TC Sounds LMS-5400 18" sealed 75L vs. 200L *special test* - Page 2 - Home Theater Forum and Systems - HomeTheaterShack.com

 
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post #11 of 23 Old 07-27-08, 09:51 AM Thread Starter
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Re: TC Sounds LMS-5400 18" sealed 75L vs. 200L *special test*

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ISLAND1000 wrote: View Post
Thanks for choosing this particular issue to clarify by your testing process. It adds much to our understanding of the moving cone / magnet audio reproducer.
Your tests using the LMS 5400 also answered a long standing question I had regarding whether or not my own LMS 5400 was bottoming from extreme excursion at low frequencies or was it the amp (XTi 4000) that was going into clipping or protection that made horrible noises. From your testing experience using a CE 4000 with the LMS 5400 and noting the clipping or near clipping of the amp at high levels of VLF I now can conclude it was the XTi 4000 and NOT the LMS 5400 that was the weak link in the audio chain. The LMS 5400 is capable of pulling huge amounts of electrical energy from the amp attempting to reproduce high volume VLF, more than the amp, in your case a CE 4000, could handle.
Hi Phil,

IIRC your box was pretty close to 200L? I was able to clip the CE4000 only with the 75L box, not 200L. I could have bottomed out the driver in the 200L box if I could have wanted. Remember that the +6 dB boost (at the low end) required by the smaller box means 4x the power. So for example when the 75L version was pulling 3000W at 8 Hz, the 200L was cruising only with 750W.
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post #12 of 23 Old 07-27-08, 11:06 AM
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Re: TC Sounds LMS-5400 18" sealed 75L vs. 200L *special test*

You're correct my box is 6.8 cubic feet internal, about 190 liters. It was under "boosted" (+12) conditions with the XTi 4000 DSP that I experienced the amp clipping. We have since found out about the XTi's performance at and below 20Hz when Chas on AVS tested an XTi 1000 and were all amazed at the lack of available power (90 watts) at 20HZ.
Crown has never been real clear about the available power at 20HZ for an Xti 4000 but I'm assuming from my experience it's not much over about 400 watts. That's still enough headroom for my kind of listening however.
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post #13 of 23 Old 07-27-08, 02:59 PM
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Re: TC Sounds LMS-5400 18" sealed 75L vs. 200L *special test*

Not to get off topic, but that amp offered more than 90 watts at 20hz - 90 watts was when THD was limited to something like 0.1% distortion. Chuck's tests are better used for comparing one amp to another, not for simulating real world usage.


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post #14 of 23 Old 07-27-08, 05:57 PM
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Re: TC Sounds LMS-5400 18" sealed 75L vs. 200L *special test*

Illka,

"Hopefully with the help of Nathan from Funky Waves, I will be able to test the Acoupower driver soon. It is pretty expensive to get the driver here so the buy-in thread might be needed to bring back to live."

I'm good for $100 toward the Acoupower 18 purchase.

Island,

"a long standing question I had regarding whether or not my own LMS 5400 was bottoming from extreme excursion at low frequencies or was it the amp (XTi 4000) that was going into clipping or protection that made horrible noises."

Couldn't you tell by just looking at the clip lights?
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post #15 of 23 Old 07-27-08, 09:17 PM
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Re: TC Sounds LMS-5400 18" sealed 75L vs. 200L *special test*

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noah katz wrote: View Post
Island,

Couldn't you tell by just looking at the clip lights?
The exterior front panel "clip lights" indicate an overload coming into the amp not the power going out. According to Crown the amp has a protection circuit which limits output with some kind of oscilator.
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post #16 of 23 Old 07-28-08, 01:24 AM
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Re: TC Sounds LMS-5400 18" sealed 75L vs. 200L *special test*

This test looks basically cut and dry to me and also how I would've expected the tests to show things. Very few drivers are going to handle power like an LMS and few amps are going to give significantly more power than a bridged CE4000 on 220v service. To me it seems ridiculous to think that a lesser driver is going to be able to handle these kind of demands. Dumping more power into your super small sealed box will not make it perform the same as a larger enclosure. Many drivers may handle 2KW without failing, but I doubt that they are "happy" about it.

Thanks for the test Illka!

BTW Illka...Would you mind giving me an estimate of what it costs to get one of these heavy 18's over to you? I'm curious. I'm about to aquire my 3rd RE Audio XXX18 and I won't have a use for it for awhile...
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post #17 of 23 Old 07-28-08, 11:02 PM
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Re: TC Sounds LMS-5400 18" sealed 75L vs. 200L *special test*

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Ricci wrote:
To me it seems ridiculous to think that a lesser driver is going to be able to handle these kind of demands. Dumping more power into your super small sealed box will not make it perform the same as a larger enclosure. Many drivers may handle 2KW without failing, but I doubt that they are "happy" about it.
STOP, you're being too logical!

Quote:
I'm about to aquire my 3rd RE Audio XXX18 and I won't have a use for it for awhile...
You must have a tree in your backyard that grows RE XXX 18s


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post #18 of 23 Old 07-29-08, 03:40 AM Thread Starter
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Re: TC Sounds LMS-5400 18" sealed 75L vs. 200L *special test*

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BTW Illka...Would you mind giving me an estimate of what it costs to get one of these heavy 18's over to you? I'm curious. I'm about to aquire my 3rd RE Audio XXX18 and I won't have a use for it for awhile...
It depends on shipping company and how fast you want to get it here. But it's definitely in the range of $300-$500 (one way) because only air freight is currently available in between USA and Finland (don't ask me why).

I think it's better that I'll give you my shipping address and you get some quotes from different shipping companies. That way you'll get the exact value. I'll send you a PM.
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post #19 of 23 Old 07-29-08, 03:49 AM
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Re: TC Sounds LMS-5400 18" sealed 75L vs. 200L *special test*

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BTW Illka...Would you mind giving me an estimate of what it costs to get one of these heavy 18's over to you? I'm curious. I'm about to aquire my 3rd RE Audio XXX18 and I won't have a use for it for awhile...
For the driver weight being 78lbs it won't go with USPS. I think DHL would take around 300$ for one way trip. I believe the cheapest way would be to send it with service wich is used to send car parts and stuff like that. Something like this? http://www.amertrading.com/

While your are at it, could you send few drivers for me too?
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post #20 of 23 Old 07-29-08, 05:55 AM
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Re: TC Sounds LMS-5400 18" sealed 75L vs. 200L *special test*

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You must have a tree in your backyard that grows RE XXX 18s
a very big
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