Home Theater Forum and Systems banner

161 - 180 of 363 Posts

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
7,209 Posts
Discussion Starter #161
So, after my aptly named teaser post, some of the details:

I first listened to the Studio 100s as I had gave them a go once before - they were as I remembered - detailed and good thump. I was still impressed with them.

Next up was the Triton IIs. Aesthetically, they were just OK - it is not a speaker that I feel like I could take the grill off and have it look impressive in any fashion. That was one of the things I like about the Studios - they are a nice looking speaker with grills off and on. They are much taller and slimmer than the Studios as well which allows for a bit more leeway as far as placement in my specific situation. One thing I did not realize about these was that the woofers have their own powered amp and require an outlet - that curtails the flexibility somewhat. The CC was not hooked up so I did not hear it, but first impression - underwhelming.

As far as sound, the Tritons are a more laid back speaker in comparison to the Studios IMO - there was not as much detail as I noticed with them - intake of breath, snap of a drum were somewhat lost. The vocals as well as the horns (from the RoTK tracks) just were not as dynamic. Also, with the powered woofers, I have a feeling they were pulled back a bit as there was nowhere near the level of thump I noticed from the Studios. The width and depth of the soundstage was also a bit limited - on axis was OK, but once you moved around a bit there was a definite decline in performance.

In summation of the Tritons - as I am sure you can probably tell from above - I was not terribly impressed. They just did not captivate me as well as the 100s did.

As far as the CM9, I was just starting to listen to them when the owner asked me about my knowledge of compressed versus loseless files. As I am somewhat limited knowledge-wise in this regard, he walked me through the difference. In the process, I noticed in another room what I thought looked like the Thiel CS2.4s - lo and behold they were! As they were on my list as well, I sat down to take a listen.......

And I was very impressed. They were incredibly detailed without the slightest sense of brightness - they were more dynamic than the 100s IMO and were not overbearing at all. Female vocals were amazing - so crystal clear and you could hear every breath with great range. The best way I can describe it was that the sound just felt effortless. I was able to discern so many nuances in the tracks that I just had not heard previously. But, after closing my eyes - I could not locate the speakers at all - they had disappeared seamlessly.

Off axis, there was a slight drop off in sound but it did not occur until about 45 degrees off center - beyond where my outermost seats would be. The towers are very unique-looking and look impressive with grills on and off. I was not keen on the finish of those particular speakers and I have not looked to see what the CC and surrounds look like - need to check those out.

All in all, I was extremely pleased with the 2.4s. If I had to order them at this point, it would be:

Thiel CS2.4
Studio 100s
Triton IIs

I need to go back and give the CM9s a go, but I have a sneaking suspicion they won't wow me like the Thiels did. The one downside - the price tag. :) I would more than likely need to either look for used or plan to buy speakers in pieces.

That's it for now - more to come soon!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,747 Posts
How would you compare your current speakers to the ones you auditioned?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,660 Posts
Certainly the results you would expect, save the Triton IIs. I would have figured they fared better in performance given their fine reviews. My taste in looks is spot-on with yours, the Studios are almost intimidating :gulp:
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
7,209 Posts
Discussion Starter #165
How would you compare your current speakers to the ones you auditioned?
LOL! Now, why did I not think of that?! For those that do not know, I purchased a set of the Emp Tek e55Ti B-Stock towers a while ago. In comparison, I would put the Emp Teks just a shade below the Studio 100s - TBH, I would be fine with either speaker. Aesthetically, I like the look of the 100s a tad better and the CC for the 100s (the 690) is probably the most intimidating CC I have seen from those I researched so far.

