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Re: Black Widow PFG

It would be interesting to make up some PFG with the Auto Air Aluminum (AAA:bigsmile:) product. I still have some left over. Although, I would have to use the Behr 4850 white paint as the base. This paint is awesome guys. I think it would be as good if not better than the other white paints you have tried. The good thing about using the AAA is it does help with spraying as it was designed to be sprayed. Just a thought, Or is that 2 thoughts?
Believe it or not Ben, I'm still putzing on this stuff! That's the one down side to owning the spectro! LOL! Rather than make Bill or Jim mix it up and send it out it's easier just for me to be the tinkerer. Bill and Jim are the idea guys. I'm their soldier! :bigsmile:

But I am tinkering with some other things that have been tried before and some that haven't. Where they'll lead us...:dontknow: But I do know this. I have a heckuva lot of respect for you guys who've done this without a spectro! You guys are amazing and my hat is off to you! ;)

mech
 

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Re: Black Widow PFG

Mech ahhh didnt see that in the list before, I see ....interesting.:scratchhead:

I have found some local brand Silver metallic and aluminium testpots in the garage from earlier experiments. My silver Metallic is lighter than the 588, I through some into some white and Magnolia(a violet tinted white)at 4:1 ratio and so far in mix pots is looking ok.

Have to wait to the base coats(white) dry and go hard, a day or so, before I apply some mix.

Oh I have already experimented a whiles ago with layers and light penetration.
Your base shade adds to the combined spectrum as light will hit 5 layers of paint and return. I feel you should always do atleast 2~3 base coats and 2 topcoats.
A consideration not to be forgottern and maybe a way to tweak total result:nerd:
 

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Re: Black Widow PFG

The most colour uniform screens have a unity gain of one. The moment you have gain you risk colour shifts off axis and in some cases on axis. ie a wide 35degree viewing angle and a high gain will appear non uniform across the width.

The spectrum for a perfect screen is perfectly flat. For those unaware, these spectrum readings are how the material responds to light as radiation. The material or surface needs to equally absorb or reflect the viewable spectrum no matter what the source.
Hi Smokey, does your statement also hold true for gray screens? Yes, gray is a shade of white. For instance, if you start off with a white paint that has unity gain, ie a Lambertian surface. You then add a pigment or pigment free particles to it to get a shade of gray. You are "absorbing" more light than reflecting. ie a non Lambertian surface. Therefore, your gain automatically goes down and you have a gain of less than 1. That is unless you add "gain" to them to bring them up to 1. In which case, even though you have a measured gain of 1 you needed a little boost to get there. So, are you risking colour shifts with most gray screens?
We won't even talk about off axis viewing because a gray screen with gain, IMO, ins't all that great off axis. That's part of the reason I ditched CGIII, gain of 1.8, for a lower gain, lighter shade of gray screen.
 

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Re: Black Widow PFG

What is the best material to use the PFG on? Should I buy a tileboard from Lowes? I have a polywall screen now with Behr Silverscreen. I just ordered a SP-7210 and I'm worried that the Silverscreen will be too dark for it.

Thanks
 
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Re: Black Widow PFG

Something strange.....I contacted DoItBest.com and here is the reply:

Greetings

Thank you for shopping doitbest.com! Unfortunately, I was unable to
locate that item in our system. I apologize for any inconvenience.
Please let me know if I can be of further assistance. Have a great
week!


xxxx xxxxx
doitbest.com

[email protected]

-----Original Message-----
Sent: Monday, January 21, 2008 4:13 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Henry 558 Aluminum Roof Coating

Hi,
I saw on your website you carry Henry 555, however I need Henry 558
Aluminum Roof Coating. Please advise if you are able to ship this
product.

Thank you.

I have a contact number Home Depot gave me to somewhere in my state (non Home Depot), I'll call and see what they can do.
 
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Re: Black Widow PFG

Also, which of the base would be better to get, LW or WM? I couldn't help but notice that the WM comes closer to 65K and seems to have a more balance curve. Am I just looking into this too much on something I would not notice at all between using LW or WM?

