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Discussion Starter #1
I have just ordered a Danley DTS-10 Tapped Horn Subwoofer Kit, the same one that Ricci & Brandonnash have recently gotten. http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/diy-subwoofers/22088-danley-sound-labs-dts-10-super-spud-kit-build-thread-3.html

This will be my first subwoofer and it will be used with an old 2.0 receiver that does not have a sub out. (A more modern receiver is probably a couple of years away.) My mains are 3 way Klipschorns. I will probably get an EP2500 or EP4000 amp for the sub.

It seems that I need both a crossover and equalization. After reading a LOT of forum posts on the topic it looks like the Behringer DCX2496 will be my most cost effective and proper solution as I can do both functions in one unit.

Before placing an order I would sure appreciate some feedback as to whether or not I am doing the best thing.

Thanks very much.
Rod
 

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I would sure appreciate some feedback
If you only have an older stereo receiver without sub out or mains out, how do you purpose to connect to a line level device such as the DCX or to a subwoofer amplifier? Does the receiver have pre/mains straps?

brucek
 

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Discussion Starter #3
If you only have an older stereo receiver without sub out or mains out, how do you purpose to connect to a line level device such as the DCX or to a subwoofer amplifier? Does the receiver have pre/mains straps?

brucek
Good catch, Brucek! I was thinking of connecting it to the 'Tape Out' RCAs, but now I'm wondering if the volume control will affect that output. Will go check that, but have an awful feeling that output is before the volume control. I also have an old H/K Citation Eleven preamp I could run and send it's output to both the receiver and DCX. That way volume would affect both but I am sure adding more links to the chain!

Also not sure what you mean by "Pre/mains straps". Is that similar to the 'tape out/tape in connections'?

What do most people do with old 2.0 receivers? Dump them and get a new one or new pre/pro?

Thanks again.
Rod
 

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Most people who want to still use there old two ch receivers resort to using the high level inputs on the back of the sub (not all have this) You take your speaker outputs and run them into the left and right binding posts on the sub and then out to the speakers using the subs left and right speaker outputs to the speakers. Sadly you cant use a BFD or any other sort of device using this route. In your case your sub does not have a built in plate amp and this will make that plan unavailable to you.
 

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I was thinking of connecting it to the 'Tape Out' RCAs, but now I'm wondering if the volume control will affect that output. Will go check that
Don't bother, the tape loop is fixed output.

What do most people do with old 2.0 receivers? Dump them and get a new one or new pre/pro?
Yeah, not much you can do other than run high level inputs to a commercial subwoofer that accepts it and high passes to the mains. Then the sub would have to have internal EQ capability.

brucek
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Ok I wont bother checking the 'Tape outs'.

But why would this not work? Send my various input sources to the Harman Kardon Preamp (It has a volume control). Send its output to a Y cable. One pair from the Y to my receiver - either the Aux in or Tape in. The other pair from the Y to the DCX2496 (or whatever else you suggest) and then to the subs power amp.

Rod
 

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But why would this not work?
It will work for sure. I would probably feed the TAPE-in rather than AUX - less circuitry.

Your mains would be full range with that setup and so you'd have to low pass the subs fairly low to avoid too much of a peak where the sub and mains mixed.

You could also send the left and right to the DCX without the Y and use the DCX as a full bass management of mains and sub. This would add a digitizing device in your mains chain, but it may be just fine. You could try it out and see what you thought of the noise floor.

brucek
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Thanks Brucek. Yes makes sense to go to the Tape-in - it's should be before the tone controls and probably a bunch of other junk.

From what I've read I'm a little hesitant to use the DCX fully for the woofers, mids & tweeters in my Klipschorns. But I have considered for down the road getting a separate power amp for just the woofers and using a couple of channels from the DCX to feed it. That way I can HP the Khorn woofers and perhaps do some other equalizing on them to get a good blend with the sub.

Rod
 

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From what I've read I'm a little hesitant to use the DCX fully for the woofers, mids & tweeters in my Klipschorns.
That isn't what I was suggesting. My suggestion was to feed the HK preamp left and right channel into the DCX. Set the DCX up as two channels (right and left) as high pass @80Hz and one channel (subwoofer) as low pass (two in/three out - the third sub channel would be a mix of left and right). Feed the two channels of right/left high pass from the DCX to the receivers tape-in (acting essentially as a stereo power amp).

Now you have full bass management with a crossover you have chosen.

burcek
 

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Discussion Starter #10
If I'm understanding your scheme correctly it would have everything come from the DCX. It would definitely give me full bass management which is appealing.

