Thoughts on bi-wiring????

7611 Views 54 Replies 18 Participants Last post by robbo266317, May 31, 2011

joonbug99

Discussion Starter · May 17, 2011

I just received my KEF C series speakers. I have 2 C7's and 4 C3's. In any event. They have two sets of terminals and the Manual talks about bi-wiring or bi-amping.

I have never heard of either of these two things. I am not interested in bi-amping but if bi-wiring will offer better results I just might do it.

Thoughts????
Thanks

1 - 20 of 55 Posts

eugovector

· #2 · May 17, 2011

The perceptive differences between using a sufficiently thick wire with a sufficiently powerful amp, vs. bi-wiring and bi-amping, is perceptively subtle, if not non-existent. A google search will reveal many opinions that support this, and a bit of measured scientific experimentation as well.

In other words, your time and money will be better spent elsewhere [/opinion].

nova

· #3 · May 18, 2011

I agree with Marshall. Unless you have an unusually long distance between your amp and speakers or insufficiently sized cables/speaker wire I really doubt you would see/hear any benefits to bi-wiring.

tonyvdb

· #4 · May 18, 2011

I also agree with what has been said above. I have personally tried bi amping my speakers just to prove a point and it made absolutely no difference in the sound.

joonbug99

Discussion Starter · #5 · May 18, 2011

Thanks for the info. I will follow the advice. No bi- wiring here.

Thanks again.

GranteedEV

· #6 · May 21, 2011

There's only one use for Bi-Wiring, and that's to get confused audiophiles to sit down and listen to your system with their preconceived biases not affecting what they think they hear.

tcarcio

· #7 · May 21, 2011

I have tried bi-wireing also and could not tell a difference. I would have to agree with the rest of the opionions here that it is a waste of time.

tesseract

· #8 · May 23, 2011

Bi wiring is a little tweak that all by it's self, may not make an immediate "audible" difference. I am a proponent of bi wiring in some cases, and believe that the aggregate effect of all the little differences tweaks like this can make actually sum to make an audible difference in the end. Everything makes a difference and all those little 1%'s add up. Sometimes they subtract, you have to be careful, not every tweak is a positive. :doh:

No need to buy into mega buck solutions. There are snake oil vendors that will happily charge hundreds or thousands of dollars for a few dollars worth of product. For instance, my subwoofers make my universal player skip. I tried moving my gear out of the offending room mode as much as I could, to no avail. I bought Vibropods for $24, problem solved. I could have spent much more on other isolation devices for the same net effect.

Spend money where it matters most first (speakers, room, electronics), then worry about the little things. Or don't. :T

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eugovector

· #9 · May 23, 2011

Could you provide a link for the "vibropods" you bought? I'm only getting results for Adult Toys, and not the Home Theater kind.

tesseract

· #10 · May 23, 2011

Lol. I bought mine from Music Direct when I made a few music purchases.

Get the ones that will support the weight of the equipment used, for best effect.

smurphy522

· #11 · May 23, 2011

I am not a proponent of Bi-wiring; tried it and could not tell the difference in an A/B comparison. The only way it is effective if you use these cables to do the B-wiring. Thus you will need 2 pair of those babies. Thought is that after you lay out that much dollar you will surely hear some improvement - which may be nothing less than self supported to help explain your purchase.

Leon_Tyler

· #12 · May 24, 2011

Bi-wiring, as many of you have stated, is probably not worth doing. All you're doing is doubling the gauge of the wire to the speakers.

Bi-amping, on the other hand, can worthwhile, or at least cause some perceptible changes in the sound because you're using two different amplifier output sections.

If you've got some spare amps lying around, it's worth a try. My favorite is to use tubes for the mid/tweeter section and solid state for the woofers...

caper26

· #13 · May 25, 2011

If you use the proper gauge in the first place, then bi-wiring theoretically improves nothing. If you have any course in basic circuits, all bi-wiring does is change the location of the "short circuit" from behind the speaker to behind the amp... again, only effective if the gauge of one of those wire pairs isn't sufficient enough on its own.
Now, bi-amping is completely different, in where you are using 2 of the amplifiers in your receiver to power 2 separate frequency ranges in the speaker, theoretically makes some sense, however, arguably, treble doesn't really require that much power in the first place. I bi-amped by towers, since I had the extra cable anyway.

hgoed

· #14 · May 27, 2011

Back in the day, I looked into bi-wiring, because if you do the math and focus only on the wire from the plug of the amp to the speaker, you can show a numerical difference in the end signal, mostly due to gauge, but also because of what you can do with the wires (more braiding, more solid wire that still bends, whatever...). Unfortunately, I spent more time crunching numbers than looking at the system as a whole. If you're going for best, you'd want to bi/multi-amp.

If you want to bi-wire, and see any difference, you have to have some pretty inert wires (I have no interest in going into the wire debate, I've dedicated my enthusiasm elsewhere) or you're just doubling your risk of picking something up from a power line etc...

Also, you have to be willing to accept the cosmetic effects of twice as many wires, which would beg the question of if you could tolerate expensive wires all over the place, why can't you tolerate an active crossover?

Remember, once you open the amp and see where the wires lead, there will be a common, very narrow copper trace to whatever circuit is driving the speakers.

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caper26

· #15 · May 27, 2011

hgoed said:
Remember, once you open the amp and see where the wires lead, there will be a common, very narrow copper trace to whatever circuit is driving the speakers.

Likewise inside the speaker/coil, etc... :clap:

tesseract

· #16 · May 28, 2011

smurphy522 said:
I am not a proponent of Bi-wiring; tried it and could not tell the difference in an A/B comparison. The only way it is effective if you use these cables to do the B-wiring. Thus you will need 2 pair of those babies. Thought is that after you lay out that much dollar you will surely hear some improvement - which may be nothing less than self supported to help explain your purchase.

Try these and get back to me. :sn:

robbo266317

· #17 · May 28, 2011

tesseract said:
Try these and get back to me. :sn:

Hmmm.... Too many Buzz words and no scientific merit in their webpage so you will fogive me if I dont fork out mega bucks for little or no gain. :devil:

Theresa

· #18 · May 28, 2011

If you look at it electrically there is no advantage and its just a waste of cables. Active speakers are a different matter.

caper26

· #19 · May 28, 2011

//end

tesseract

· #20 · May 28, 2011

robbo266317 said:
Hmmm.... Too many Buzz words and no scientific merit in their webpage so you will fogive me if I dont fork out mega bucks for little or no gain. :devil:

I'll take any gain I can get, however small. :T

The elimination of back EMF from the woofer to the tweeter has merit, and there is no reason it has to cost mega bucks. Any cable bi wired should do, and makes the cost of experimenting a moot point.

I just threw MIT out there to show smurphy522 another extreme. I actually have even more expensive MIT's than the ones I linked to (although I paid far less than the listed prices), so you can spend more if you like. Mine prevent all back EMF from returning to the amplifier, not just the tweeter/highs.

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