Thanks.
 

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Re: Black Widow PFG

Winter Mist/Dice 5:1 looks like a good one to me as well. I ould just like to find out what the best material to put this on other than my wall :)
 

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Discussion Starter #49
Re: Black Widow PFG

What is the best material to use the PFG on? Should I buy a tileboard from Lowes? I have a polywall screen now with Behr Silverscreen. I just ordered a SP-7210 and I'm worried that the Silverscreen will be too dark for it.

Thanks
Polywall will work. I would prime it first even though you already have SS on it. you want to start with a clean white base anytime you start a new project.

If you don't want to reuse your polywall, then yeah anything will work, hard board, MDF... whatever you feel comfortable with.

What is the lumen rating of the SP-7210?
 

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Discussion Starter #50
Re: Black Widow PFG

Also, which of the base would be better to get, LW or WM? I couldn't help but notice that the WM comes closer to 65K and seems to have a more balance curve. Am I just looking into this too much on something I would not notice at all between using LW or WM?

Thanks.
Both those 'curves' really are very flat compared to other things out there. the 5:1 Winter Mist version comes in as neutral, and the 4:1 Luminous White is a very close near neutral. Further out would be what we'd call 'Acceptable' and then outside that zone would be questionable or unusable methods. Both of these are well within specs for a screen.

So yes, LW would be perfectly fine to use and those bumps are partly the software that made the chart. I'm not saying it's is a laser flat straight line and the software screwed it up, just that with different graphing software you probably wouldn't see 'jaggies' but a smoother line. It still wouldn't be as flat as a surveyor's laser level but trust me these are very flat spectral responses.
 

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Re: Black Widow PFG

Polywall will work. I would prime it first even though you already have SS on it. you want to start with a clean white base anytime you start a new project.

If you don't want to reuse your polywall, then yeah anything will work, hard board, MDF... whatever you feel comfortable with.

What is the lumen rating of the SP-7210?
I don't mind using my polywall but would rather not. Will this paint stick to the following?

http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productDetail&productId=16605-19-16605
 

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Discussion Starter #52
Re: Black Widow PFG

I don't mind using my polywall but would rather not. Will this paint stick to the following?

http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productDetail&productId=16605-19-16605
I'm assuming that's the perfectly smooth stuff and not the stuff with bumps right?

First, it's paint. It will 'stick' to anything paint will adhere too. That said, some surfaces need to be prepped in order for it to be properly painted.

Here is an excerpt from the Screen Painting 101 thread, specifically Prep and Painting

If your wall or surface has a very smooth finish or is a synthetic or plastic surface, you must first apply an primer so that the paint screen paint can adequately adhere to the surface. Walls made of particle board or MDF should be thoroughly cleaned with turpentine or paint thinner. This will remove any glue residue and build up on the surface. This may seem like a useless step, and for most applications people don't have a problem- but ask yourself if you want to be that one person that does have a bonding issue or residue lumps. A quick wipe down is all it really takes, only a minute of your time.

Tip: A nonporous synthetic surface cannot absorb any liquid. While drying, temporary air bubbles may appear in the paint that has been applied. Do not touch them. They will
disappear by themselves as the paint dries.
So yes it will work with proper prep work. Bubbles are not such a good thing though. If they pop the aluminum tends to show and you get a shiny spot. If you see an air bubble, don't panic, go back and roll it out.

I think it was already mentioned, but this is an application where you actually want to stay away from foam rollers. You can do it with them but they tend to cause a lot more air bubbles.

Basically just roll it. I have no special rolling instructions, nothing fancy... if you can paint a room you can paint a screen. If a screen requires more than that, like special skills, special rollers, and video's, it's probably more complicated than it needs to be. If you don't believe me, contact some of the commercial screen paint companies and ask them how to roll their screen.

