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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Hello

This is a fantastic site. I am here to learn. Below is just my current vision of what is need to build a great home theater / music sub to rival my 7+ year old sub that cost $500 back then. Please feel free to coach me for better selections. I dont know if I should spend more money on amp or more money on driver. You will see my assumptions, subs I like, and where I think I should focus in order of priority. In summary, if you had $700 what would you do? Less money would be great.


Amp and Sub needed

Assumptions
- EP2500 is a popular amp on this forum
- Sub looking for is 15” to 18” (leaning towards 15” for smaller enclosure)
- Shape of enclosure doesn’t matter
- LLT seems to be the bang for the buck
- Someone in Atlanta that would let me hear an LLT ;-)
- I can build something a lot better then my VTF-2 that just failed post 7 years warranty
- I will get help
- Going to build 2 – one to go in my friends house

Size of Rooms (might go in either)
13x15
15x24

Characteristics priority
1. Sound Quality
2. Low
3. Flexible room size
4. Smaller size would be nice
5. Sono to the ceiling is just too big

Subs I like so far from this site
Short and sweet
http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/soundsplinter/11636-my-sealed-rl-p18.html
Nice finish and small
http://www.hometheatershack.com/for...my-sub-2-12-tc-sounds-tc1000-sealed-pics.html
Interesting (pic at the bottom)
http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/soundsplinter/3778-ss-rl-p15-my-first-diy-box-sub-2.html
This looks good
http://www.hometheatershack.com/for...aled-15-soundsplinter-rl-p15-subwoofer-2.html
My favorite (hidden)
http://www.hometheatershack.com/for...aled-ported/11365-shallow-llt-possible-2.html

Order of selection priority (I think)
1. Driver (from US suppliers) - I believe the first thing I need is the selection of the driver. $400 just for a driver is too much I believe. I don’t know.

2. Port (if LLT {most likely LLT}) - I will need help with the size of the port

3. Cubic Inches for LLT - Need help with size of enclosure

4. Amp

What I would like to see?
3 options for drivers and 3 options for amps. Good better best maybe and maybe a why? A graph could explain why as well as any explaination you could think of.
I am starting to understand graphs but I dont fully understand all of the lingo. So when you post have that in mind.

What I would not like to see?
Comments like: "do some research" without directly pointing to something or some site.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Thanks for the suggestions so far.

Mike P - I see you made a 12" sono tub. That looks really nice! I would be into that. I dont need loud. I have read you should get as big as you can afford. But... I would like to stay away from huge if at all possible. SPL is not important. Sound quality and size of structure are at the top. I figured 15" because it would allow me to build a smaller enclosure. I would even do the 12" sono if it will sound better then the store bought. I would even do 12" anything, but I dont see too many of you building with 12". I see a lot of 15 and mostly 18"s.

Can some of you guys suggest *gulp* smaller?
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I have been trying to find info on the tempest. I have found very little. But what I saw was positive. It looks very attractive. I could get 2 and fix my Car Subwoofer screw up.

I played with WinISD and the tempest. I got the tempest file from the IB website. I must be doing something wrong. (user error) The white line goes above the red line and I cant get it to come down unless I build a 12 ft^3 enclosure. At that size I might as well do the 18.

Mike
I can not find the IXL 18" for $250. Do you have a graph for 18"? I would do it but I dont know where to get the file for the win program. Remember I'm in the US. What does 18 graph look like? Would the box have to be Huge? I'm almost of the mind set, build now ask for forgiveness later with WAF. After seeing your setup, you have to know something. So lets see, I believe I have the setup for the smaller enclosure. I think I want to see what a big enclosure will get me. Let's take away the size limitation and go all out with an 18". Thanks for the responses so far Mike!

I am really surprise at the number of responses in this thread. Is it $700 is too little for you guys?:huh: Its hard for me to believe that there are only 2 subwoofers in this price range. I will even go Sono. Please help.

If you make a suggestion, can you give me a link to were to buy it for said price? I am having trouble finding it at the prices listed so far.

Thanks!!!
 

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I might be coming to the party late, but I direct you to this design. So far I have built one [a more complicated version] and another user from a different forum has. The driver is of superb quality and I designed the cabinet to take full advantage of this units power. Another plus is the cabinet is fully designed and a cut list supplied.
 

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I can not find the IXL 18" for $250
http://www.mach5audio.com/zen/index...ath=65&zenid=7c5f8d0098c8281dd80d5ca50f31e640

It appears the price went up $15 to $265. Keep in mind that includes shipping anywhere in North America.

here is the EP2500 for $268.

http://www.hometheatershack.com/ele...Q9I-Behringer_EuroPower_EP2500_Power_Amp.html

Here are the WinISD files for the IXL-18 and also the IXL-15.

View attachment IXL-18.4.zip

View attachment IXL-15.2.zip

Model the IXL-18 in 12.5 cu.ft. tuned to 15 hz and also model the IXL-15 in 6 cu.ft. tuned to 18 hz.
 

