Dayton ultimax 10 with butcher block baffle

32215 Views 73 Replies 21 Participants Last post by Jstslamd, Jan 20, 2015

Jstslamd

Discussion Starter · Oct 9, 2013 (Edited by Moderator)

6

Long time lurker going in for his first build thread. I've had a um-10 and a bash 300 amp sitting here teasing me since last winter so I thought its about time to get things started. This will be a small (just over 1cf seal) design using a piece of butcher block maple to make the baffle. I'm going to rear mount the driver just to jazz it up a bit too. Here are a few quick pics. There will be more to come. Stay tuned.

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BD55

· #2 · Oct 9, 2013

Re: Datyton ultimax 10 with butcher block baffle

I like the idea you have here! I haven't seen too many builds with the um, and I have been interested to hear more impressions on them - and this looks like a good combo.

What will the finish look like? Stain on the baffle, I'm assuming, and what for the rest?

fusseli

· #3 · Oct 9, 2013

Re: Datyton ultimax 10 with butcher block baffle

I like where this is headed, good luck with the build :T

BD55

· #4 · Oct 9, 2013

Re: Datyton ultimax 10 with butcher block baffle

Do you have one of the newer um's? I was reading reviews on PE and apparently there was a rash of poor QC drivers that rubbed and popped and had poor output. Hopefully this isn't the case for yours!

fmw

· #5 · Oct 9, 2013

Re: Datyton ultimax 10 with butcher block baffle

Lookin' good. Be sure to use a food safe finish for the butcher block. Then you can sit the sub on its rear and have someplace to cut your cheese and sanwiches during the football game.

Jstslamd

Discussion Starter · #6 · Oct 9, 2013

Unfortunately it is one of the older ones I would guess. It was when they were released and went on sale. I haven't heard any bad sounds from it when I tested it. As far as finish I will be staining the baffle (color yet to be picked. The box itself I had originally planned on gloss black but being an automotive painter as my 9-5 I have thought about a few different colors as I can pick any color in the world. I may do the enclosure a cream white. If I do the cream color ill probably do a dark cherry or maybe a walnut stain. I get so many ideas I just don't know what to go with. I have a ton of hurdles to overcome before I get to that point. For one I wish I had someone the was a surgeon with a router as I'm hardly good at it but I've gotta learn. Hopefully more pictures to come soon.

Jstslamd

Discussion Starter · #7 · Oct 9, 2013

Fmw! I like the way you think. The sub could also double as a dip bowl.

Owen Bartley

· #8 · Oct 9, 2013

Re: Datyton ultimax 10 with butcher block baffle

Did someone say "automotive paint finish"? Consider me subscribed. Can't wait to see what you do with it. I remember years back watching someone plan a glossy Ferrari red automotive finish for some speakers... can't remember if they ever got built though.

Jstslamd

Discussion Starter · #9 · Oct 9, 2013

It's should be interesting lol.

Jstslamd

Discussion Starter · #10 · Oct 9, 2013

So I'm being grilled a bit on the PE tech talk because I'm not making a separate compartment for the plate amp. I've asked before and I'll ask again. Is it ok to leave the plate amp exposed to the internal air space in the enclosure?

ht-core

· #11 · Oct 10, 2013

Re: Datyton ultimax 10 with butcher block baffle

Absolutely not ok for the amp to be in the same space as the sub enclosure air space. If not it will most likely kill your plate amp as the plate will "flex".be sure to make a seprate space for the amp. If the box is built maybe you could do a 1"X1" square Or rectangle to drop it in. Hope that helps.

Owen Bartley

· #12 · Oct 10, 2013

Re: Datyton ultimax 10 with butcher block baffle

Well, I used the same amp in my SDX10 build (link in sig) and I didn't build a separate amp enclosure. I haven't had any issues with the amp and it's been what... 4 years?

I agree with ht-core ideally, yeah, you would want to seal it up. But IMO unless you're rocking a really powerful big excursion driver, it shouldn't hurt the amp. The amp comes with a gasket to seal the edges against air leakage where you mount it, which is pretty effective in my experience. it might not be 100% like it would be in its own enclosure, but I think the tradeoff in lost volume is too high for a small enclosure like this (and mine). Just my 2¢, but I've been fine. If you want to be safe, and you can build a little bigger to accommodate the lost volume from the amp enclosure, you definitely can't go wrong.

Jstslamd

Discussion Starter · #13 · Oct 10, 2013

Well I'm already cut up and assembling so I'm gonna go forward with things the way they are. I have had more people that I know do quality work then people I don't know tell me it should be fine. Worst case is that I make some small changes before I do the finishing. Thanks guys !

bgarcia17

· #14 · Oct 10, 2013

Re: Datyton ultimax 10 with butcher block baffle

Only my first diy sub had the plate amp outside of the air space. And that was only because I was very about the sub's airspace (being my first sub). I've built many since then and not one of them has had a plate amp go bad due to vibrations. You'll be fine.

fmw

· #15 · Oct 10, 2013

Re: Datyton ultimax 10 with butcher block baffle

ht-core said:
Absolutely not ok for the amp to be in the same space as the sub enclosure air space. If not it will most likely kill your plate amp as the plate will "flex".be sure to make a seprate space for the amp. If the box is built maybe you could do a 1"X1" square Or rectangle to drop it in. Hope that helps.

