Maelstrom-x 21" 15cu Sealed Build! - Page 9 - Home Theater Forum and Systems - HomeTheaterShack.com

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post #81 of 225 Old 11-27-09, 01:20 AM
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Re: Maelstrom-x 21" 15cu Sealed Build!

dude, where's the final pics. If youre holding out till u can make it "pretty", come on man... we've all seen naked enclosures. I'm not gonna ride you about vids, I can let that slide, but come on can we at least see sime final 21" in-box pics please?
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post #82 of 225 Old 11-27-09, 12:41 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Maelstrom-x 21" 15cu Sealed Build!

Well, how I have it positioned in the living room, you don't see the driver because it's pointed towards the front corner. I'll have to pull it out tonight and take some photos of it. I should get off my butt and find my mixing board and mic so I can measure it as well...so I'll get some photos tonight.
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post #83 of 225 Old 11-30-09, 11:45 AM
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Re: Maelstrom-x 21" 15cu Sealed Build!

can't wait to see some pics! Have you listened to any music and watched anymore movies? How is your impressions today with more listening time?
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post #84 of 225 Old 11-30-09, 12:35 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Maelstrom-x 21" 15cu Sealed Build!

My fiance was out of town over the weekend, and I got her parents to take the (very large) puppy so I could get some work done around the house. I started working on running 3/4" conduit from the mains panel towards the home theater, but the main reason I was working all weekend was to strip wallpaper, paint, and overall "refresh" the fiance's bathroom as a surprise. I'm really beat...and I realize I hate oil based primers....

That said, in between contact highs of two coats of oil based primer, I watched a couple older movies and a couple newer (non-action) movies. The sub fills in very well no matter how I used it. I also listen to a bunch of electronic and ambient music while I painted, and again, the M-21 really fills in the bottom end well without overpowering the rest of the system. I've also watched a few episodes of "V" and "Heroes" and "Flashforward"...I guess I'm getting so used to the sub really adding depth to everything I watch and hear, that I forgot how weak the really low end was with my old sub. I find myself catching sub-20Hz ambient and percussive sounds that I never knew where there before!

All that said, I'm a bit concerned with the "speed" of the woofer. "speed" as always been described to me as the speed at which the sub can change pitch, keeping up with the mains. The larger the sub, the less speed it typically has and the more it seems separate from the mains. The M-21 seems to blend well with the mains, but doesn't seem to do so as seamlessly as my folded horn did. And there are people on both sides of the fence on if "speed" really exists or it's just audiophile mumbo-jumbo.

Again, all this is just my impressions from casual listening...I hope to know more, and get some guidance after I take some measurements. This weekend was just not the time for measurements, though I did get a couple photos I'll post up tonight...I just need to download them from my camera.

Also, for those that were asking about videos...I'm going to borrow a cheap point and shoot that has some basic video capturing capabilities, and see what I can get out of that. It may take me a bit to figure that out, and I don't believe my online photo gallery will accept video...so I may have some work there as well.

I'll update as I have something solid to show.

Last edited by Lonely Raven; 11-30-09 at 01:30 PM.
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post #85 of 225 Old 11-30-09, 12:46 PM
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Re: Maelstrom-x 21" 15cu Sealed Build!

sounds great thanks for the update. If you had to do it all over again would you change your mind on what you have now?
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post #86 of 225 Old 11-30-09, 01:35 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Maelstrom-x 21" 15cu Sealed Build!

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jreaves1637 wrote: View Post
sounds great thanks for the update. If you had to do it all over again would you change your mind on what you have now?
It's hard to say.

Kevin recommended 12 cu ft, and I went more like 16 cu ft, well beyond the point of diminishing returns, but not quite large enough to go LLT cabinet. Sometimes I feel like I should *feel* more output below 20Hz, but maybe I'm just expecting too much (due to my large room with connecting hallways and stairs that I can't close off).

I'd love to have tried an M-18 in LLT and directly compared it to my M-21 sealed.