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I am really surprise at the number of responses in this thread. Is it $700 is too little for you guys?:huh: Its hard for me to believe that there are only 2 subwoofers in this price range. I will even go Sono. Please help.
Are you serious? You have at least six different people helping you out here! What else do you want? :dontknow:

Also, everyone has mentioned the Tempest-X and IXL-18 only probably because they are the best choices at the price point you set. You can model both to see which one will do what you want to do better (given size of enclosure, power, etc.). Certainly there are plenty of cheaper options just as there are more expensive ones. For example, for a bit more ($420) you could get a Soundsplinter RLP 18", but then you'd have to skimp on the amp or increase your budget. For less ($130) you could get a 15" Dayton DVC and a 300 watt BASH amp ($150). However you posted $700 as your budget, so that's what we were trying to fit.
 

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Since you're building a sub for a buddy at the same time...take advantage of multiple sub discounts! Diycable sells 4 packs of the Tempest-X and Mach 5 offers discounts on 4 of the same sub.

What I am getting at is that you can build two boxes (1 for you and 1 for friend) with 2 subwoofers each or four boxes (2 for you and 2 for friend) with 1 sub each. You could use one channel of the EP2500 for each subwoofer...

BTW, Diycable offers some box design ideas (download the Tempest-X Application Notes) and Mach 5 has some box size recommendations too...
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 · (Edited)
Are you serious? You have at least six different people helping you out here! What else do you want? :dontknow:
Boomie

I didnt realize these were the only options. The price was set between 100 and 700. But today I realize you are guys are looking out for my best interest. :yay: Best sub possible at the listed price. I saw some youtube action on bass. Starting to understand what you guys seek with all that gear. Starting to understand why you guys upgrade from Covetts to Z06. It's fun!

Infinity
Me and Infinity have a history that is not the best. I'll spare the long story. I cant do the Kappas.:rolleyesno: Most of my issues with Infinity is just plain bad luck or lack of knowlegde. Still, can't do it. I love the simplicity of the design though. I wish I knew how to adapt it to work with IXL.

Yes I have pulled the trigger on a purchase.
15 IXL
EP2500
1124

If anyone could spare cut plans or anything for a Sonutube and/or MDF build, I would love it. If it is functional, you get extra credit! I am shooting for LLT. Can 6 in^3 be LLT? I have a feeling when the stuff comes in Ill be :scratch: :huh:. "Help me OB1-Wan Kenobi! Your my only hope.

PS . I did a WinISD on the 15.2.2. It looks great. However, I think since MikeP has been doing this longer my graph is wrong. My graph has the IXL15.2.2 going up to 20 then dropping into the teens.:scratch: His doesnt make it to 20 (above the purple line that is).
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Somehow the files I posted ended up corrupted. I replaced them both with WinISD files of the modeling already done for the IXL-18 and IXL-15. Notice in the EQ/Filter tab a highpass filter has been applied to keep the excursion within limits.
Awesome!!!!!!! :jump: I'm actually beginning to understand this. A friend of mine did circuit work for his degree. He spit out some things about +3 - -3 and what not. In 30 mins I quantum leaped in understanding. Going from website to website helped. Finding definitions helped as well. You guys are totally fantastic with the information on this website. Now with the statement above the light bulb has turned on. How hometheater exists without WinISD?

I used WinISD before to model my Infinity Sub for the car. All I saw were squiggly lines. Up until this week I saw nothing but squiggly lines. I would have never done the enclosure nor got the amp I got.:duh: Live and learn. I have way more willingness to give this project time then the last one.

Thanks everyone for you responses and willingness to give a nub your time. Now to choose an enclosure.
 

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Yes I have pulled the trigger on a purchase.
15 IXL
EP2500
1124
:yay::yay::yay:
I think this calls for :banana:

I'd vote for 6 cubic ft tuned to 17hz if you want to build that size. It wouldn't technically be an LLT by Steve's definition but I think it would give you a **** of a ride.

Google and download Sonosub.exe. If you've never built a sub before a sono is probably the easiest way to start. Just have the hardware store cut the tube to the right lenght and buy a router and a bunch of mdf. You'll need a circle jig of some sort to cut all of the circles for the subwoofer. Basically you will need a top cap, a bottom cap and 2 circles to go inside the sub under the caps to provide a good seal. You will need to cut circles in all of these for mounting the driver and port. Check out the build threads on site to give you and idea of the process. I built mine about a year ago and couldn't be happier!

Oh and time a hundred and 2 what MikeP said. I love build threads!
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
I have been watching movies on my HT lately. NO SUB :hissyfit:!!!!!!!!!

OK. It seems I am having a difficult time getting a build. Going box. I can build MDF. Never seen a sonotube so I dont know how I would get it to my friends house. He lives in Tampa. I was going to use unibox. But I'm afraid I would miss something. Anyone have a the unibox build?

I was going to just build it. But to figure out the messurements of the box seem easy until I remembered that the ports are not included. I was about to use Unibox. But this driver is not in the DB. I will try to manually enter them. But if someone can shoot me the unibox specs via Unibox so I can double check mine I would appreciate.

It seems that I will also have a bend in the ports. Not a big deal. Just want to make sure I am not missing anything. Not a lot of room at 33 inchses

Cubic feet = L x H x W - port (I have no idea about this one)

PS. Wouldnt this be the build thread? Once I start building the sub that is.
 
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