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Discussion Starter #1
Is anyone running mid bass modules in their home theater anymore? I was thinking about building a pair of ported 15" mid bass modules with some of the eminence 15" pro drivers. I'm really interested in the tactical and "hit to the chest" feel. I also already have a free channel on an ep4000 that could power both modules possibly. I have a 15" SI 15-D2 sealed sub and sealed aviatrix for LCR and LR surrounds. I plan on upgrading LCR to the clearwave dynamic 4TSE and 4CCSE. I know that the dynamics could provide alot of that slam I want, but I've heard that mid bass modules and horn speakers (SEOS) with those pro audio woofers really provide a good tactical feel. I know I should just buy a driver and try it, but I wanted to see if I could get some input first. Would 12" drivers be better? Is it important to get higher xmax for 50-120hz range?

Setup would be:
onkyo nr-818 -> power 5 x aviatrix, crossover at 120Hz?
818 sub pre outs (signal 120hz and lower)-> miniDSP -> ep4000
miniDSP -> 120Hz-60Hz to mid bass modules, 60Hz and lower to SI sealed sub

The SI sealed sub is great at those lower frequencies, but I do feel like I'm lacking at 60Hz-120Hz.

Thank you for any input
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Welp, went ahead and built a box. around 3.0 cu ft. (made it the same dimensions as my sealed SI) which modeled ok in winisd for the 3015lf or the Kappa Pro-15LF-2. Is there a reason speakers with pro drivers like these always have simple rectangular cut out ports instead of tube ports with flares? I'd prefer to use tubes if it doesn't make a difference. I also wonder about port placement. I think the MBM-12 MK2 Mid-Bass Module is interesting. Driver fires down with port out the front? Any ideas doug? btw, your GJALLARHORN's are sick lol. can't wait to hear your impressions on them.

 

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I am using a pair of Hsu MBMs in my system located right behind the main two recliners. They do add punch to your back and rear end. I really did not need them for headroom, since I have 4 Hsu ULS-15s in the system plus an older Velodyne FSR-18. But they still are a very nice addition for that extra tactile feeling.

One thing to remember is time alignment with the main subs. Not needed if you put the mid bass modules close to your main subs. But the best location for tactile is close to your MLP chairs. So, separate time delay can be beneficial. I have a Denon AVR with dual, independent sub outs (AVR-A100, which is the anniversary edition of the 4311) and I use the second sub out for the MBMs. Not sure if the separate time delay makes that much of a difference, but I feel better knowing that the MBMs have it.
 

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A couple tings to keep in mind:

>80hz frequencies can be located by the ear, so they should always be up front near the main speakers

60-120hz is a very small range and can lead to a lof of phase integration issues with the speakers and sub - without some quality signal processing in your receiver/processor, it will be extremely difficult to get everyone to play together nicely
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Thanks for the responses guys. I had planned on running the mid bass modules at the front of the room. My mains, center and sub are all at the front of the room as well. In fact, both mid bass modules could sit right next to each left/right main. As far as phase alignment, the onkyo 818 receiver has audyessey xt32 and "distance to speakers" to manually adjust. Would that be enough to fine tune alignment? I know the minidsp will have phase control, but I guess it will only be able to add delay after the fact. Also what freq range would yall recommend? 60-120 ok, or should I take it up higher?

Edit: I have the minidsp umik mic as well. That can help me to make sure phases are in sync too
 

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The Gjallarhorns are almost ready - I can hardly wait!

The link Mike P suggested above uses an enclosure that is much larger, which is 6.5 cubes and tuned to 40hz. 3 cubes might be a tad small, so your tuning would be higher than Mav's. If you want to only use it for above 50 or 60 hz, then the smaller size would probably be more appropriate. Maybe start with tuning for 50 hz. I would cross my own as high as 50, so I would most likely do something similar to Mav's enclosure to use as a stand for my center, but maybe something closer to 5 cubes.
 

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Mike P already pointed out my build. I was very happy with those, it was my mains that let me down at that point.