As far as sound, the 100s seem to be more.... forward (?) than my Emp Teks. The best way I can explain it is when I listen to the 100s, I feel like the soundstage is right on top of me - almost pushing at me. This is probably why I liked the Thiels more than the 100s because they had great detail, but I did not get that feeling while listening to them. Comparing the Thiels to the Emp Teks, the Emp Teks do not have the detail of the Thiels - probably not even close. Now, don't get me wrong - I am very glad I got the Emp Teks as they have proven to provide a good listening experience for me and I plan on them permanently residing in my living room system. That said, for my dedicated HT, I would definitely choose the Thiels over everything else I have heard so far.

I guess my biggest issue is, this is my first real foray into good HT sound - it has been car audio for me mostly (and an Acoustimass 10 stint). For me, I always hiked the treble way up and the bass slightly so I have become accustomed to a "brighter" sound I guess.

However, after listening to the Emp Teks for the past month, I have gained a greater appreciation for a speaker that just "disappears" as this is what the Emp Teks do for me. This is probably the most important factor for my final choice - I want great sound that is just heard and not seen.

Hopefully, that response is somewhat understandable - reading through it I am not so sure it is not just a rambling gargled mess. :dumbcrazy:

Certainly the results you would expect, save the Triton IIs. I would have figured they fared better in performance given their fine reviews. My taste in looks is spot-on with yours, the Studios are almost intimidating :gulp:
Agreed Ty - I too thought the Triton IIs would fare better and was really disappointed.

I have nothing useful to add, as your speaker budget exceeds my whole room budget - but I am really enjoying this thread so far and feel like I am learning quite a bit.

Good luck on your quest!
Thanks Aaron! I actually invested (my other main interest) my initial speaker budget and it has grown to this point. Matter of fact, given the recent market trend, my budget is a bit higher than it was when I first began this "journey". :jump: Now, if I just hit the lottery maybe I can look at those Legacy speakers Dave reviewed a couple weeks ago... ;)
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
8,112 Posts
Hello,
Have you had a chance to listen to any Focal, Dynaudio, Revel, and the PSB Imagine or Synchrony Series? The Focal 826w Prestige Edition is excellent and uses the "W" Woofer used in much more expensive Focal Speakers. And the others have Speakers that cost close to the same as the 2.4's.

While if it was me, I would probably be agonizing between the 2.4's and the 826w's, given the investment it is certainly worth the due diligence of auditioning these others as well. As this Thread is on Page 17, it is hard to remember if you had already listened to many/any of these other Speakers.
Cheers,
JJ
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,747 Posts
As far as sound, the 100s seem to be more.... forward (?) than my Emp Teks. The best way I can explain it is when I listen to the 100s, I feel like the soundstage is right on top of me - almost pushing at me. This is probably why I liked the Thiels more than the 100s because they had great detail, but I did not get that feeling while listening to them. Comparing the Thiels to the Emp Teks, the Emp Teks do not have the detail of the Thiels - probably not even close. Now, don't get me wrong - I am very glad I got the Emp Teks as they have proven to provide a good listening experience for me and I plan on them permanently residing in my living room system. That said, for my dedicated HT, I would definitely choose the Thiels over everything else I have heard so far.
Heh... of course you can't expect a speaker you paid $400 for to REALLY be in the same league as a much more expensive speaker, but it's good that you're starting to establish a sense of "image dissapearance" that you find you prefer :)

As far as the EMPs are concerned their high end siblings might be a much more realistic comparision to those Thiels, like the RBH SX-6300/R ($3280/pr)



or the Status Acoustics 8T ($50000/pr)

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
19 Posts
Joe,

Thanks for providing information on your demos. Its invaluable as it allows me to compare notes.

I had recent demos of the following:

Goldenear Triton 2 - 2 demos in 2 different environments. Both demos were very different. 1st demo was terrible. Too much bass muddied the mid-range. In fairness, I attribute that to the possibility the bass knob was too high (I didn't check), as well as, the location of the speakers were close to the walls bunched in with other speakers.
I had a second listen to the Triton 2 at Stereo Exchange in NYC and the demo was much more successful. Overall, I"m not yet convinced this is the speaker for me. I'm beginning to think it creates more problems when a speaker integrates a subwoofer.