I wonder how you would bend a plate amp that is attached with a dozen screws enough to damage it? If you put a box around it internally, how would that prevent bending if, in fact, it occurs? Do manufacturers provide internal boxes around the plate amps. I'm not criticizing. I'm asking.

fusseli

· #16 · Oct 11, 2013

Re: Datyton ultimax 10 with butcher block baffle

I've been using a 300W Bash amp in a ported 15" sub for several years now without any issue. There are no noises, rattles, leaks, or "flexing" of the amplifier to speak of. I have never heard concerns like this, nor have I heard of people having problems, nor have I seen any special installation instructions requiring a separate air space. In fact, to quote the owners manual: "Amplifier is designed to be installed into a subwoofer enclosure or its own dedicated enclosure. Switches and other orifices are airtight."

Perhaps the worst case scenario would be a Bash amp in a small sealed enclosure, where the pressures might be greatest. Even then I doubt it would be an issue.

fmw said:
I wonder how you would bend a plate amp that is attached with a dozen screws enough to damage it? If you put a box around it internally, how would that prevent bending if, in fact, it occurs? Do manufacturers provide internal boxes around the plate amps. I'm not criticizing. I'm asking.

Ironically, the only problems I've seen is with the Dayton plate amps, which are not sealed air tight at the terminals on the back panel, instead they are a cheaper setup with a large black plastic cover over the inside of the amp. A friend of mine had a 10" Titanic in 1cuft sealed with the SA240. He had lots of whistling and rattling issues and ended up trading up to a SPA500 setup, and the amp failed after a few years of service. I have also built an 8" W8-740P in a vented setup where I had no issues with the SA240 rattling or whistling and that sub still runs strong today.

Long stories short, I think the Bash amps are very well designed and are perfectly suited for sealed or vented subs without any internal enclosure.

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fmw

· #17 · Oct 11, 2013

Re: Datyton ultimax 10 with butcher block baffle

fusseli said:
I've been using a 300W Bash amp in a ported 15" sub for several years now without any issue. There are no noises, rattles, leaks, or "flexing" of the amplifier to speak of. I have never heard concerns like this, nor have I heard of people having problems, nor have I seen any special installation instructions requiring a separate air space. In fact, to quote the owners manual: "Amplifier is designed to be installed into a subwoofer enclosure or its own dedicated enclosure. Switches and other orifices are airtight."

Perhaps the worst case scenario would be a Bash amp in a small sealed enclosure, where the pressures might be greatest. Even then I doubt it would be an issue.

Ironically, the only problems I've seen is with the Dayton plate amps, which are not sealed air tight at the terminals on the back panel, instead they are a cheaper setup with a large black plastic cover over the inside of the amp. A friend of mine had a 10" Titanic in 1cuft sealed with the SA240. He had lots of whistling and rattling issues and ended up trading up to a SPA500 setup, and the amp failed after a few years of service. I have also built an 8" W8-740P in a vented setup where I had no issues with the SA240 rattling or whistling and that sub still runs strong today.

Long stories short, I think the Bash amps are very well designed and are perfectly suited for sealed or vented subs without any internal enclosure.

Thanks. The comment seemed counterintuitive to me. My 15" sealed sub has a class D amp from Parts Express simply installed in a hole in the back of the cabinet. i don't remember the name (a Chinese name) but there isn't anything impressive about it. I haven't heard a single sound anywhere except from the driver. Everything seems to be air tight. Auto on means always for that amp because it never turns itself off. Probably not much power dissipation with no signal.

Jstslamd

Discussion Starter · #18 · Oct 11, 2013

Ok now that we resolved this issue on to the next. I was thinking that this was such a small enclosure that bracing was a little over the top. The panels are barely more that a foot long each. How do you guys feel on this issue. I know I'm gonna get the brace freaks tell me ALWAYS brace your cabs but let's get real. What's the honest answer ?

fusseli

· #19 · Oct 11, 2013

Re: Datyton ultimax 10 with butcher block baffle

fmw said:
Thanks. The comment seemed counterintuitive to me. My 15" sealed sub has a class D amp from Parts Express simply installed in a hole in the back of the cabinet. i don't remember the name (a Chinese name) but there isn't anything impressive about it. I haven't heard a single sound anywhere except from the driver. Everything seems to be air tight. Auto on means always for that amp because it never turns itself off. Probably not much power dissipation with no signal.

My friend that had the rattle issues with an SA240 changed up to a SPA500 setup, and yeah similar to your experience he did not have the same problem. Unfortunately for Dayton, they seem to continually have other issues with quality control problems unrelated to this issue.

Jstslamd said:
Ok now that we resolved this issue on to the next. I was thinking that this was such a small enclosure that bracing was a little over the top. The panels are barely more that a foot long each. How do you guys feel on this issue. I know I'm gonna get the brace freaks tell me ALWAYS brace your cabs but let's get real. What's the honest answer ?

Some bracing is always a good idea, especially for a sub. Some people do go crazy with their bracing and that ultimately adds to box size and weight. The simplistic approach that I prefer, and is easy to implement, is to use dowels. You'll want to tie every wall of the box together if you can. You'll notice as you add bracing you are actually breaking up the walls into small sub-panels that remain un-braced. There's some RoT out there for how small the panel segments need to be to get audible resonance pushed high enough to not be noticeable, but I'm not remembering it at the moment.

The only time I would recommend not bracing would be for small boxes that are built stout because of their wall thickness. Like a 10" cube with 3/4" mdf would be quite stout as it sits. Something like a 19" cube, or 3cuft, would need cross bracing in at least a few places.

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Jstslamd

Discussion Starter · #20 · Oct 11, 2013

Being that this is a total of like 1.15 cf before any displacement you would still recommend a little bracing then ?

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