JBL 8320 for Atmos ceiling speakers? - Home Theater Forum and Systems - HomeTheaterShack.com

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post #1 of 14 Old 07-29-15, 12:13 PM Thread Starter
 
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JBL 8320 for Atmos ceiling speakers?

I have JBL 8340A speakers for my surrounds, and was planning on using them for the ceiling but it will be an 11" drop from our 8' ceiling. I see that the JBL 8320 speakers are around 2" or more smaller in every dimension... Does anyone know if these would be a good choice for me for Atmos? They are less than 1/2 the price of the 8340A speakers.

http://www.amazon.com/JBL-Compact-Su.../dp/B009NN4MZO

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Samsung 65" FP, Yamaha CX-A5100, Xilica XP4080, (4) Klipsch RP160MS, (4) JBL 8340As, (2) Yamaha P2500s amps, PS3, XBox One, (1) Asus mini pc, (2) Furman Power Conditioners, Darbee Darcet, and a Project RPM 1.5 Carbon turntable..
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post #2 of 14 Old 07-29-15, 01:33 PM
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Re: JBL 8320 for Atmos ceiling speakers?

Assuming your ears are roughly 40-45 inches from the floor when seated, and subtracting let's say 10" more with the speaker installed, your top channels will only be about 3.5ft-4ft above your head. From my experience, that's too close for any surround channel. I can't say whether or not those JBLs would make good Atmos overhead channels, though I assume they'd work perfectly fine. This is a case where I'd strongly recommend flush mounted (if not recessed) in-ceiling speakers. I have read that the Atmos enabled speakers (point up, bounce sound off ceiling) are also better suited to installations with lower ceilings, though I have not personally tested the theory.


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post #3 of 14 Old 07-29-15, 03:17 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: JBL 8320 for Atmos ceiling speakers?

Quote:
Peter Loeser wrote: View Post
Assuming your ears are roughly 40-45 inches from the floor when seated, and subtracting let's say 10" more with the speaker installed, your top channels will only be about 3.5ft-4ft above your head. From my experience, that's too close for any surround channel. I can't say whether or not those JBLs would make good Atmos overhead channels, though I assume they'd work perfectly fine. This is a case where I'd strongly recommend flush mounted (if not recessed) in-ceiling speakers. I have read that the Atmos enabled speakers (point up, bounce sound off ceiling) are also better suited to installations with lower ceilings, though I have not personally tested the theory.
Problem is I can't do in-ceiling speakers or I lose my whole seal in the ceiling. My ceiling is 8' 3" with my first reflection panels hanging 6" from the ceiling... if I go with the 8320 the speakers will be about 3-4" lower than the panels. Would lowering the level of the Atmos channels make them seem farther away? I don't have a situation where the upward firing speakers would work either as I have JBL 8340A speakers for the surrounds. The surrounds are firing downward (angled) from about 1' from the ceiling. I was hoping I could find some 6" or shallower speakers for Atmos that are 91db or more efficient, Some of the Atmos presentation pictures I have seen use I believe the JBL 8340A (or a similar model), but of course they have high ceilings.

My Home Living room Theater
Samsung 65" FP, Yamaha CX-A5100, Xilica XP4080, (4) Klipsch RP160MS, (4) JBL 8340As, (2) Yamaha P2500s amps, PS3, XBox One, (1) Asus mini pc, (2) Furman Power Conditioners, Darbee Darcet, and a Project RPM 1.5 Carbon turntable..
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post #4 of 14 Old 07-29-15, 03:47 PM
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Re: JBL 8320 for Atmos ceiling speakers?

I think the audio dispersion area would be one of the top criteria for choosing an overhead speaker in your situation. Does one of those speakers have a bigger, more even dispersion area than the other?

I would not lower volume gain for the overhead speakers, it would throw off the correct balance of surround audio. If the overhead speakers are too close and have a narrow dispersion area, causing hot spots, maybe overhead speakers just aren't in the cards for that setup.

Maybe multiple rows of overhead speakers could disperse sound more evenly. Similar to having multiple rows of side surround speakers in longer/deeper seating areas.
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post #5 of 14 Old 07-29-15, 04:40 PM
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Re: JBL 8320 for Atmos ceiling speakers?

With your surrounds that close to the ceiling, I don't honestly think the addition of Atmos overhead speakers would make a very noticeable difference. I'm not saying you shouldn't try, but don't expect to be shocked by the improvement. You have a few factors working against you.

Ignoring the vertical distance from the listening position, where would the Atmos speaker be located horizontally, relative to the listener? i.e. 2ft in front of MLP, 3ft behind MPL, etc. If they're ahead of the MLP, you'll get some vertical separation between your mains and overhead speakers, which could help make the Atmos objects stand out a bit more.


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post #6 of 14 Old 07-29-15, 06:29 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: JBL 8320 for Atmos ceiling speakers?

Quote:
Peter Loeser wrote: View Post
With your surrounds that close to the ceiling, I don't honestly think the addition of Atmos overhead speakers would make a very noticeable difference. I'm not saying you shouldn't try, but don't expect to be shocked by the improvement. You have a few factors working against you.