B&W CM9 - Did everything correctly. Mids and highs sounded good. However, for me something was missing and I believe it was imaging. The sound was coming directly from the speakers and I was not able to visualize musicians in the room.

Martin Logan Electro Motion ESLs - I'm fascinated with this speaker. I've listened to the ESLs in 4 different locations for a total of 3 hours. Each listening experience was completely different. 1st listen was incredible. Volume was pumped up and the couch was shaking due to the bass, which in my mind was not suppose to happen based on its specifications. I never left the sweet spot during this listen and was blown away. I also experienced a horrible demo with these speakers. The sweet spot was below ear level and between the panels. Everytime I stood up, where ear level was higher than the panels, the sound-field collapsed. Volume was significantly degraded and everything sounded flat. In addition, not good when wide left and right of the panels, even at ear level below the top.
This experience made me nervous about purchasing the ESLs. Its very dependent on positioning and room environment. I am thinking of purchasing on a 30 day trial from one of the many online retailers. If I experience what happened during the demo at home, I simply disconnect, pack up and ship back.

Next week, I have demos scheduled for the PSB Imagine and Totem Sttaf and Hawk. This dealer also carries Revel and the Concerta F12 is certainly within the price range, so I may take a listen. He's also a Sonus Faber dealer and the Toy series has peaked my interest.

Since I'm into Home Theater, one of my main criteria is floor-standers with a great center speaker. The Center Speaker performance is a must.

Please keep on providing information. Thanks.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
7,209 Posts
Discussion Starter #169
Hello,
Have you had a chance to listen to any Focal, Dynaudio, Revel, and the PSB Imagine or Synchrony Series? The Focal 826w Prestige Edition is excellent and uses the "W" Woofer used in much more expensive Focal Speakers. And the others have Speakers that cost close to the same as the 2.4's.

While if it was me, I would probably be agonizing between the 2.4's and the 826w's, given the investment it is certainly worth the due diligence of auditioning these others as well. As this Thread is on Page 17, it is hard to remember if you had already listened to many/any of these other Speakers.
Cheers,
JJ
So far, the only speakers I have heard are the Thiels, Studio 100s, Triton IIs and the Emp Tek e55Tis. This Friday, I will be taking a trip down to Saturday Audio and listening to as many of the following speakers as I can:

PSB Synchrony One and Two
Sonus Faber Luito Towers
Totem Hawks and Sttafs
PSB Imagine T and T2
Monitor Audio RX6 and RX8

I did take a look at the Dynaudio Xcite line - after reading the reviews, I decided to not actively pursue giving them a listen since most reviews I read were not glowing. I have the Focal 826 available at a nearby American TV, but their room is far from ideal so I am not sure how they will sound - I will be giving them a go though. I have not done any research on the Revels as of yet.

Fortunately, next month I am attending a GTG here in WI that will have the following speakers available:

Philharmonic IIs
Salk Soundscape 10s
Vapor Audio Joules
Ascend Acoustics Sierra Tower w/RAAL tweeter
Salk Songtowers w/RAAL tweeter
Salk Sound Veracity HT2 w/RAAL tweeter
PSB Image T55 towers

The following weekend I am making the trip to Craig's for the CHT GTG and another HTS member has graciously offered to have me come over to listen to his Ascend Acoustics Sierra 1 system.

Here is a link to the current living document. I added a column on the 1st page listing the audition date for each speaker. I have also added a second page (called Speaker Technical Specs) that lists all the specifications I can find for the given speaker. I will be adding a third page giving the details of my audition for each speaker and my impressions (as soon as I can :bigsmile:).