My concern is the effect on the upper frequencies. The signal for the full range of the mains would be going thru the AD/DAs and all their other stuff in the DCX. From what I've read some people feel this colors the signal in the upper frequency ranges and my Khorns are VERY revealing. That's why I thought of the scheme of just using the DCX for the sub and mains woofers. It does require a separate power amp unfortunately.

Thanks again for all your prompt and helpful responses here.

Rod
 

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The signal for the full range of the mains would be going thru the AD/DAs and all their other stuff in the DCX.
Yep, and this is why I only suggest it as something to try. It doesn't take long to hear if it's effects are audible in your system. There is great benefit to using full bass management though, where your mains won't be struggling with low frequencies that are more easily handled and equalized through a subwoofer. The sub can be positioned anywhere and equalized, and then your mains can then be positioned with an ear for soundstage without worrying that they may have a peak from modal resonances below 80Hz.

brucek
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Yes, Brucek I sure will give it a try. The full bass management may just be the best compromise. Guess this is going to lend a push to getting a new receiver though!

So after all this, and getting back to my original question, does it seem as if the DCX is the best answer for me? I haven't heard anything contrary in this thread on it, but just would like to confirm before ordering one.

Thanks,
Rod
 

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Yeah, it's a very versatile device. There isn't much it can't do. It has high pass, low pass, bandpass for each of the three inputs and six outputs. It can sum any of the inputs. It has variable crossover slopes and parametric filters, etc, etc. It's specs read quite good too. I don't think you can go wrong.

brucek
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Yeah, it's a very versatile device. There isn't much it can't do. It has high pass, low pass, bandpass for each of the three inputs and six outputs. It can sum any of the inputs. It has variable crossover slopes and parametric filters, etc, etc. It's specs read quite good too. I don't think you can go wrong.

brucek
Looks like what I'll order then. Thanks so much for all the support.

It will probably be early January before the new Danley sub is here, assembled and set up properly with this new equipment. I'll give a report here when it is.

Thanks again,
Rod
 

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Yeah, it's a very versatile device. There isn't much it can't do. It has high pass, low pass, bandpass for each of the three inputs and six outputs. It can sum any of the inputs. It has variable crossover slopes and parametric filters, etc, etc. It's specs read quite good too. I don't think you can go wrong.

brucek
I was having a play with the software for the DCX and it seems it can only create one sum'ed output. Is that correct? Can't sum 4 inputs into 2 ? (I only ask as someone told me it could, but from reading the manual and playing with the software I can't see how.)
 

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I don't own a DCX so I have no idea. I have simply read the manual on what it can do. I leave it to you to figure out how to use it.

Given the price of the DCX, have you considered a new receiver? I just recently purchased a new Denon AVR-1910 for C$599 for my second system. What an unbelievable receiver. I am quite impressed. Not much it can't do, including scaling all my video to 1080p.

brucek
 

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Discussion Starter #17
I don't own a DCX so I have no idea. I have simply read the manual on what it can do. I leave it to you to figure out how to use it.

Given the price of the DCX, have you considered a new receiver? I just recently purchased a new Denon AVR-1910 for C$599 for my second system. What an unbelievable receiver. I am quite impressed. Not much it can't do, including scaling all my video to 1080p.

brucek
What got me going on the DCX is I thought I would need it's capabilities, or something similar to do proper subwoofer equalization. If I don't need the crossover, I could then go to a lesser Behringer unit. I was hoping to get a better receiver in a year or two, but if I'm just spending a bunch of extra money now that wont be needed later, perhaps I should reconsider.

I think I can get the DCX for C$350, and a lesser one for what, about C$150? If so that's a nice chunk towards a new receiver. I believe I would want one with HDMI 1.3. Had looked at the HK line (HK254) because of it's reputed excellent SQ but apparently they still don't have their HDMI working properly. Are you pleased with the sound of the Denon?

Thanks,
Rod
 

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Denons are great. As an alternative, if you have them available in your area check out the Integra range. I have a DTR-30.1 AVR in my second system, and its does everything I want and does it extremely well.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
It will be about a month before the Danley is here so I have some time to look at options. I'll hold off for now on the DCX. Do you still recommend an external equalizer in conjunction with REW, or is Audyssey that comes with the new receivers usually sufficient for the sub?

Rod
 

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Are you pleased with the sound of the Denon?
Yeah, I bought it for the sound, but was really pleasantly surprised by the video capabilities too. A very good receiver for the money.

The Audyssey works well, but I already had a BFD, so I use it to remove any peaks in my sub before running Audyssey to give it an easier job.

brucek
 
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