Again, I've not taken any measurements...so my wanting more 15Hz could just be me not really understanding what 15Hz feels and sounds like. Maybe I have PLENTY and I'm sitting in a dead spot. So till I get measurements and make sure I have the best sub placement, I really can't say if I built the perfect sub for me, or if I should have gone with Steve's suggestion of an 18" LLT, or other suggestions of tapped horn, or dual 18 sealed or so on and so forth.

I'm not disappointed, I'm just wondering what difference I would get in an 18" LLT. And if I had the cash, I'd build one just to compare and sell what I thought didn't suit me as well.
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post #87 of 225 Old 11-30-09, 01:44 PM
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Re: Maelstrom-x 21" 15cu Sealed Build!

Quote:
Lonely Raven wrote: View Post
All that said, I'm a bit concerned with the "speed" of the woofer. "speed" as always been described to me as the speed at which the sub can change pitch, keeping up with the mains. The larger the sub, the less speed it typically has and the more it seems separate from the mains. The M-21 seems to blend well with the mains, but doesn't seem to do so as seamlessly as my folded horn did. And there are people on both sides of the fence on if "speed" really exists or it's just audiophile mumbo-jumbo.

Again, all this is just my impressions from casual listening...I hope to know more, and get some guidance after I take some measurements. This weekend was just not the time for measurements, though I did get a couple photos I'll post up tonight...I just need to download them from my camera. .
It's likely to be the blend between the sub and mains, or the room, or the overall FR could have a resonance somewhere. It's possible that there is a bad enclosure resonance sometimes, but probably not the driver/cabinet itself. When you get around to investigating that it'll probably show up somewhere.
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post #88 of 225 Old 11-30-09, 01:54 PM
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Re: Maelstrom-x 21" 15cu Sealed Build!

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Lonely Raven wrote: View Post
It's hard to say.

Kevin recommended 12 cu ft, and I went more like 16 cu ft, well beyond the point of diminishing returns, but not quite large enough to go LLT cabinet. Sometimes I feel like I should *feel* more output below 20Hz, but maybe I'm just expecting too much (due to my large room with connecting hallways and stairs that I can't close off).

I'd love to have tried an M-18 in LLT and directly compared it to my M-21 sealed.

Again, I've not taken any measurements...so my wanting more 15Hz could just be me not really understanding what 15Hz feels and sounds like. Maybe I have PLENTY and I'm sitting in a dead spot. So till I get measurements and make sure I have the best sub placement, I really can't say if I built the perfect sub for me, or if I should have gone with Steve's suggestion of an 18" LLT, or other suggestions of tapped horn, or dual 18 sealed or so on and so forth.

I'm not disappointed, I'm just wondering what difference I would get in an 18" LLT. And if I had the cash, I'd build one just to compare and sell what I thought didn't suit me as well.

Sounds reasonable. What I have learned is you ask a question and pretty much you will get a different answer from just about anyone. Each person has different tastes etc. Soon as I finish my room I can't wait to see what a sealed 21 in a 12cu ft box will do in my 2800cu ft room.
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post #89 of 225 Old 11-30-09, 02:17 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Maelstrom-x 21" 15cu Sealed Build!

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Ricci wrote: View Post
It's likely to be the blend between the sub and mains, or the room, or the overall FR could have a resonance somewhere. It's possible that there is a bad enclosure resonance sometimes, but probably not the driver/cabinet itself. When you get around to investigating that it'll probably show up somewhere.
And there could be completely nothing wrong. As I said, I'm not used to subsonic frequencies, so I'm relearning what bass is. Steve C was right about that!

On a side note; I called a local music shop who specializes in live sound installs and asked if they have the FBQ-2496 in stock. He basically laughed and said all Behringer stuff was and why would I want to use that in my home theater. When I explained that a whole sub-culture of DIY sub builders have been using the B amps and EQs successfully for years, he LOL'd and said something along the lines of "they must not have very good taste...you won't find that here"

Ask 20 people, get 20 different asnwers. LOL
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post #90 of 225 Old 11-30-09, 02:57 PM
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Re: Maelstrom-x 21" 15cu Sealed Build!

Actually, the larger the subwoofer enclosure, the less driver ringing there will be, so while there isn't really any "speed" to talk about, there is delayed energy, and a larger sub will have less of it.

A FR at the seat will answer a lot of questions


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