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Discussion Starter #1
...so how does a turntable compare to a sound from a CD... As i have never heard a record before....

ya, that's right I have never heard vinyl. what are the differences ? it seems like some people are raving about vinyl and I see a lot of new albums released on vinyl... why ? is it nostalgic or does it sound better in some regard? i know sound is subjective ... im just looking for a basic high level thoughts.

...maybe id like to get a turntable and find out....
 

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Vinyl was fun while I was growing up. And then CDs came along, superior in both sound and convenience. I haven't had an interest in vinyl ever since.

And I don't miss having to clean my records, flip them over every 20 minutes or so, adjust the tonearm, align / replace the cartridge, clean / replace the needle, et cetera. ;)

IMO, and YM(and that of many vinyl-philes)MV. :)

-- Edit --
The only way you'll really know is to get yourself a turntable and try it out.
 

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Vinyl generally sounds warmer but can sound dramatically different from one turntable to another depending on the quality of the vinyl and the turntable its self. A big problem with vinyl is dust that gets into the grooves and causes distortion or that snap crackle and pop during playback. Also if the tracking and weight of the tone arm and needle is not set right it can cause issues.
Some purest's will say its the better format however CD is capable of much better dynamic range (not all recordings are the same) the stereo imaging will usually be far better and dust is not as much a problem as there is no physical contact of the media.
Thats the short of it, Im sure someone will give other thoughts on this.
 

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Simply put. Music is an analogue system operating in an analogue environment (air). Turntables are analogue hence the "distance" between a records creation and its performance is shorter. If you look into the favourite vinyl albums out there you'll see that many of them are older recordings often produced with the minimalist of studio effects. Many of the vinyl produced today is either because the musical group has an acoustic feel or for the convenience of those DJ's that still like to get hands on with there mixing and scratching. I have a turntable that I listen to on occasion. Is it better? Its just different. Tube amps are the same way. They are essentially analogue systems. The distortion of a tube amp is along even harmonics. That is why guitarists like tube amps. Even when you crank them to eleven and they are distorting like crazy - they rock out and sound cool. It is important to not lump CD's into one category. Digital recordings can rival or even surpass the sound of vinyl with the proper recording techniques and playback methods. The issue is that most CDs and even blue-rays don't contain enough digital information for pure reproduction and there are even fewer commercial devices out there that can play such intense a digital format. Unless your ready to drop 15 000$ on a cd player or turntable for the opportunity to play a limited selection of music. You, like most of us, are in the middle somewhere. Where the cost benefit analyses meets our ears.
 

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It all depends on the equipment, the record itself & the mastering. With average equipment, you could hear the "friction" between the needle & the record. Referred to as "hiss." We went to great lengths to get rid of the hiss. Better cartriges, constant cleaning, better arms, etc. And then the record itself will get old and degrade, or worse get scratched (never manually lower the tone arm!).

But when done well, vinyl sounds very good. The best I have heard was a Grover Washington Live concert that was a master recording...dead quiet, superb mastering, it just sounded awesome.

With our new technology, is all the trouble worth it? Not for me, but hey, it's a hobby that many enjoy.
 

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Vinyl was fun while I was growing up. And then CDs came along, superior in both sound and convenience. I haven't had an interest in vinyl ever since.
And I don't miss having to clean my records, flip them over every 20 minutes or so, adjust the tonearm, align / replace the cartridge, clean / replace the needle, et cetera. ;)
IMO, and YM(and that of many vinyl-philes)MV. :)
-- Edit --
The only way you'll really know is to get yourself a turntable and try it out.
:TT

For the people that want to enjoy their music on a turntable, go for it.
Back in the day I (along with my friends) spent 100's (or more) of hours listening to 'real' albums and it was absolutely great. I am very glad I had that experience and there are many great memories I cherish.
Now, I am in the same place as eljay.

Long before CDs came out the fun factor of albums and the gear was gone and it had become a hassle, FM radio had replaced my turntable.

While the sound quality issue continues to be debated it is a subjective debate, while it may be possible to achieve higher quality sound from a turntable and album (on a one off basis) the money you have to spend on a turntable just to have that potential is incredible.
Then you have to have media that is pristine along with superior mastering and pressing.
If you take a CD of the same material with equal mastering and throw it into a $30 CD player (connected to the same system the turntable is connected to) my money is on the CD player to sound better.

