Home Theater Forum and Systems banner

1 - 20 of 35 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I tired of hundreds of CD jewel cases, and looked for alternatives. I came up with a solution that works for me. I have three Sony CD jukeboxes - each holds 400 CDs. I have software called Music Library, and an adapter, that allows my PC to access and control all 1,200 CDs, down to the track level. It also automatically downloads the CD details, including the individual tracks. I wonder if anyone else has gone down this path?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
20 Posts
I don't quite understand about your quote of "I tired of hundreds of CD jewel cases, and looked for alternatives." Your solution to control the 3 Sony 400 disk CD Jukeboxes, was to purchase a software program called Music Library, and an adapter.

I have 2 Sony 400 disk jukeboxes, and the controlling adapter link for them is an 1/8" mini-plug called a A1, or A!! cable.Is this the adapter that you're talking about, or is it another type?

The software program that you use (Music Library) is that a database program that uses the CDDB to recognize the artist/s name, and other details, when you insert the audio CD into the CDROM tray?

What if the CDDB doesn't recognize the CD that you inserted when you use Music Library? Do you use Music Library to also rip the audio tracks in the codec of your choosing, or is it a software program just for databasing? As far as the jewel cases are concerned, are you talking about the picture/s of the artist/s being downloaded to the software program?

Do you use the Sony 400 CD jukeboxes as part of your audio system, or is it part of your computer server system?

I have many CD's that the CDDB doesn't recognize when I use my software program, called Catraxx. I then have to rename the tracks by artist/s name, and song by hand. I have to do the same when I use Nero to rip the tracks to a temporary folder on the desktop, and then create a folder for the artist on my music server; after which I then move the files to that folder.

As regards the CD covers, I created a folder named CD Album pictures. Sometimes I scan the CD album pictures to the folder, or I use Allmusic, or Amazon to look up to see if they have pictures of that audio CD album. When I have time with the Catraxx program, I copy the pictures to the program.

Anyway that you look at it; it's time consuming.

One last question: Do you use Music Library as an interface if you have a HT setup?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
I don't quite understand about your quote of "I tired of hundreds of CD jewel cases, and looked for alternatives." Your solution to control the 3 Sony 400 disk CD Jukeboxes, was to purchase a software program called Music Library, and an adapter.

I have 2 Sony 400 disk jukeboxes, and the controlling adapter link for them is an 1/8" mini-plug called a A1, or A!! cable.Is this the adapter that you're talking about, or is it another type?

The software program that you use (Music Library) is that a database program that uses the CDDB to recognize the artist/s name, and other details, when you insert the audio CD into the CDROM tray?

What if the CDDB doesn't recognize the CD that you inserted when you use Music Library? Do you use Music Library to also rip the audio tracks in the codec of your choosing, or is it a software program just for databasing? As far as the jewel cases are concerned, are you talking about the picture/s of the artist/s being downloaded to the software program?

Do you use the Sony 400 CD jukeboxes as part of your audio system, or is it part of your computer server system?

I have many CD's that the CDDB doesn't recognize when I use my software program, called Catraxx. I then have to rename the tracks by artist/s name, and song by hand. I have to do the same when I use Nero to rip the tracks to a temporary folder on the desktop, and then create a folder for the artist on my music server; after which I then move the files to that folder.

As regards the CD covers, I created a folder named CD Album pictures. Sometimes I scan the CD album pictures to the folder, or I use Allmusic, or Amazon to look up to see if they have pictures of that audio CD album. When I have time with the Catraxx program, I copy the pictures to the program.

Anyway that you look at it; it's time consuming.

One last question: Do you use Music Library as an interface if you have a HT setup?
Lots ot good questions. He's what Dr. McCain wrote about his products.



You have a large collection of CDs and you bought (or are considering buying) one or more high-capacity CD "mega" changers. You need "jukebox software" to control those CD changers and manage your CD collection, but you also want to play music files from your computer. Now, Music Library Version 2.5 provides the solution! Music Library manages your entire music collection, plays all the most popular music file formats, and plays compact discs in computer-attached "mega" changers.

Product Description

Music Library Version 2.5 plays MP3 files (the most popular compressed audio format for music), plus the iTunes AAC formats (M4P, M4A, and M4B, including music encoded in the Apple Lossless format). Also supports APE and FLAC files (two other popular lossless compressed audio formats). "Metadata" is retrieved from embedded tags in MP3, iTunes, APE, and FLAC files. Uncompressed audio files in the WAV, AIFF, and AU formats are also supported.