Screen painting really isn't as hard as some make it out to be. Just take your time, do proper prep work, and it will be fine. That doesn't just apply to Black Widow PFG, that applies to any paint project from painting a room to an old wooden rocking chair... preparation can make or break a project.

End of Sermon ;)
 

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Re: Black Widow PFG

I'm assuming that's the perfectly smooth stuff and not the stuff with bumps right?

First, it's paint. It will 'stick' to anything paint will adhere too. That said, some surfaces need to be prepped in order for it to be properly painted.

Here is an excerpt from the Screen Painting 101 thread, specifically Prep and Painting

The polywall has a smooth side and a textured side. I painted the textured side with the Silverscreen. The tileboard looks smooth.



So yes it will work with proper prep work. Bubbles are not such a good thing though. If they pop the aluminum tends to show and you get a shiny spot. If you see an air bubble, don't panic, go back and roll it out.

I think it was already mentioned, but this is an application where you actually want to stay away from foam rollers. You can do it with them but they tend to cause a lot more air bubbles.

Basically just roll it. I have no special rolling instructions, nothing fancy... if you can paint a room you can paint a screen. If a screen requires more than that, like special skills and video's, it's probably more complicated than it needs to be. If you don't believe me, contact some of the commercial screen paint companies and ask them how to roll their screen.

Screen painting really isn't as hard as some make it out to be. Just take your time, do proper prep work, and it will be fine. That doesn't just apply to Black Widow PFG, that applies to any paint project from painting a room to an old wooden rocking chair... preparation can make or break a project.

End of Sermon ;)
I'm probably going to give this a shot. I might have to find a new piece of Polywall though.
 

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Re: Black Widow PFG

If you put a coat of good primer down you'll be fine.
 

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Re: Black Widow PFG

Tradewinds mech posted a link for it, and worse case someone could send you some I'm sure.
 
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Re: Black Widow PFG

Tradewinds mech posted a link for it, and worse case someone could send you some I'm sure.
Yep, $30 for the gallon shipped, not bad but I hate the fact that I may have about 100 oz remaining, maybe I'll paint the rooftop with the rest.

Anywho, maybe we can ask that place to issue a coupon for this site's members. I got a 5% off upsellit-5 when I tried to leave the site, but maybe a good $5.00 off coupon would be nice.
 

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Re: Black Widow PFG

Hi Smokey, does your statement also hold true for gray screens? Yes, gray is a shade of white. For instance, if you start off with a white paint that has unity gain, ie a Lambertian surface. You then add a pigment or pigment free particles to it to get a shade of gray. You are "absorbing" more light than reflecting. ie a non Lambertian surface. Therefore, your gain automatically goes down and you have a gain of less than 1. That is unless you add "gain" to them to bring them up to 1. In which case, even though you have a measured gain of 1 you needed a little boost to get there. So, are you risking colour shifts with most gray screens?
We won't even talk about off axis viewing because a gray screen with gain, IMO, ins't all that great off axis. That's part of the reason I ditched CGIII, gain of 1.8, for a lower gain, lighter shade of gray screen.
Good question.

With a 0.8~1.2 screen it is unlikely to see much difference, however moving further away either direction and you alter the "L" in Lab enough so that the light that scatters more readily,ie Blue end of the spectrum, will behave differently than the Red end of the spectrum, then the ab functions may drift when viewing off axis.

We are looking uniformity across the width here.

The problem is not so much the spot measurement, which could equal a flat spectrum but the incedent light reflections.
This is hard to measure though, even with an i1pro as they like to be flat to the surface for the probe to work.

Still we are getting **** here, the spot spectrum result of the PFG is as good as alot of pay for screens.
Getting the spectrum flat solves 98% of calibration issues with the screen, ie lowers the push pull effect of trying to dial out the error with your PJ.
 
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Re: Black Widow PFG

Good point. My PJ (SP-7210) is unable to get to 65K on a white unity gain screen, so hopefully what slight variations from 65K the Black Widow PFG brings will work in concert. But, I agree, we may be splitting hairs on something that cannot be detected with the plain old eye.
 
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