Driver Phase Alignment Technique Clarification - Home Theater Forum and Systems - HomeTheaterShack.com

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post #1 of 7 Old 12-14-18, 04:40 PM Thread Starter
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Driver Phase Alignment Technique Clarification

I am trying to 'optimize' the performance of my main speakers by phase aligning the drivers. System is actively crossed as follows.
Top end is an Oris horn with Tang Band 8" driver crossed at 204hz using L/R 24db xover, covering 204hz-20kHz.
Next is 15" woofer open baffle crossed from 102hz-204hz using L/R 24db xover.
Bottom end is an actively controlled subwoofer 20hz-102hz using L/R 24db xover.

My goal is to wring out the very last bit of performance by phase aligning the Oris and 15" woofer, which are located very close, one on top of the other.
Questions are:
Where should I place the mic for proper testing? Near speakers, or at LP?
I am assuming I run the sweeps with the appropriate xovers in place. If so, does each driver get the sweep run from 20hz-20khz?

In playing with this, I noticed that if I truncate the sweep around the xover region, the time delay changes for the drivers.

Hopefully the questions aren't confusing.

DIY Mains, Oris 150 and Oris 250 horns, actively crossed with Ashly 4.8SP. QSC and Behringer pro amps. Integra DHC 9.9 Pre/Pro, Oppo BD-93 Blu Ray. Side Effects - Klipsch Pro Cinema, 4 LFE Subs - Full Marty DIY build. 7.1 setup, Projector - Panasonic PT-AE4000U, Dalite HP screen. HTPC for lossles .flac audio.
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post #2 of 7 Old 12-15-18, 07:59 AM
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Re: Driver Phase Alignment Technique Clarification

There have been some good older threads on this, e.g. https://www.hometheatershack.com/for...lay-phase.html and https://www.hometheatershack.com/for...e-aligned.html

The group delay plot can be helpful in aligning drivers.

Measure full range, or at least well beyond the range of the driver, otherwise the reduced range of the sweep creates an artificial truncation of the response which is akin to having a very sharp low pass filter cascaded with the system, with its corresponding phase shift and group delay.
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post #3 of 7 Old 12-15-18, 08:28 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Driver Phase Alignment Technique Clarification

JohnM, I'll look into those threads. The thread I have most looked at is this one: https://www.hometheatershack.com/for...5-example.html which uses a nearfield mic position. Does it make a difference if the phase is checked nearfield or at the listening position?

DIY Mains, Oris 150 and Oris 250 horns, actively crossed with Ashly 4.8SP. QSC and Behringer pro amps. Integra DHC 9.9 Pre/Pro, Oppo BD-93 Blu Ray. Side Effects - Klipsch Pro Cinema, 4 LFE Subs - Full Marty DIY build. 7.1 setup, Projector - Panasonic PT-AE4000U, Dalite HP screen. HTPC for lossles .flac audio.
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post #4 of 7 Old 12-15-18, 09:01 AM
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Re: Driver Phase Alignment Technique Clarification

If you are measuring individual drivers distance isn't that critical, as long as it is the same for all. If measuring with both drivers active would want to be far enough away for them to integrate properly, but 1m is common.
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post #5 of 7 Old 12-15-18, 12:34 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Driver Phase Alignment Technique Clarification

Just for future reference, I found an excellent article addressing this specific question:

https://www.prosoundweb.com/channels...ivers_in_sync/

DIY Mains, Oris 150 and Oris 250 horns, actively crossed with Ashly 4.8SP. QSC and Behringer pro amps. Integra DHC 9.9 Pre/Pro, Oppo BD-93 Blu Ray. Side Effects - Klipsch Pro Cinema, 4 LFE Subs - Full Marty DIY build. 7.1 setup, Projector - Panasonic PT-AE4000U, Dalite HP screen. HTPC for lossles .flac audio.
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post #6 of 7 Old 12-21-18, 06:40 AM
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Re: Driver Phase Alignment Technique Clarification

Hi Rudy,
When I did my system I measured all drivers at 1 meter first to know what the speakers are doing, then I measured from the LP to see what the room was doing to the sound.
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post #7 of 7 Old 12-30-18, 10:19 AM
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Re: Driver Phase Alignment Technique Clarification

Hi Rudy,
Yes:
  • For drivers mounted on the same baffle a 0.05-1.5 m mic distance from the baffle is a good choice. Since your speakers look pretty large I suggest something in the range of 1-1.5 m would be best. The height of the mic should be on, or close to, the line of sight from the LP to the horn to this case. [A mic positioned at the LP can work, but room effects can sometimes make the job more confusing.] If the SW is near the main speaker being measured, then the same mic location can be used for the SW timing as well. For a SW placed well away from the main, it is required to place the mic at the LP for the main to SW timing. We can just deal with the additional difficulty in analysis.

  • All 3 XO's must be active for each individual driver measurement.

  • Use the same full range sweep for each driver measurement. Full range means the range that the overall system is designed to handle. Do not push the low end or top end higher than the speaker system is designed to handle. 20-20k would be good for your setup.

There are various ways to determine the delay timing needed between the driver pairs. I can provide support for the method I use.
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