Music Library Version 2.5 supports CD changers that connect to a computer by means of an RS232 serial port. The brands of changers currently supported are Sony (available in 200-disc, 300-disc, and 400-disc "carousel" models) and NSM (model CD3101AC, a 100-disc heavy-duty changer found inside many commercial jukeboxes). Sony "CD-only" mega-changers can be attached to an RS232 serial port by means of a SAVR, SAVR2, or SAVR3 adapter (made by BlackBoxDesigns) or a Slink-e adapter (which has been discontinued by its maker, but many audio/video aficionados already have one, and some dealers may still have them in stock). DVD changers are not supported.

Music Library Version 2.5 uses an Internet connection to look up disc information (including track titles) in the online database maintained by freedb.org. If you have a high-speed local area network in your home, you can run copies of Music Library on several computers at the same time; the "remote" copies of Music Library communicate with the "master" controller (the copy of Music Library that runs on the computer with the music files and the attached CD changers).

iTunes Music File Support

Support for the iTunes AAC formats uses the QuickTime code library (6.4 or later), so it works on Windows and Mac only (QuickTime is not available for Linux). Protected AAC files (M4P) must be authorized to your computer. This can be done only by iTunes, which requires Windows 2000 or XP or Mac OS X. Older versions of Windows can play unprotected AAC files (M4A and M4B).

System Requirements

Music Library requires Java 1.4.0 or later. Versions of Music Library are available for Microsoft Windows (98 or later), Macintosh (requires Mac OS X 10.2.3 or later), and Linux. (The Linux version is not sold separately; it is included free with orders for Windows or Mac.) Only the Music Library "master" controller is platform-specific; the "remote" panels will run on any OS that supports Java 1.4.0 or later.

Product History

Following the success of William C. McCain's innovative Disc Library for large CD collections, it became apparent that many audiophiles also want to play music files from their computers. Now, Music Library Version 2.5 provides all the functionality of Disc Library 2.5, plus Music Library adds a built-in music file player to support popular computer-based music files and a new, highly versatile Intelligent Song Search™ facility to "find that track" anywhere in your music collection.

Product Features

New! A cover image utility program searches merchant Web sites, downloads cover image files, and assigns them to the CDs and music files in your collection.

New! Music files can be imported by "drag-and-drop" from other applications (such as iTunes or the operating system's "file explorer").

New! Support for an Inday DA4X-RS digital audio switch (handy if you want to pipe digital audio from multiple music players to your stereo system). The Nirvis DXS switch is also supported (discontinued by Nirvis).

New! "Disc memos" can be uploaded automatically or manually to the front panel displays of most Sony CD changers.

New! You can dynamically monitor the progress of the active Play List and change the active step.

New! "Drag-and-drop" to add steps to any open Edit Play List window from any open album track list or the album that is playing or any of the alphabetical lists of albums.

Play Lists can be edited by both the "cut-and-paste" and "drag-and-drop" methods.

You can run Play Lists either sequentially or randomly.

Three different Shuffle Modes (tracks on a single album, all tracks in library, all albums in library). The "library" Shuffle Modes automatically alternate between players whenever possible, and they can be restricted to a subset of your collection, defined by selecting any combination of 15 music categories.

Intelligent Song Search™ pinpoints that half-forgotten track anywhere in your music collection, even if you remember only a few letters of the track title and/or the music genre!

Displays your music collection alphabetically by title, performer, and composer (a must for classical music fans). Also lists files and discs by their physical location.

The alphabetical lists can be "filtered" by any combination of the 15 pre-defined music categories and/or up to four of the user-defined "music genre" names.

The alphabetical lists of music files and CDs can be exported from the Music Library database in XML format. Your Web browser can format, display, and print these lists, with the aid of a provided "starter set" of XSL "style sheet" files.

Extensive facilities for editing the information retrieved from "metadata" tags or downloaded from the Internet. You can re-assign the music category, change or add any number of user-defined "genre" names, assign an album cover scan, edit the track titles, etc.

Two well-documented "home automation" interfaces are supported (IP and RS232 serial). These interfaces permit Music Library to be integrated with an automation system such as AMX or Crestron, and/or with other computer applications such as MainLobby or HomeSeer.

User-specified "border skins" can change the overall appearance of the Music Library window. Different skins can be specified for the focused and unfocused modes.

