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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Lately I have gotten enamored of the Tapped Horn design. Only one person/company does it, Tom Danley and he is puportedly patenting the design. His specs sound too good to be true. After I finsh the center channel speaker I'm working on, I may have to go to Home Depot and pick up some inexpensive 3/4" plywood and try and unscientifically build one. I have a couple of 10" car sub drivers from a previous project to use.

Anyone know anything about the internals of these subs?

There is a some info about them on the web, and Tom is a member of a few forums, but he seems to keep his cards close to his vest. Here are a few links;

http://www.danleysoundlabs.com/DANLEY_dts20.htm
http://diy.cowanaudio.com

Paul
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
Actually, I should have said Tom does not provide any practical/step by step instructions on how to build his sub. I completely understand this, as he is in business to make a living. Tom seems to define the principles, etc. that he uses to design the horn, but unfortunately, I am not at the level that I can understand it enough to duplicate it.

Paul
 

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Actually, I should have said Tom does not provide any practical/step by step instructions on how to build his sub. I completely understand this, as he is in business to make a living. Tom seems to define the principles, etc. that he uses to design the horn, but unfortunately, I am not at the level that I can understand it enough to duplicate it.

Paul
Nor should you, perhaps? It seems to be the norm that amateurs may make anything they like despite costly patents and registered designs.

Why should anybody else gain from all the hard work, expense and brainpower that went into the design and development of a unique subwoofer? Just because you don't intend to sell copies it still deprives the designer of a sale. Or may produce bad publicity for his design if you screw up your cheap copy.

Since so many different ways have been tried before you have to be very bright (or very lucky) to see a possible breakthrough in subwoofer design worthy of a patent. Only then can you start to develop the idea into a practical project. All the theorising in the world won't produce a perfect working model. Not without many trials and the expense of prototype development. :nerd:
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I have done some research, and I can find no patent, nor patent application for the "Tapped Horn." I did find Tom's application for the "Synergy Horn" as well as his application for a device that from the patent application abstract seems to be an enhancement to the "Klipschorn" design.

If everyone were to take the approach that it appears that you advocate in your post, where would technology be today? I am sure many folks took a look at the "Wright Flyer" and said, "I can build that!" And build they did, quite a few crashed and burned. But those that didn't, learned and we now have intercontinental flight, supesonic jets, etc...

If I were malevolent or greedy I would buy one or more of his speakers and take it apart and carefully measure everything and start building them. I am not, I keep myself entertained and drive my wife crazy by building speakers. I do it as a hobby, I have built a Decware Wicked One, a ported subwoofer of my own design, a Rythmik Audio DS15, and a few others.

Before reading your post I had actually thought about what the best approach would be if I were lucky, and built something half decent. Should I post my design? Would that be fair to Tom? What if I fail, should I post my experience to show other folks what not to do?

Paul
 

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Paul

Perhaps my post came over a little on the heavy side. :)

I was batting for the "little" man rather than patent holders in general (like multinationals).

Regards
Chris
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Chris:

I didn't take your comments too badly, as I also care about the little guy being one myself. Well I could stand to lose a few pounds, but metaphorically, I'm a little guy.

Paul
 

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Paul

This reminds me (a little) of the 7 feet tall Tricolumn I built back in the late 60s. I was always a bass extremist! :nerd:

I stacked and taped 18" industrial cans on top of each other after cutting out the bottoms with a wood chisel and hammer. More noise! :dumbcrazy:

1/4 wave folded horns were popular back then to maximise output from very limited Xmax drivers using wimpy valve amps.

Having tried the Paraline I felt I needed more bass. My 10" Whitely in this huge stack of cans was driven by a Mullard 510 in a desperate attempt to squeeze some bass out of my organ LPs. There wasn't much bass to be found in mono organ LPs anyway. Though I could hear busses passing the cathedral during the recording. I actually had the neighbours knocking on the wall when I tried it on some borrowed rock music albums at spirited levels. :D

This contrabass Tricolumn was running full range. Though I had a horn tweeter sitting on top with a small capacitor to protect it. My system was sitting in a large kitchen with no damping at all. (So I could listen in the evenings while my wife watched TV) My Tricolumn sounded like vintage wine on my favourite violin concertos. Dark and gorgeously coloured. :D

Heavily off-topic I think! :R
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 · (Edited)
I am thinking that I might try the tapped horn sub design with a little 5" Hi Vi that I have laying about. The purpose will be to get experience mucking about with the concept in a small manageable sized box.

