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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Now that the formula using AAA-F has been around for a while, have you noticed any color degradation over time like was observed with the Henry's component?
 

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Now that the formula using AAA-F has been around for a while, have you noticed any color degradation over time like was observed with the Henry's component?
Not that I have seen or heard of. The Henry product reared it's ugly head early on and I never really liked it because it had a lot of ingrediants I didn't like. I think I am the only person on the planet that has a ready supply of Black Jack! I have something like 25 gallons now lol. Anyway, Henry replaced Black Jack, and then a better and easier solution was found with the AAA.

Like I said, I haven't heard of any issues like we saw with Henry.
 

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There have been no color shifts from the Auto Air component. The biggest color shift today in diy screens is from polyurethanes. Minwax starts to shift pretty quickly - within a month or two. And the shift is away from green (towards yellow).
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Thanks for the heads-up on the poly and the update on the AAA-F. I'd seen many suggest mixing that in at 4:1 but you put that idea to rest for me.

-- Bob
 

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Thanks for the heads-up on the poly and the update on the AAA-F. I'd seen many suggest mixing that in at 4:1 but you put that idea to rest for me.

-- Bob
Maybe elsewhere but I don't recall anyone here ever recommending that. Some places constantly have to change things because they really don't understand why things work the way they do. That and when everything is just a big guess anyway by throwing things in a vat... well then that type of environment breeds a mix of the week type mentality. Also when people don't understand something, they tend to make things more complex in order to make it sound more impressive and important. The more components and pieces anything uses means there are more areas for something to go wrong.

Black Widow works and there isn't a reason to change it. It is dead on neutral and has been right from the very begining and it is that way because we spent a lot of time researching and testing things. The only reason it would ever change would be if AAA was discontinued and we had to find another source for aluminium. Actually if you look at all the methods we present, none of them change, and for the same reason... they work so there is no reason to change them.

I never understood how someone could keep changing something almost every week, and each and every time say it was 'the best'. Better than what? And just wait a week or two and it will change again, so does that make the week old version worse now? If they say the 'new' mix is 'the best' then it sure sounds like the week old mix is no longer 'the best'! That's what happens without standards and specs. Anyone can say anything they want.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Bill,

Sorry, I wasn't very clear in my post -- I didn't see that recommended on this site but rather elsewhere on the net before I found the HT Shack.

Didn't mean to touch a nerve :) I do appreciate all of the exhaustive work you put into this!

-- Bob
 

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Bill,

Sorry, I wasn't very clear in my post -- I didn't see that recommended on this site but rather elsewhere on the net before I found the HT Shack.

Didn't mean to touch a nerve :) I do appreciate all of the exhaustive work you put into this!

-- Bob
No worries Bob. Our apologizes if you thought that most of Bill's post was meant for you.

The problem is that another DIY Screens forum spreads so much misinformation that it sometimes gets frustrating trying to counter that misinformation and keep things factual. That same forum, or at least one of the main posters there, likes to spread mistruths about our Black Widow™ mix. He's been at it again and that nerve was a bit raw - sorry about that.
 

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Thanks for the heads-up on the poly and the update on the AAA-F. I'd seen many suggest mixing that in at 4:1 but you put that idea to rest for me.

-- Bob
The site you read it at doesn't do any actual testing or any spectrophotometer readings. It's all by eyeball over there. The one thing that came out of my latest polyurethane testing was that Valspar's Ultra Premium in an eggshell finish, tinted Sherwin Williams Gray screen, didn't hot spot and performed as well as any of the poly mixtures. And while I haven't taken a recent reading from it, I'm fairly certain that the color didn't shift.

The poly ratios also hot spotted when using the white/Black level settings for a screen of the same shade of gray. One of these days I'll get that thread going... until then, some of the pictures are here. :T

Bill,

Sorry, I wasn't very clear in my post -- I didn't see that recommended on this site but rather elsewhere on the net before I found the HT Shack.

Didn't mean to touch a nerve :) I do appreciate all of the exhaustive work you put into this!

-- Bob
It's all good Bob! :bigsmile:
 

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Bob I'm the one that's sorry if I sounded that way!

I was mainly saying that those that recommend adding poly either don't know it yellows or are altering BW for the sake of altering it- and it doesn't need to be altered. :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Not a problem, Bill. Thanks for the explanation. I'm planning on a Scorpion screen and can't wait to see the results!

A little background on my project. I'm designing a replacement video system for our church and we've decided on a Sanyo PLC-WM5500 with a very long throw lens (~60 ft). The Sanyo rep brought a demo out to our site and the brightness (as tested on BOC) looked great. Our ambient measures about 7 fc so the blacks are somewhat washed out, which is why I'm considering a gray screen. (I'm afraid we're going to get some pushback from some of the members on the non-white screen though. They want it to blend with the walls when it's not in use.)

Given the conflicting mix of technical and aesthetic requirements, would you recommend the S8 or S8.5?

Thanks,
Bob
 

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Wow! That's a bright pj! :T What size screen are you going to have? You can plug the numbers into the PJ Calculator at ProjectorCentral.com and then look at the fL numbers. Make sure to enter in the gain - use .9 for Scorpion. It's probably more like .95 but better to err on the low side. If you still have a lot of fL left over, you could even do a Black Widow™ screen.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
It is, but we lose 40% of its light through the long throw lens. We're projecting from 57' ft. So instead of 5500 lumens we only see 3300. Our screen size is 96" x 60" (16:10). With the 7 fc ambient, I figure we'll get a contrast ratio of about 10:1.

There is now way our congregation would go for a screen as dark (when it's not in use) as the BW. I'm trying to decide between the S8 and S8.5
 

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Even losing 40% you'd still be in the 60fL range... WOW! That's a lot. :yikes:

Keep in mind there really isn't much difference between a N7.5 and a N8. And given your contrast ratio, I'd go a dark as you can persuade them to let you. :T
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 · (Edited)
Even losing 40% you'd still be in the 60fL range... WOW! That's a lot. :yikes:
Actually, it's closer to 80fl. But I can't really go much lower than that and maintain a 10:1 CR, given that the ambient is 7fl. Maybe I'll try the BW and hope I don't get tar and feathered!

-- Bob
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 · (Edited)
Thanks, Harpmaker, this is very helpful.

Do you know if there is any info on the Munsell ratings of some commercial screens, eg. HC Da-Mat, HC Cinema, etc.? I have samples of these and it would help in visualizing how dark the various DIY mixes are. (I've come up dry on forum search.)

Thanks,
Bob
 

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Do you know if there is any info on the Munsell ratings of some commercial screens, eg. HC Da-Mat, HC Cinema, etc.? I have samples of these and it would help in visualizing how dark the various DIY mixes are. (I've come up dry on forum search.)
Take a look at the Commercial review threads. I take spectro readings of everything. There's also some Da-Lite material in my sig file. They're labeled with "DL-". :T
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Thanks Mechman, that's just what I was looking for.

As far as the PJ power is concerned, my figure of 80fl is way higher than other reference numbers that I'm seeing (14fl min, 25 theater, 35 TV, etc.) The demo we did with the Sanyo and the long lens should have cut our eyes it would have been so bright. And yet, it was very impressive (with the exception of the elevated blacks), not too bright with our ambient conditions.

Could it be that when the brightness and contrast were set correctly that the actual fl level was lower than the 3300 fl max? Is this what is referred to "video optimized". Bill, I think it was, noted that actual PJ power may only be 1/3 of rated power for video optimized settings.

-- Bob
 
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