You should also consider something like my current mains, look in my sig for the thread on those. They have incredible midbass and midrange energy, whis I love. There's just no substitute for large high sensitivity drivers in a big box! 8)
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Doug - Now that you mention that, I think I will go with the Kappa Pro-15LF-2 15". It's more suited for ~3.0 cu ft. I'm playing with the tunings in winisd too, pretty interesting. What's the rule on tuning again? If you tune to say 50Hz, your crossover should be set at just below or above 50Hz?

Atledreiser - I read through your whole thread the other day, pretty good stuff. Definitely a motivator. So you moved away from the mid bass modules and just have those big mains now?
 

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Discussion Starter #12
So I'm looking at using the Kappa Pro-15LF-2 15" driver in a 3.0 cu ft box, with 2 x 2.5" ports at length of 3.0" to get a tuning of 45Hz. This gets a pretty flat modeled response. Being that it will be crossed at 50Hz (at the lowest) on the low end, I don't think it'll be getting tons of air flow through the ports, so 2 x 2.5" ports should be ok correct? Also, are there recommendations on port location placement? I'd like to shoot them out the front with the driver if possible.

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=290-420
http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=260-386

 

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Atledreiser - I read through your whole thread the other day, pretty good stuff. Definitely a motivator. So you moved away from the mid bass modules and just have those big mains now?
I have those big mains and four JBL 4645C subwoofers. At the time I used the midbass modules I had two Soundsplinter RL-p15 LLT sonotubes that were a little lacking in the midbass area. Now that I have six 15" and 4 18" drivers I'm good for midbass... :)
 

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Discussion Starter #14
I have those big mains and four JBL 4645C subwoofers. At the time I used the midbass modules I had two Soundsplinter RL-p15 LLT sonotubes that were a little lacking in the midbass area. Now that I have six 15" and 4 18" drivers I'm good for midbass... :)
lol wow
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Welp got the box finished and the Kappa Pro-15LF-2 installed. Went with the 2.5" ports and cut them down to 2.5" long to get a tuning around 48Hz. For testing, I turned on the 50Hz hpf on the ep4000 for both the SI sealed sub and the mid bass module. I also raised the crossover on the receiver to 200Hz. I wanted to compare the SI sub against the kappa mid bass on their ability for mid bass function. While the kappa packed plenty of punch, I feel like the SI had just as much punch...with wayyy more overhead as well. Perhaps I should have bought a pro driver with more xmax, but I feel like this driver won't be able to keep up with reference level listening. The sound the kappa box produced seemed to be just not as "clean" as the SI either.

I think I'll probably return/sell the kappa and add another SI sealed sub to utilize that extra channel on ep4000. Then between the 2nd sub and getting the front left and right of the dynamic 4TSE speakers, I think I'll have enough power/punch.

 

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Well that's too bad, but the SI will be cheaper in the end, right? What center and mains do you have now?
 

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Discussion Starter #17
ya the SI will probably end up cheaper...would of had to buy a miniDSP for the mid bass modules too. Main L/R and surrounds are sealed aviatrix, designed by curt. Great, great speakers, but I need more SPL. I have the Clearwave dynamic 4CC SE for center channel. I plan on building 2 more of them... 4TSE for L/R mains. I think that will solve my "want more punch" problem. The dynamics really are a serious speaker. Just gotta save up for 2 more of them, lol. For surrounds, I actually have 2 of these: http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=302-857 Need to build them
 

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Ultimately that's the better solution anyway - midbass modules (as introduced by HSU) were always a bit of a gimmick. Capable speakers and capable subs with your receiver's auto EQ will result in capable midbass.
 

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Doug - Now that you mention that, I think I will go with the Kappa Pro-15LF-2 15". It's more suited for ~3.0 cu ft. I'm playing with the tunings in winisd too, pretty interesting. What's the rule on tuning again? If you tune to say 50Hz, your crossover should be set at just below or above 50Hz?

Atledreiser - I read through your whole thread the other day, pretty good stuff. Definitely a motivator. So you moved away from the mid bass modules and just have those big mains now?
I would check to see about the phase response of the sub and pick a crossover point and tuning point to get the sub and mid bass to align in phase over the crossover region. If you do not do this then you will require dsp to do the same thing as I am describing in the "old" way.

I personally do like a mid-bass more in the 12 or 10 inch realm easier to integrate with the midrange and able to push the midrange up in frequency to gain more headroom.
 
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