Some of the things that I need to figure out without killing an entire forest are;

1) What rate of expansion works best for the conical horn.

2) Where to tie in the the front wave, and the back wave.

3) What size should the hole for the driver and the port into the horn be.

Since I'm not so good with the theoretical, I thought I'd play with the empirical. Once I'm done, I'm hoping I can scale it up to something that will do better than 50hz.

I'm hoping someone can answer some of my questions before I start cutting.

Paul
 

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Paul

If you make at least one side of your horn parallel-sided with full length slotted battens you can easily slide pieces of thin ply in and out (and up and down) to quickly change the venting position and size.

The whole enclosure only needs to be made of thin plywood with reinforcing edge battens for a prototype. We need our forests! ;)

EDIT: You could even put the driver on a sliding board to run in the slots for longitudinal, positional adjustments.

Use rubber bands to hold the thing together for tests.
 

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Wow, this is cool. About 8 months back, we completed a project for a client that included this basic design (tapped horn) integrated into a tower speaker. Low end was OK, but the top end sucked big-time due to the specified driver selection (el-cheapo junk that someone had as surplus). It was the first time I had worked with this format and I was pretty pleased with it. Easy to build, low cost and it works as intended. I see a lot of potential for this if the system engineer is given a spec that makes sense and the authority to remind the PLM of the limits posed by Mother Nature and the almighty dollar. In the end, the client bailed out on the project and I am considering doing my own version as a show piece. Hrmmmm....

Patenting this- I do not know about that. I think that there is too much prior art on it to get a solid patent. I recall seeing something from RCA or maybe JBL from way back about this when we did the diligence search
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Even though they say "Patent Pending", I have found no evidence of a patent applied for, and I have found ample evidence of similar designs (not identical) that have been patented.

Paul
 
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I have done some research, and I can find no patent, nor patent application for the "Tapped Horn." I did find Tom's application for the "Synergy Horn" as well as his application for a device that from the patent application abstract seems to be an enhancement to the "Klipschorn" design.

If everyone were to take the approach that it appears that you advocate in your post, where would technology be today? I am sure many folks took a look at the "Wright Flyer" and said, "I can build that!" And build they did, quite a few crashed and burned. But those that didn't, learned and we now have intercontinental flight, supesonic jets, etc...

If I were malevolent or greedy I would buy one or more of his speakers and take it apart and carefully measure everything and start building them. I am not, I keep myself entertained and drive my wife crazy by building speakers. I do it as a hobby, I have built a Decware Wicked One, a ported subwoofer of my own design, a Rythmik Audio DS15, and a few others.

Before reading your post I had actually thought about what the best approach would be if I were lucky, and built something half decent. Should I post my design? Would that be fair to Tom? What if I fail, should I post my experience to show other folks what not to do?

Paul
Hi Paul
I am very interested in your findings regarding both the Synergy horn details and the mods for the Klipsch that you mentioned. Could you pass on the URL's, if any ?
 

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Hmmm, at first I was going to suggest that they looked mostly like a big slotted enclosure, but after digging a little deeper it does seem like there are a lot of variables. Angle, rate of expansion, slot size, multiple folds? This could be a lot of testing, but it could definitely be fun! I'd be interested to see how it turns out and if any general conclusions/equations can be made.
 

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Patent pending means putting your product out there before you have secured the patent and taking your chances, as patents take a long time many manufacturers take that route, If they secure the patent, they can come back and get royalties on any company who is making there designs, Master Craft ski boats did this when they came up with the "Flight Control Tower" a wakeboard tower made to get the ski rope up at a higher point, so many companys copied that design and when they securd their patent they cashed in on a lot of lose change!
 

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Try the German Volvo Horn Dude's site at http://www.volvotreter.de/dl-section.htm . There are several tapped horn designs, including a very interesting 30Hz TH with a 6.5" Tang Band driver. There is a bunch of other horn stuff including Klipschorn plans and a Tractrix horn calculator based on an excel spreadsheet. This guy seems to be a very talented enclosure designer/builder. Most of the site is in English and has PDF and DWG files of most of his projects.
 
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