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-   -   When is room treatment needed (https://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/home-audio-acoustics/37531-when-room-treatment-needed.html)

marty1 12-27-10 04:25 AM

When is room treatment needed
 

My room is bare wall apart from blackout curtains almost all the way along 1 side of the room where the windows are. The walls are plasterboard with brick underneath (I think :scratch:). The ceiling is plasterboard and the floor is carpeted.

I do have slap echo in the room but in general I love the sound from my system. So how do I know whether it will be worth putting accoustic panels and bass traps up?

Do I just put a couple of panels up at the first reflection point and that is it, just enough to maybe get rid of the slap echo, or do I go for broke and put bass traps in the 4 corners of the room, absorbant panels around the front 3rd of the room, absorb/diffuse combi panels along the bare side wall and diffusers on the rear wall and diffusers on the ceiling.

In general do you just treat where necessary or can you fill the room with treatment like I suggested above and assume that would give you the best balance of sound overall. I like to keep things as simple as possible (so my simple brain can deal with things better :rolleyesno:) so I would prefer, if possible, a straight instruction as opposed to, put one panel up see how that sounds, put another one up, see how that sounds etc etc.

I am on a tight budget so I would rather know exactly what I need to put up, if I even need to put any up at all. I have spent a lot of time with REW trying to get the best out my sub, I found that quite a draining process so if there is simple way of achieving good quality sound that I will notice a big difference from the good sound I am hearing now, without measuring all the time that would be great.

I would really appreciate your advice :help:

Kind Regards
Marty

grn1969c10 12-27-10 10:36 AM

Re: When is room treatment needed
 

Quote:

I would prefer, if possible, a straight instruction as opposed to, put one panel up see how that sounds
You may get generalized advice on which type of room treatments can help with the echo, but I don't expect you to get the specific answer you want with so little information given. Room treatments vary considerably based on the frequency range of the problem you wish to correct. You could examine the waterfall graphs you have and determine which frequencies have the biggest decay problems.

I don't have personal experience solving that particular problem, but I'm guessing it involves the higher frequencies well above the sub range and will require broadband treatments. knowing if you are using a measurement microphone or a sound level meter to obtain measurements would indicate how useful your full range measurements could be. Since your room is apparently non-symmetrical, you might consider posting a layout drawing with measurements so people have an idea on what your dealing with. An acceptable budget and WAF factors which must be adhered to might help people give you more helpful suggestions as well.

Matt

marty1 12-27-10 12:01 PM

Re: When is room treatment needed
 

5 Attachment(s)
I have put a 360 of my room although the rear bipole speakers behind the couch are now further apart and closer to the corners:

Attachment 26523

Attachment 26524

Attachment 26525

Attachment 26526

Attachment 26527

bpape 12-27-10 05:58 PM

Re: When is room treatment needed
 

Broadband bass absorption floor to ceiling in the 2 front corners. I'd also do some in the shorter left rear corner.

I would add at least 2-3 2" 2'x4' absorption panels on the left wall to bring better left to right symmetry by matching better with the curtains on the other side.

Ideally, the front wall would also be 100% dead to help with boundary interactions and to prevent reflections from the surround channels contaminating the front soundstage.

Bryan

marty1 12-28-10 06:58 AM

Re: When is room treatment needed
 

Quote:

bpape wrote: (Post 332346)
Broadband bass absorption floor to ceiling in the 2 front corners. I'd also do some in the shorter left rear corner.

I would add at least 2-3 2" 2'x4' absorption panels on the left wall to bring better left to right symmetry by matching better with the curtains on the other side.

Ideally, the front wall would also be 100% dead to help with boundary interactions and to prevent reflections from the surround channels contaminating the front soundstage.

Bryan

So do you mean put absorbant panels all around the screen?

Also would anything be needed for the back wall, as these 2 speakers are bipoles they need to rely on the reflective surfaces?

Will all of this be a massive improvement to the sound?

Will I have to move my sub again once putting bass traps in as I have a pretty good response at the moment and it will be a pain to start over again?

Thanks
Marty

bpape 12-28-10 07:17 AM

Re: When is room treatment needed
 

If you've played with sub position to get the best response, the chances of having to move it a lot more are pretty slim. Maybe some slight improvements to be had with slight movements but nothing that you'd have to do right away certainly - or possibly not at all.

Yes - ideally, the front wall would be 100% covered with absorbing material.

Rear wall - not so much other than potentially some membrane type absorbers if you have problems with cancellations in the bass off of the rear wall. Those types will still allow the surround field to sound lively.

Bryan

marty1 12-28-10 03:07 PM

Re: When is room treatment needed
 

Quote:

bpape wrote: (Post 332459)
If you've played with sub position to get the best response, the chances of having to move it a lot more are pretty slim. Maybe some slight improvements to be had with slight movements but nothing that you'd have to do right away certainly - or possibly not at all.

Yes - ideally, the front wall would be 100% covered with absorbing material.

Rear wall - not so much other than potentially some membrane type absorbers if you have problems with cancellations in the bass off of the rear wall. Those types will still allow the surround field to sound lively.

Bryan

Thanks Bryan

How do I tell if I have bass cancellations with the bass from the rear wall?

The membrane type absorbers, where would they go, if you look at rear speakers and then imagine that they are now both further apart, about 1.5 feet from each side wall, these speakers are bipoles so would the membrane absorbers reflect the sound like bipoles are supposed to?

Kind Regards
Marty

bpape 12-29-10 09:56 AM

Re: When is room treatment needed
 

All I'm looking for in the back is something that will absorb bass but not as much in the upper mids and highs to preserve the surround field.

If you move your mic forward or backward from the seating position, do you notice any nulls going away or changing in frequency? If either, then you have potential rear wall problems.

Bryan

marty1 12-29-10 01:42 PM

Re: When is room treatment needed
 

Quote:

bpape wrote: (Post 332756)
All I'm looking for in the back is something that will absorb bass but not as much in the upper mids and highs to preserve the surround field.

If you move your mic forward or backward from the seating position, do you notice any nulls going away or changing in frequency? If either, then you have potential rear wall problems.

Bryan

I did notice that there was a dip around 35-40hz that got steeper as I moved further away from the rear wall, about 2 feet from the rear wall seemed better. I still have to try out rew v5 properly, I tried it the other day and the results were different to what I got in version 4 so I still dont know how to use v5?

Thanks
Marty

bpape 12-29-10 01:55 PM

Re: When is room treatment needed
 

Probably just a change in mic position. Or, could be you have smoothing set differently.

Bryan


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