[TheGimp]

I finally have a chance to set up a HT system in my den.

It is a rather modest begining, and I am starting by setting up a stereo system and addressing room acoustics first.

The roomis aproximately 14'3" by 23' 6" wih a standare 8' ceiling, except that there is an air conditioning plenum measuring 23.5" X 12" along one eciling wall.

My current system consists of :

Klipsch Heresey (1977) Speakers
Philips 951 A/V Surround receiver
Pioneer CT-S609R Cassett deck
SL-1200 Turntable
DH-200 Amplifiers (2)
PPSL (Push Pull Slot Loaded) Sub with SA100 Plate Amp (unfinished, needs to be tuned)
Mini Fonke FF125WK speakers for surround when needed.
Linux based Video Server

I have started adjusting speaker and couch positions and am starting to get the basics of a sound stage.

Roomacoustics are abisimal with a brick wall on the far end, cinderblock left wall with paneling on the left, and undampened paneling onthe right and rear.

I ahve my couch set with my ears about 9' fromteh rear wall.

The speakers are 6' from teh brick wall.

Once I am satisfied with speaker and couch position, I'll start with room treatement.

I have a case (6) of Rockwool 60 24" X 48" X 2" sheets to make panels with, but am thinking a pair of tube traps in the far conrers might be a better starting point.

Suggestions ar welcome as I am just begining my trek and am still quite confused over all teh terminologuy, etc.

 

[TheGimp]

Today I finally sealed up and tested my Sub along with the rest of my system.

I moved the sub around to a couple locations (based on mathmatical anlayisis of room location) and looked at how it changed the room response.

The graph is the final position, without any room treatement.

I watched Pearl Harbor tonight and it sounded pretty good, especially compared to previous sessions without the sub.

My question is how does the graph look?

Since I have no experience with REW up until now, I'm not sure what I should be seeing.

Thanks.

Steven

 

[mpompey]

Great that you have your own room. I too started with a room that was paneled as well. I ended up getting a
friend that was a commercial painter to caulk grooves and paint which gives a solid look to the wall. I made diy acoustic panes as well as a few purchased from ATS acoustics and first and second reflection points.

You've got a great room to start with. Just be patient and don't rush it.

...
MP

 

[TheGimp]

I've been reading Art Noxon's AES papers and his five part home theater articles.

It makes sense to me that placing the sub at a location that will not excite room resonances, and with the HF cross over is low enough so that harmonics won't excite resonances above the third harmonic.

That is why I ended up with the sub behind the right main speaker.

For now I'm trying to optomize the listening position with respect to the location of the main stereo speakers and sub.

Once I have that, I think I can go ahead with room treatement (1) tricorner bass trap and (2) primary speaker reflection absorption, and possibly (3) difusion panels.

That is probably the best I can hope for for now.

I'm running REW with a Radio Shack digital Sound Level Meter for microphone input.

The biggest question I have is "does the plot look reasonable for the positioning of the speakers? And, Is this a good enough starting point to think about room treatement? Or, do I need to do more with speaker and sub placement WRT couch?

This will never be a nice HT like I've seen some pix of, but I hope to improve it enough to make it an enjoyable room to relax in.

WAF is not an issue as I am single.

 

[mpompey]

WAF is not an issue as I am single.

I beg to differ. I see somebody in a blue jacket on the couch. You
made need to go over everything with your roommate.

...
MP

 

[TheGimp]

A-ha, my "Little Buddy". As long as it passes the sniff test I'm ok.

Bad setback tonight.

I was rearanging the room next to the den and found major water damage so I'm going to have to put the HT room on hold.

Ultimately I would like to set up a 65" curved 4K screen with a new receiver ( possiblyOnkyo TX NR636 or Sony
STR DN1050.

Not exactly High End, but a nice basic system.

I really have no need for a projection system since I expect to sell this house in about 5 years, although they really look nice. I would just like to have a good basic system to enjoy SF and action movies as well as a good stereo system.

 

[mpompey]

Oh man that hurts! Sorry to hear that. Hopefully it's not too bad. I live in an older house and I've run into that particular one before. Ended up costing me abo6 $3500 in repairs and fixes.

 

[TheGimp]

Thanks.

The rug seems to be drying out after 24hrs, so I dont' think there is too much seepage. It looks like the book cases were restricting air flow and allowing the accumulation of moisture.

Still, I'll probably have to french tile a drain system to keep the water away from the wall. I can probablystrip the paneling and redo the firring strips, but leave it exposed until I can do the french tile work this spirng or summer.

I managed to cut the frame for one bass absorption panel toinght. I stained it and left it to dry. I need to figure out a stand for it before assembly.

I was looking at receiver specifications today and figure I'll have to upscale a little, probably an Onkyo TX-NR737 or similar. I was dissapointed with the comparison of SONY A/V recievers. Too many field s filled with N/A (Data not available?).

In additon to my watching, I have two grandkids who I'm sure will want to watch kids movies and I'd like to have something special for them since I don't see them but twice a year.

They are supposed to be here for 4th of July, but I now doubt I'll be able to have anything finished by then.

