LMS-R 12 sealed ~1 cu ft - Home Theater Forum and Systems - HomeTheaterShack.com
 
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post #1 of 10 Old 05-10-13, 01:14 PM Thread Starter
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LMS-R 12 sealed ~1 cu ft

I'd like a small pair of subs for HT and was wondering how sealed cubes based on the LMS-R would stack up against some of the nicer commercial subs I'm considering. Obviously price is better for DIY (assuming its DIY and not 'DDDDDDDDIY'), but I'm more interested in performance available in a small enclosure. The measurements for the sealed LMS-R 12" on data-bass caught my interest for such a small enclosure (99dB @20Hz/20% THD & [email protected]/10%THD). Even with just one of these, it appears to provide a bit more low-end output than the commercial offerings I'm considering (Rythmik F12/E15, SVS SB13U)... the latter two may be very near the measured output of the LMS-R in a 1.25cuft enclosure, but there is no way I could get two of either of those past my better half (or my better senses from a budget perspective). Does anyone here have ears-on experience with the LMS-R 12" in a small sealed enclosure? If so, what were your impressions in regards to the sound quality? It appears to measure very well, so I'm surprised to not see more projects with it in a small sealed box, and am left wondering if I am overlooking something (e.g. integration or EQ difficulty).
Thanks in advance!
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post #2 of 10 Old 05-10-13, 06:20 PM
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Re: LMS-R 12 sealed ~1 cu ft

I have no experience with the LMS-R or the SDX12 but both are quality drivers. The LMS-R is $370 while a pair of SDX12's is $520. Both are modeled with 1500 watts.

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post #3 of 10 Old 05-10-13, 09:11 PM
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Re: LMS-R 12 sealed ~1 cu ft

I have always wanted to try the LMS-R series but in the 15" which is out of stock until next month. I did have a pair of the TC Sounds Axis 12" which I really liked when used with full range speakers.

The recommended box size for the LMS-R 15" is only 1.5 cuft, that's not much different than the 1 cuft enclosure. The advantage you would have with the 15" though is more output for the same power, it is about twice as loud from 30hz on up for an enclosure that is not much bigger.

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post #4 of 10 Old 05-10-13, 10:11 PM Thread Starter
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Re: LMS-R 12 sealed ~1 cu ft

Quote:
sub_crazy wrote: View Post
I have always wanted to try the LMS-R series but in the 15" which is out of stock until next month. I did have a pair of the TC Sounds Axis 12" which I really liked when used with full range speakers.

The recommended box size for the LMS-R 15" is only 1.5 cuft, that's not much different than the 1 cuft enclosure. The advantage you would have with the 15" though is more output for the same power, it is about twice as loud from 30hz on up for an enclosure that is not much bigger.
Anyone care to sim/model that vs the 12"?
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post #5 of 10 Old 05-10-13, 10:34 PM
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Re: LMS-R 12 sealed ~1 cu ft

I did do a quick model but the computer I was on didn't facilitate pasting the model to this thread.

If I have a chance I will post one tomorrow.

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post #6 of 10 Old 05-16-13, 05:15 PM Thread Starter
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Re: LMS-R 12 sealed ~1 cu ft

Quote:
sub_crazy wrote: View Post
I did do a quick model but the computer I was on didn't facilitate pasting the model to this thread.

If I have a chance I will post one tomorrow.
Would still appreciate a comparison if you are willing... nothing urgent since they are both O.O.S. at P.E
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post #7 of 10 Old 05-16-13, 06:05 PM
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Re: LMS-R 12 sealed ~1 cu ft

Here is a quick comparison. The 12" is in a 1cuft and the 15" 1.5cuft, both driven by 1500 watts. You can see the 15" has a 3db advantage from about 30hz on up and still has a 1.5db advantage at 10hz. The bigger difference as well is you are topped out for power with the 12", the 15" can take even more power, almost double. I just wanted to compare with the same power to show how more efficient the 15" is for only a slightly bigger enclosure.

Really it shouldn't be surprising, TC subs are generally made to play deep in small sealed enclosures.

Red is the 15" and blue is the 12":


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post #8 of 10 Old 05-16-13, 06:43 PM Thread Starter
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Re: LMS-R 12 sealed ~1 cu ft

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sub_crazy wrote: View Post
Here is a quick comparison. The 12" is in a 1cuft and the 15" 1.5cuft, both driven by 1500 watts. You can see the 15" has a 3db advantage from about 30hz on up and still has a 1.5db advantage at 10hz. The bigger difference as well is you are topped out for power with the 12", the 15" can take even more power, almost double. I just wanted to compare with the same power to show how more efficient the 15" is for only a slightly bigger enclosure.

Really it shouldn't be surprising, TC subs are generally made to play deep in small sealed enclosures.

Red is the 15" and blue is the 12":

Thanks... I'm not sure I understand the power comment, though. TC Sounds has them spec'd identically in that regard 1000W RMS, 4000W peak
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post #9 of 10 Old 05-16-13, 09:36 PM
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Re: LMS-R 12 sealed ~1 cu ft

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dougri wrote: View Post
Thanks... I'm not sure I understand the power comment, though. TC Sounds has them spec'd identically in that regard 1000W RMS, 4000W peak
When designing subs there is a excursion graph as well that tells you how much power you can safely feed the sub based on enclosure size, filters and other factors. I design sub systems so that the max power reaches xmax at 10hz without any filters. If you design a larger enclosure you use less power and a smaller enclosure equals more power handling as the airspace of the sealed enclosure helps to control how much the cone moves.

I really am swamped right now until the end of the month so I hope I explained it well. There is a lot of great info around this forum though to help you understand subwoofer design and a bunch of great people to help. I will check in every so often but sometimes it might take me a couple of days to respond

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post #10 of 10 Old 05-17-13, 01:12 PM Thread Starter
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Re: LMS-R 12 sealed ~1 cu ft

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sub_crazy wrote: View Post
When designing subs there is a excursion graph as well that tells you how much power you can safely feed the sub based on enclosure size, filters and other factors. I design sub systems so that the max power reaches xmax at 10hz without any filters. If you design a larger enclosure you use less power and a smaller enclosure equals more power handling as the airspace of the sealed enclosure helps to control how much the cone moves.

I really am swamped right now until the end of the month so I hope I explained it well. There is a lot of great info around this forum though to help you understand subwoofer design and a bunch of great people to help. I will check in every so often but sometimes it might take me a couple of days to respond
Thanks... that explains it well enough.
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