Optional support for displaying current song information from a DMX multi-channel satellite/cable radio receiver.



http://www.mccain.metaconnect.com/musiclib.htm
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
20 Posts
That is very interesting. I have an unique situation, in that I live in a 2 story house. In my upstairs bedroom, I have a music server that I've already ripped my music CD's to, while downstairs, I have my audio equipment (with the 2 Sony jukeboxes) to play my CD's.
1. Do I need to have a laptop; using the Music Library software in order to control the jukeboxes, and to
get the details of the CD's?

2. If I've already ripped the music to my music server, is the software capable of reading the meta data of the CD's to get the details of the CD via Freedb?

3. How would you integrate all of that information (and control the CD jukeboxes) between the music server upstairs in one my bedrooms, and the CD jukeboxes downstairs in my living room?

4. As I've stated before, a lot of my audio CD's aren't recognized by any online databases. Do I still have to manually edit the data; in order to have the correct information?

5. Since most of my music library is vinyl, I've found that most online databases don't have much info about them; much less have a photo of the vinyl cover.It's like looking for hens teeth. I was one of "The Last of The Mohicans"; to fully embrace the audio CD format, then only because "vinyl" was kicked to the curb. I'm finding out that digitalising my vinyl is tedious and time consuming. I've even had to change to buying a digital camera, so I can take a picture of the vinyl cover to include in my database.

I'd appreciate some input on how I could more fully integrate using the Music Library software as regards my music server upstairs with my Sony jukeboxes residing in my downstairs living room. It would surely save some time.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
21 Posts
While CD jukeboxes are really neat, hard drive space is so cheap that they're an anachronisim.

I personally suggest ripping your music to MP3 or a lossless format, storing it on a drive, and using one of these to play it back remotely:

http://www.slimdevices.com/

There are several companies that make such devices. We have a Roku one at home and it's a godsend. Hook it up to the stereo and you can wirelessly listen to your music collection. If you have more than once device, you can sync them together so that they are all controlled by the same remote for multi-room listening.

Sympathies on the problem of ripping records. I have a large LP collection and I'm finding myself just buying used CD's to rip to save the trouble of digitizing and labeling them.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
That is very interesting. I have an unique situation, in that I live in a 2 story house. In my upstairs bedroom, I have a music server that I've already ripped my music CD's to, while downstairs, I have my audio equipment (with the 2 Sony jukeboxes) to play my CD's.
1. Do I need to have a laptop; using the Music Library software in order to control the jukeboxes, and to
get the details of the CD's?

2. If I've already ripped the music to my music server, is the software capable of reading the meta data of the CD's to get the details of the CD via Freedb?

3. How would you integrate all of that information (and control the CD jukeboxes) between the music server upstairs in one my bedrooms, and the CD jukeboxes downstairs in my living room?

4. As I've stated before, a lot of my audio CD's aren't recognized by any online databases. Do I still have to manually edit the data; in order to have the correct information?

5. Since most of my music library is vinyl, I've found that most online databases don't have much info about them; much less have a photo of the vinyl cover.It's like looking for hens teeth. I was one of "The Last of The Mohicans"; to fully embrace the audio CD format, then only because "vinyl" was kicked to the curb. I'm finding out that digitalising my vinyl is tedious and time consuming. I've even had to change to buying a digital camera, so I can take a picture of the vinyl cover to include in my database.

I'd appreciate some input on how I could more fully integrate using the Music Library software as regards my music server upstairs with my Sony jukeboxes residing in my downstairs living room. It would surely save some time.
Justbegood:

I would suggest calling or writing Dr. McCain. He's a very nice and intelligent person, and I am positive he could answer your questions.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
While CD jukeboxes are really neat, hard drive space is so cheap that they're an anachronisim.

I personally suggest ripping your music to MP3 or a lossless format, storing it on a drive, and using one of these to play it back remotely:

http://www.slimdevices.com/

There are several companies that make such devices. We have a Roku one at home and it's a godsend. Hook it up to the stereo and you can wirelessly listen to your music collection. If you have more than once device, you can sync them together so that they are all controlled by the same remote for multi-room listening.

Sympathies on the problem of ripping records. I have a large LP collection and I'm finding myself just buying used CD's to rip to save the trouble of digitizing and labeling them.