Heh... of course you can't expect a speaker you paid $400 for to REALLY be in the same league as a much more expensive speaker, but it's good that you're starting to establish a sense of "image dissapearance" that you find you prefer :)

As far as the EMPs are concerned their high end siblings might be a much more realistic comparision to those Thiels, like the RBH SX-6300/R ($3280/pr)



or the Status Acoustics 8T ($50000/pr)

Good point. ;) And, for 50k a pair, those speakers better dance and tell jokes too! :)

Joe,

Thanks for providing information on your demos. Its invaluable as it allows me to compare notes.

I had recent demos of the following:

Goldenear Triton 2 - 2 demos in 2 different environments. Both demos were very different. 1st demo was terrible. Too much bass muddied the mid-range. In fairness, I attribute that to the possibility the bass knob was too high (I didn't check), as well as, the location of the speakers were close to the walls bunched in with other speakers.
I had a second listen to the Triton 2 at Stereo Exchange in NYC and the demo was much more successful. Overall, I"m not yet convinced this is the speaker for me. I'm beginning to think it creates more problems when a speaker integrates a subwoofer.

B&W CM9 - Did everything correctly. Mids and highs sounded good. However, for me something was missing and I believe it was imaging. The sound was coming directly from the speakers and I was not able to visualize musicians in the room.

Martin Logan Electro Motion ESLs - I'm fascinated with this speaker. I've listened to the ESLs in 4 different locations for a total of 3 hours. Each listening experience was completely different. 1st listen was incredible. Volume was pumped up and the couch was shaking due to the bass, which in my mind was not suppose to happen based on its specifications. I never left the sweet spot during this listen and was blown away. I also experienced a horrible demo with these speakers. The sweet spot was below ear level and between the panels. Everytime I stood up, where ear level was higher than the panels, the sound-field collapsed. Volume was significantly degraded and everything sounded flat. In addition, not good when wide left and right of the panels, even at ear level below the top.
This experience made me nervous about purchasing the ESLs. Its very dependent on positioning and room environment. I am thinking of purchasing on a 30 day trial from one of the many online retailers. If I experience what happened during the demo at home, I simply disconnect, pack up and ship back.

Next week, I have demos scheduled for the PSB Imagine and Totem Sttaf and Hawk. This dealer also carries Revel and the Concerta F12 is certainly within the price range, so I may take a listen. He's also a Sonus Faber dealer and the Toy series has peaked my interest.

Since I'm into Home Theater, one of my main criteria is floor-standers with a great center speaker. The Center Speaker performance is a must.

Please keep on providing information. Thanks.
Thanks for the info from your own demos! Very helpful and we are about to listen to several of the same speakers - it will be great comparing notes. I know I should audition a set of MLs, but I keep hearing how finicky they can be and it makes me nervous as well.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,697 Posts
I would like to add a link to the living document to my 1st post - do any of the moderators following this thread have the ability to unlock that for me? If you do and could for me, I would sincerely appreciate it.

Thanks!!
I cannot unlock the post, but I did edit it for you. If you'd like something different, or wish to add something, send me a PM and I'll get r done. :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
141 Posts
ALMFamily- I listened to the 2.4's about a week ago at University Audio and I was impressed but it didn't quite knock my socks off. I went to pick up some isolation materials so I didn't have my demo CD with me so I listened to unfamiliar music. With that being said I didn't feel they were very dynamic. I like a speaker to go from 0-100-0 right now and maybe it was the material but I felt they really didn't have that capability. Plus they are a little more than what I would like to spend. On a side note I think its cool your other passion is investing, mine too. I also invested my whole room budget in AAPL in April of '09 sadly I sold half after it crossed $400 but I put it into a Mico 40 so I am happy. Probably use the 70 shares I have left to buy the wife something fancy for putting up with me and my HT disease.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
7,209 Posts
Discussion Starter #174
ALMFamily- I listened to the 2.4's about a week ago at University Audio and I was impressed but it didn't quite knock my socks off. I went to pick up some isolation materials so I didn't have my demo CD with me so I listened to unfamiliar music. With that being said I didn't feel they were very dynamic. I like a speaker to go from 0-100-0 right now and maybe it was the material but I felt they really didn't have that capability. Plus they are a little more than what I would like to spend. On a side note I think its cool your other passion is investing, mine too. I also invested my whole room budget in AAPL in April of '09 sadly I sold half after it crossed $400 but I put it into a Mico 40 so I am happy. Probably use the 70 shares I have left to buy the wife something fancy for putting up with me and my HT disease.
I guess what I enjoyed most is that I felt I heard exactly what was meant to be heard - without the speakers losing anything in the translastion. It was just a clean, crisp listening experience - perhaps I am confusing the term dynamic? To me, dynamic means its ability to maintain the swings in vocal range while still keeping that feeling that I am hearing everything. Is that not accurate? And, yeah, they basically ate up my budget for just the towers - would definitely be looking used if I went with those.

