the room sounds....but WOW that is a great room, kudos to you and your family.
Thanks for sharing the photos, they paint a very different picture than the drawing.
When you started your other thread, I thought the Polk speakers were probably the biggest issue you had with your sound quality and later I even thought I was a little harsh in my assessment of those speakers.
When you replaced them I remember how happy you were with the new ones.
I know it's very easy (at least for me) to go into hyper problem solving mode....even if there is no problem to solve when it comes to almost anything I consider fun.
If you really think the sound still needs improvement I would recommend that you start out by really learning how to use REW, map your room, and then really put the effort into understanding what the plots are telling you.
I have intentionally resisted even considering using REW, I know myself, I am better off not knowing for sure what acoustic issues my room has.
Your room looks fab as is, if it were mine I would not really want to start putting up acoustic panels because even the best looking ones I have ever seen really are not all that good looking IMO.
Good luck and as long as you are having fun it's all good.
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post #15 of 21 Old 04-01-15, 03:31 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Improving my 2-channel sound - Part 2 (Yes, more help needed!)

Thanks Charlie. It is a great room, alot of fun, awesome for entertaining. I had just gotten it in my head it was flawed or far from ideal for really good 2-channel listening. I just didn't want to waste or diminish the new electrostats with acoustic problems that could be relatively easily corrected. I thought I had an idea what a few of them may have been, but wow, I was way off! After reading Audiocraver and Savjaks experience with the MLs and seeing what people like BlueLou have done with treatment, seemed like a logical next step for some improvement.

To be clear, I do really like the sound I have now, v-a-s-t improvement, and it has been a blast (albeit an expensive one). But where and when do you stop? I'm not good at stopping!!!

You were right on target about the Polks I had but giddy is probbaly a better word for the new speakers.

and yes, I am having fun! this is cool stuff

(btw, thats the first time I've ever used one of the smiley face things)
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post #16 of 21 Old 04-01-15, 03:46 PM
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If you measure your room and find glaring issues that could be fixed with acoustic panels would you be willing to put 3'x6'x4" thick (maybe larger or smaller) acoustic panels on the walls?
It's one thing to incorporate something like that into the decor of a dedicated HT or private listening room.
It's something pretty different to put it in your living area.

I would take a look at the GIK site, maybe there's something that appeals to you there.
You will at least see their standard packages and get an idea of sizes.
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post #17 of 21 Old 04-01-15, 03:59 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Improving my 2-channel sound - Part 2 (Yes, more help needed!)

I've been all over the GIK site...acoustimac and ats too. I was close yesterday to pulling the thread on a 3-4 of the 1'x4' 242 panels with the scatter plates to try behind the mains and beside the window. and, a couple of 244 traps for the rear corners, possibly one artsy diffusor for center of rear wall. but, decided to post this thread for opinions first. if there are no gains or negligible ones at best, that'd be great. I'll save the $$ for all the date nights that are now due and have to be cashed in. I've learned there is a price for WAF.
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post #18 of 21 Old 04-01-15, 04:07 PM
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Quote:
480dad wrote: View Post
... I had just gotten it in my head it was flawed or far from ideal for really good 2-channel listening.
Apologies. I think I egged you on. Others here reminded me of the back-to-basics approach. Speakers have greater impact on sound quality than room treatment.

Quote:
480dad wrote: View Post
... After reading Audiocraver and Savjaks experience with the MLs and seeing what people like BlueLou have done with treatment, seemed like a logical next step for some improvement.
It took me a lifetime to learn about and try treatments. They were my last step in getting off the upgrade merry-go-round. But extensive or expensive treatment is not right for everyone. You do what it takes. And I would any day take a properly set up system in an untreated room over a poorly set up system regardless of treatment.

Enjoy your new toys!

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post #19 of 21 Old 04-01-15, 05:20 PM
 
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Re: Improving my 2-channel sound - Part 2 (Yes, more help needed!)

When we built our HT (understand yours is not a dedicated room)... The room treatments made a huge difference. The treatments allow me to hear how the speakers really sound. I am now able to pick out details that I couldn't before, bass is much cleaner and deeper without the one note bass I have heard in the past. The sound stage is actually there now. Instruments are clear, and precise. If you don't want to spend the money for store bought ones, make your own. It is very easy and you can wrap them in whatever material you want to match your decor. I know that there are places that will print your art work on fabric (I think GIK might sell complete panels with artistic designs on them too). In my opinion it was the best audio upgrade in my system.

My Home Living room Theater
Samsung 65" FP, Yamaha CX-A5100, Xilica XP4080, (4) Klipsch RP160MS, (4) JBL 8340As, (2) Yamaha P2500s amps, PS3, XBox One, (1) Asus mini pc, (2) Furman Power Conditioners, Darbee Darcet, and a Project RPM 1.5 Carbon turntable..
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post #20 of 21 Old 04-01-15, 05:56 PM
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Re: Improving my 2-channel sound - Part 2 (Yes, more help needed!)

Quote:
480dad wrote: View Post
Quote:
Wayne A. Pflughaupt wrote: View Post
By contrast, I’ll bet your bass doesn’t audibly change much at any TV viewing seat you sit in, does it?
actually I do hear differences, louder in spots, muddier in spots, definitely more in the corners.
Are you talking about various areas all over the room? I was talking specifically about the seating someone might be watching the TV from – the couch, the “his and hers” chairs, the love seat. Sorry if I was unclear...

So again, does the bass sound fairly consistent in all the viewing seats, or is it audibly different from one location to the next? (I expect the wife’s seat would have the biggest difference from the others, if any, as it’s closer to the wall.)

Quote:
im not worried about pefect bass in all LPs. just want cleaner, tighter, more consistent bass. The 2nd sub should solve this?
That’s what I hear, that additional subs help get even bass distribution. However, AFAIK this only works in rooms that are fairly symmetrical and have symmetrical equipment layout as well. So I have my doubts that it would work well in your room.

As far as “tighter” bass goes, parametric equalization makes a big improvement there, if you aren’t using it already.

Regards,
Wayne



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