Ignoring the vertical distance from the listening position, where would the Atmos speaker be located horizontally, relative to the listener? i.e. 2ft in front of MLP, 3ft behind MPL, etc. If they're ahead of the MLP, you'll get some vertical separation between your mains and overhead speakers, which could help make the Atmos objects stand out a bit more.
One pair would be about 7' in front of the MLP, and the other pair about 2' behind the MLP. I had planned on all of the Atmos speakers pointing directly downward instead of angled like I have seen some do.

My Home Living room Theater
Samsung 65" FP, Yamaha CX-A5100, Xilica XP4080, (4) Klipsch RP160MS, (4) JBL 8340As, (2) Yamaha P2500s amps, PS3, XBox One, (1) Asus mini pc, (2) Furman Power Conditioners, Darbee Darcet, and a Project RPM 1.5 Carbon turntable..
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post #7 of 14 Old 07-30-15, 10:07 AM
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Re: JBL 8320 for Atmos ceiling speakers?

I was re-reading the Atmos installation guidelines. It looks like they've added some details since I went through the process in my HT. Here are some relevant points.

Quote:
If possible, the height of the rear speakers should be the same as the height of the front speakers. If the room design makes this impractical, or impossible, the rear speakers may be higher than the front speakers. However, we suggest that the height of the rear speakers not be more than 1.25 times the height of the front
speakers.
This will impact the perceived vertical separation between listener level objects and overhead objects. How close will your surrounds be to the top rear speakers?

Quote:
The overhead speakers should be at least two times the height of the listenerís ear level.
You're on the border here. A few extra inches of height would be good, but I think it's close enough that you're probably ok. I'm assuming about 40-42" seated ear level for you.


Quote:
If the chosen overhead speakers have a wide dispersion pattern (approximately 45 degrees from the acoustical reference axis over the audio band from 100 Hz to 10 kHz or wider), then speakers may be mounted facing directly downward. For speakers with narrower dispersion patterns, those with aimable or angled elements should be angled toward the primary listening position.
I'll admit a general lack of understanding of horn-loaded driver dispersion, but I think this may be a factor in the case of your top front channels.


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post #8 of 14 Old 07-30-15, 10:55 AM
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Quote:
ellisr63 wrote: View Post
Problem is I can't do in-ceiling speakers or I lose my whole seal in the ceiling. My ceiling is 8' 3" with my first reflection panels hanging 6" from the ceiling... if I go with the 8320 the speakers will be about 3-4" lower than the panels. Would lowering the level of the Atmos channels make them seem farther away? I don't have a situation where the upward firing speakers would work either as I have JBL 8340A speakers for the surrounds. The surrounds are firing downward (angled) from about 1' from the ceiling. I was hoping I could find some 6" or shallower speakers for Atmos that are 91db or more efficient, Some of the Atmos presentation pictures I have seen use I believe the JBL 8340A (or a similar model), but of course they have high ceilings.
I wonder if changing the distance settings (setting them higher than they actually are) in the processor would be a possible solution to low ceilings.

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post #9 of 14 Old 07-30-15, 11:03 AM Thread Starter
 
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Re: JBL 8320 for Atmos ceiling speakers?

Quote:
Peter Loeser wrote: View Post
I was re-reading the Atmos installation guidelines. It looks like they've added some details since I went through the process in my HT. Here are some relevant points.


This will impact the perceived vertical separation between listener level objects and overhead objects. How close will your surrounds be to the top rear speakers?


You're on the border here. A few extra inches of height would be good, but I think it's close enough that you're probably ok. I'm assuming about 40-42" seated ear level for you.


I'll admit a general lack of understanding of horn-loaded driver dispersion, but I think this may be a factor in the case of your top front channels.
My rear surrounds will be the same height as the side surrounds...like my surrounds were sitting on top of my front channels as large tweeters (a little above but not too much, and they will be angled toward the MLP).


My ear level is 36" in the front row.

The dispersion is 90-100 degrees from 400Hz to 12Khz.

My Home Living room Theater
Samsung 65" FP, Yamaha CX-A5100, Xilica XP4080, (4) Klipsch RP160MS, (4) JBL 8340As, (2) Yamaha P2500s amps, PS3, XBox One, (1) Asus mini pc, (2) Furman Power Conditioners, Darbee Darcet, and a Project RPM 1.5 Carbon turntable..
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post #10 of 14 Old 07-30-15, 11:04 AM Thread Starter
 
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Re: JBL 8320 for Atmos ceiling speakers?

Quote:
vidiot33 wrote: View Post
I wonder if changing the distance settings (setting them higher than they actually are) in the processor would be a possible solution to low ceilings.

Sent from my iPhone using HTShack
Don't know.

My Home Living room Theater
Samsung 65" FP, Yamaha CX-A5100, Xilica XP4080, (4) Klipsch RP160MS, (4) JBL 8340As, (2) Yamaha P2500s amps, PS3, XBox One, (1) Asus mini pc, (2) Furman Power Conditioners, Darbee Darcet, and a Project RPM 1.5 Carbon turntable..
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