 

[Owen Bartley]

Great start to the room. It sounds like you're on the right track with your research, too. Every time I start to research acoustics, it opens up a rabbit hole and I seem to get lost for a while. Then I get out and promptly forget 80% of what I learned!

 

[TheGimp]

Yes, it certainly is a rabbit hole.

I was looking at the Dennon receivers, but those in my price range (less than $1000) don't have sufficient audio inputs, and no Phono input.(AVR-X3100W for instance) I would have to use a separate Phono Preamp and feed it in one of the standard audio inputs. This isn't so bad since I'll be building a moving coil preamp any way, but for now while running a MM cartridge I have no preamp.

The Onkyo TX-NR737 looks about right, but the TX-NR838 has some nice features as well. Feature Creep can be a real issue.

Based on the layout of the house and location of the AV equipment, I don't think the multi zone (room) features will be helpful. I will use my old receivers in other rooms for audio only.

The 737 and 838 both have MM phono pre inputs as well as 6 additional audio inputs. I have Cassett, CD, Phono, reel to reel as well as my old VHS inputs which only support separate vidion not HDMI.

 

[TheGimp]

I spent several hours today looking at AV Consoles on line and locally.

I'm very dissapointed at what is available. Every SONAX or SANUS console I would like is no longer available. :scratch:

It looks like I will have to buy a couple of sheets of 3/4" Oak vaneer plywood and build a stand to satisfy myself. So a lot of effort before I can continue.

On the brighter side, I will save $300-$500 by building the console myself and I can use the savings to upgrade to a TX-NR838 over the 737. :R

 

[TheGimp]

I've been working on some frames for bass traps.

I have six sheets fo Rockwool60 (24" X 48" x 2") and figure I can do two for the side walls, two bass traps for the corners and two for the celing.

 

[mpompey]

Look, building your own you are guaranteed to have a solution that works.

I built mine and she is a beast and perfect.

Plus, I got to play with power tools as well as buy a few new ones.

...
MP

 

[TheGimp]

After looking closer at the dimensions of some of the consoles, I've come to the conclusion that custom construction is the only way to go. It might not look quite as professional, but it will be more functional. In particular, I'm concerned with heat dissipation. I can design in features to help that are not available in commercial units (at least what I can afford).

The Onkyo AV Receivers seem to have a hotspot in the top middle of the housing, and I've seen posts that the fans don't seem to come on often. Some people have speculated that this is related to HDMI switch failures in previous models. I've not found indications the latest TX-NR series suffer the same issues of HDMI switch failures.

That said, heat management is paramount for electronics life in general.


I recently picked up a Craftsman table saw with cast iron deck to replace the Porter Cable that has a warped aluminum deck. I'll be aligning the saw soon and hope to give it a workout on this project.

 

[TheGimp]

Well, I pulled the trigger on the Onkyo TX-NR838. The more I read about other products the more I felt the Onkyo was a best match for my requirements.

I was a little concerned about the HDMI Switch history of the Onkyo products, but came to the conclusion it is heat related and I'll just have to be sure to manage that in my console design.

I've not seen any follow-up from the few buyers who purchased one, so I guess I'll do a write up after I have had it a few weeks.

 

[willis7469]

Hey Gimp. My 808 had a board put in it and hasn't flinched since. That was over a year ago. My console is open, front and back and I don't feel the majority of failures was heat related(not sure though). I believe Onkyo has a plan to fix them for a few more years. Mine was past warranty. Thought I'd share.

 

[TheGimp]

Thanks willis7469

What did it cost for the repare, or did Onkyo repare it out of warranty?

My biggest fear is damage in shipment. I purchased through an Ebay seller who does not accept returns. So, I have to deal with Ebay's policies if it is damaged.

Second risk is OBF in which case I have to send it to Onkyo for repare.

I don't have a 4K TV so I can only test so much when I get it. My current TV is only a Sony Bravo 32". I hope to purchase a 65" Curved screen 4K TV around May and be fully set up when my kids come to visit around the 4th of July.

I guess I better start assembling my surround speakers. I cut the plywood last December while I ws on vacation and never assembled them because I realized the table saw I was using had a warped deck and the cuts weren't proper. I'll have to do with them for now.

 

[TheGimp]

The wood on the saw horses in the forground is trim molding for the bathroom that I'm remodeling.

The background slats on the cardboard box are 1X4 pine for acoustic absoprtion panel frames.

If I can get the trim molding done with the second coat of paint and cut two more frames toinght I'll be happy.

 

[willis7469]

They actually fixed it out of warranty. My friend lives in the twin cities area, and brought it to an authorized onkyo shop. "Zero" investment. Good thing too, the original ship tag said 48lbs!!! I did have to sacrifice a few of George Killian's finest to my friend however. I'd be nervous about eBay a little too, but they're pretty good about things like that. The hardest part is waiting!

 

[TheGimp]

Fantastic. Good to hear the company stands behing their products. I've never owned Onkyo until now. I have been primarly Sony and Panasonic oriented.

Trim molding painted, Acostic Panel frames cut.

Tomorrow I'll buy another four 1" X 4" X 8' pine boards for the last two panels.

I should be able to nail the trim in place tomorrow night, stain the two frames I cut tonight and cut the last two frames and stain them for assembly on Wednesday.