I cannot imagine using MP3 files. I cringe at the thought. the overall function seems good, but the jukeboxes cost me less than a hard-disk. As the old saying goes, there's more than one way to skin a cat. I'm in the process of buying a house and moving out of my high-rise. We have a proper theater designed, as well as an integrated audio system. As we get closer, I'll post some schematics.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
20 Posts
I'm going to take your suggestion of contacting Mr. McCain. In the meantime, Ive downloaded the User Guide for Music Library 2.5, for a better understanding. It sounds promising, and might solve some of my immediate needs. I'll just put my head into the "Pencil Sharpener" to keep my head in "tip top shape". Thanks for the suggestion!

As far as buying CD's to save yourself the time & effort of ripping your vinyl collection, I would have a problem with that, as a lot of labels don't remaster the albums to CD's.If they do re-master; it's usually a compilation of the artist/s music. Added to that, my vinyl collection goes as far back as the '30's. PRICELESS!

Thanks to all you "music lovers", for the input.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
21 Posts
I cannot imagine using MP3 files. I cringe at the thought. the overall function seems good, but the jukeboxes cost me less than a hard-disk. As the old saying goes, there's more than one way to skin a cat. I'm in the process of buying a house and moving out of my high-rise. We have a proper theater designed, as well as an integrated audio system. As we get closer, I'll post some schematics.

As I said, you can rip to lossless formats. These are identical to the original files on the CD. Well, unless you use a cheap USB cable, that'll degrade the sound. (*)

A 250mb USB drive costs about 150$. This would hold about 400 CD's worth of music. Are there honestly CD changers out there for this sort of price? If so, great! :)

One of my aggrivations about CD changers is being locked in to a particular software package that knows how to manipulate the drive. If you have the perfect solution, though, sounds like that's the way to go!


(* just kidding!)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
A 250mb USB drive costs about 150$. This would hold about 400 CD's worth of music. Are there honestly CD changers out there for this sort of price? If so, great! :)
I found the first Sony jukebox on Amazon for $80, and two more from a local guy that sells on eBay. My cost for the three is $180, which takes care of 1,200 CDs. That does give me a little room for expansion too. Life is about compromises and making decisions based upon imperfect knowledge. :jump:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
I'm going to take your suggestion of contacting Mr. McCain. In the meantime, Ive downloaded the User Guide for Music Library 2.5, for a better understanding. It sounds promising, and might solve some of my immediate needs. I'll just put my head into the "Pencil Sharpener" to keep my head in "tip top shape". Thanks for the suggestion!

As far as buying CD's to save yourself the time & effort of ripping your vinyl collection, I would have a problem with that, as a lot of labels don't remaster the albums to CD's.If they do re-master; it's usually a compilation of the artist/s music. Added to that, my vinyl collection goes as far back as the '30's. PRICELESS!

Thanks to all you "music lovers", for the input.
Jusbegood - Please let us know as your project develops. As an aside, which of your huge array of technology (I don't recognize all of the model numbers) is the turntable? I am currently hunting for a Thorens TD124.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
20 Posts
I have 2 turntables that I like to interchange. I have a Onkyo CP-1044F ca. 1978, and a Pioneer PL-55DX ca. 1975.
The Onkyo TT back then, was built like a tank. It has a straight graphite tonearm with a blue Grado cartridge. Subsequent Onkyo TT's didn't have the quality build like this model.

The Pioneer TT is an even bigger tank. This model was made for the Quad format, that every company was developing at the time. IMHO, this TT has the typical quality build that Pioneer was famous for in the '70's. The quadraphonic format immediately got kicked to the curb; when the audio CD's were introduced in 1982.

You can't go wrong with a Thoren's TT. Just keep manifesting for it, and it'll be in your audio rig in no time. I'll keep you posted as my immediate project develops.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
20 Posts
I have 2 turntables that I like to interchange. I have a Onkyo CP-1044F ca. 1978, and a Pioneer PL-55DX ca. 1975.
The Onkyo TT back then, was built like a tank. It has a straight graphite tonearm with a blue Grado cartridge. Subsequent Onkyo TT's didn't have the quality build like this model.

The Pioneer TT is an even bigger tank. This model was made for the Quad format, that every company was developing at the time. IMHO, this TT has the typical quality build that Pioneer was famous for in the '70's. The quadraphonic format immediately got kicked to the curb; when the audio CD's were introduced in 1982.