I find so few people with an interest in investing - perhaps I should start a Swamp thread where people could discuss strategies, what fundamentals they look for, things like that. Definitely not a advice on specific buys thread, just a friendly discussion of what kinds of things to look for when picking, buying / selling, etc. Might be fun and informative.........
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
47 Posts
You could always go DIY... or pay someone to build for you, if you don't like sawdust or something. That's my next front speaker, an 18" H-frame with a full range 8" on top open baffle dipole (Martin Logan and Maggies are both a type of open baffle).

According to Martin King's specs these should do a full 20Hz-20KHz and cost me under $1000 for the pair. Start building with more exotic drivers and designs and something like the $7500 (on sale) Jamo R909 or the Linkwitz Orion are possible, with a way to tailor to suit your needs and budget.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
7,209 Posts
Discussion Starter #176
You could always go DIY... or pay someone to build for you, if you don't like sawdust or something. That's my next front speaker, an 18" H-frame with a full range 8" on top open baffle dipole (Martin Logan and Maggies are both a type of open baffle).

According to Martin King's specs these should do a full 20Hz-20KHz and cost me under $1000 for the pair. Start building with more exotic drivers and designs and something like the $7500 (on sale) Jamo R909 or the Linkwitz Orion are possible, with a way to tailor to suit your needs and budget.
Oh, I don't mind DIY at all - I actually plan to stick my nose into the DIY world at some point. However, I am currently building my HT room - if I were to start building speakers as well I might never finish either! ;)

Plus, as this is my 1st real home audio venture, I would like to get a feel for what I appreciate before I start building my own.....
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
141 Posts
I think of dynamic as the quietest to the loudest my favorite demo of this is Copland's Hoe Down about 2mins in there are oboes playing very very softly then out of no where the trumpets and trombones and strings blast 5 notes at an almost deafening level then back to nothing. My wifes 802D's do this fantastically thats is what I meant by 0-100-0 without getting sloshy or muddy. Maybe I have the term wrong. I felt the crossovers in the theils didn't know where to route some of the information and therefore made it muddy.
The idea of an informal investment "club" would be cool. I would definately participate in that as investing was my love before HT, and before my wife. Are you long/short do you do fundamental/technical analysis?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
7,209 Posts
Discussion Starter #178
Now I understand what you mean by 0-100-0 - the Angel track is the one that was suggested to me to perform that kind of test - I actually thought it performed pretty well on that. I suppose that just proves the point that listening to as many as possible is paramount as one person's opinion of a specific speaker can vary widely with anothers - it is definitely a personal thing.

I really should start that thread and not derail this one, but the short answer is short and I sure do - I subscribe to the William O'Neil CANSLIM principles.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
47 Posts
Copeland's Fanfare for the Common Man is another highly dynamic piece of music... the trick is finding the right version! I have one that at something close to "live" volume levels (from one of the front rows) it chased two different pair of Maggies and a pair of Dahlquist out of my living room in shame. The guy that bought the speakers (!) left me with it but I've never been able to find out who did it.
 
161 - 180 of 363 Posts
Top