You can't go wrong with a Thoren's TT. Just keep manifesting for it, and it'll be in your audio rig in no time. I'll keep you posted as my immediate project develops.[/QUOTE]
 
M

·
Guest
Joined
·
0 Posts
Here's my personal top reasons to use hard disk based audio library as opposed to a CD Changer:

Top reasons to use a hard disk based audio library:
1) Instant Music (No waiting for a changer to cue up)
2) Set cross fades between songs (No silence between songs)
3) Hard disk space is continually getting cheaper and cheaper
4) A second drive making regular back ups can provide back up of all your music in case of a hard drive failure
5) Ripping CDs is very fast with a high speed CD Rom drive
6) You can have up to 8 zones of Audio each playing a different song per zone within the software
7) Doesn't take up as much room as multiple CD changers and isn't as noisey
8) EQ builtin for each zone
9) Internet Radio (Free)
10) You can sell off your changers and purchase extra hard drive space and/or other new computer equipment
11) Automatically tags and retrieves cover art
12) There are many programs out there that will support a computer based music system over CD changers

I just saw a 250 GB IDE drive at PacificGeek.com for $59.99. I think TigerDirect recently had a 1 Terrabyte USB 2.0 hard drive for under $200. Now that's a ton of storage.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
5) Ripping CDs is very fast with a high speed CD Rom drive
I have almost 1,200 CDs. How long would it take to rip them?
 
M

·
Guest
Joined
·
0 Posts
Rex,
It depends. Final format you rip to and the speed of your CD Writer play a big role in the time it will take. Get the fastest CD Rom drive you can or test with an existing one on your system. Then just do the math. You can even rip from multiple PC's simultaneously.

I know we have in development an auto ripping solution for the Sony Vaio 200 Disc Changer. I'll have to check with my dev team to see where that's at. Imagine putting 200 discs in the changer and then walking away and having them all ripped for ya. :)

I personally buy most of my music from iTunes. It allows me to get only the songs I truly would want to listen to.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
Discussion Starter #17
Rex,
It depends. Final format you rip to and the speed of your CD Writer play a big role in the time it will take. Get the fastest CD Rom drive you can or test with an existing one on your system. Then just do the math. You can even rip from multiple PC's simultaneously.

I know we have in development an auto ripping solution for the Sony Vaio 200 Disc Changer. I'll have to check with my dev team to see where that's at. Imagine putting 200 discs in the changer and then walking away and having them all ripped for ya. :)

I personally buy most of my music from iTunes. It allows me to get only the songs I truly would want to listen to.
It seems buying the fastest cd writer and/or multiple pcs negates any economic advantage. However, the itune appears to use some proprietary (apple) compressed file format. Is that correct?
 
M

·
Guest
Joined
·
0 Posts
Hi Rex,
Multiple PC's is not a requirement...just one way to speed things up. I probably have 10 pcs laying around the house. The cost of cdrw drives are insanely cheap these days...depending upon how old your PC is, you may be fine with the one you have. They do have a protection scheme; however, they have started to offer some music without it. For me personally, not a major issue. You can always burn them to CD and they are now unprotected.

When you're an impulse buyer like myself, itunes can get real expensive because it's so convenient. If I hear a song I like on XM Satellite, it's downloaded and in my music library before the songs even finished playing on XM. Gotta love the way technology moves and improves.

To be honest, I don't even remember the last CD I bought. Probably been well over 3-4 years.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
Discussion Starter #19
Hi Rex,
Multiple PC's is not a requirement...just one way to speed things up. I probably have 10 pcs laying around the house. The cost of cdrw drives are insanely cheap these days...depending upon how old your PC is, you may be fine with the one you have. They do have a protection scheme; however, they have started to offer some music without it. For me personally, not a major issue. You can always burn them to CD and they are now unprotected.

When you're an impulse buyer like myself, itunes can get real expensive because it's so convenient. If I hear a song I like on XM Satellite, it's downloaded and in my music library before the songs even finished playing on XM. Gotta love the way technology moves and improves.

To be honest, I don't even remember the last CD I bought. Probably been well over 3-4 years.
Good luck. I was an Officer - got my taste of being on the point.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1 Posts
As some may know, William Mc Cain passed away suddenly on January 11, 2011. He took with him his "secrets" of Music Library---at least so far. I have not been able to speak to his wife or anyone else associated with Bill. His web site is still up, but surely it will come down at some point. In the meantime, no one is apparently running his business. I am looking for a copy of his Music Library for Mac. If anyone is using that software and has the capability of burning a CDR of the application, please contact me to arrange for a small "donation" for your trouble. Again, his software is currently NOT being sold, so I am not requesting that anyone do anything illegal.
 
1 - 20 of 35 Posts
Top