As was said above... The only way you'll really know is to get yourself a turntable and try it out....
It's all good fun and entertainment and each individual gets to decide for themselves what they like best. :wave:
 

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Just dont think those USB turntables available today are going to get you that wonderful warm sound that even a $200 turntable got you back in the day.
 

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I agree with most of what has been said.

  • I favor CDs for convenience and dynamic range.
  • Vinyl can be a fun alternative. The noise and distortion inherent to the medium gives a different sound, sometimes covering up flaws in the performance or recording, sometimes just sounding good that way.
  • Vinyl is a "hands on" medium, handling, cleaning, storage... you get more physically involved with the medium, like a hardcover book vs. a digital book. Again, to many it is fun.
 

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Before I moved over to CD's I never had to worry about blowing a tweeter. I much prefer vinyl but have to admit to the convenience of CD's.

My turntable is a Rega Planar 3 (original) and I forget which arm it came with. I have over 300 records including a good selection of original master recordings and it all sounds good. Even my 17yo son says it sounds better then anything he's heard.

My money would be on vinyl.
Cheers,
 

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I've played a LOT of vinyl back in the day. Yes, it has inherent flaws and distortion. But in can be a fun medium. I have to agree with a lot of the above statements though - they are costly, harder to maintain/clean, and a good turntable is pretty expensive.

I have a Rega turntable also with a decent cartrige. We do play it once in a while just for fun - but become very reminded of the routine of keeping everything pristine and clean - and we use an anti-static gun from Zerostat to decrease surfce static.

The bottom line it, you have to listen to it for yourself to see if you want to invest that much time, money, energy, and effort into the medium. I really only have it because, well, I already have a lot of albums. Just like I still have a reel-to-reel (which is great for recording because you can record at distorted levels which you can't do with digital equipment).

But, if it were me starting from scratch, I wouldn't go that route. I also have a LOT of CD's (over 1000). If you want a true current 'holy grail' medium, I'd put my bet on SACD and DVDA. Once you hear it, they are incredible (the smoothness of pure analog with the dynamic range and low noise floor of digital) - the best of both worlds. I think it's too bad that lately (last decade) more of the population will pay more for conveinence than quality (portable MP3, etc). In the past, folks paid more for better quality and the search was to perfect it. Don't get me wrong, many are still doing this. I just hing the majority of the population does not really care as much for quality playback as much as convience these days. Do I use the newer compressed mediums and streaming - of course. But I still like to sit back and listing to the best there is to offer and for me, that is SACE and DVDA (of course - within affordability means). All IMO...
 

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^^^ Forgot to mention, you can purchase an OPPO universal player for $500. That is not much of an investment in something that can play just about any format, including DVDA and SACD.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
I just hing the majority of the population does not really care as much for quality playback as much as convience these days. Do I use the newer compressed mediums and streaming - of course. But I still like to sit back and listing to the best there is to offer and for me, that is SACE and DVDA (of course - within affordability means). All IMO...
That statement really hits home for me... It seems a lot of people really dont care about the quality. I see it in all the 'streaming' music available. Why are Hollywood and musicians going to produce brilliant recording and incredible movies if it will just end up delivered over netflix streaming in some kind of quasi 5.1 and 64k ? !!



Is anyone excited about PONO?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/shortcuts/2012/oct/02/neil-youngs-pono-change-music
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Very interesting suff here about vinyl ....thanks for all the information. This is what I was looking for. I am going to look into SACD as well now.
 

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I have many recordings in both formats. Sometimes vinyl wins, sometimes CD wins. It really boils down to the recording engineer behind the scenes. One thing for sure..despite its flaws, vinyl will never fall victim to the loudness war that is going on with CDs and streaming music. As a result of the loudness war, vinyl now has better dynamic range than a lot of the commercial music on the digital formats.
 

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I have many recordings in both formats. Sometimes vinyl wins, sometimes CD wins. It really boils down to the recording engineer behind the scenes. One thing for sure..despite its flaws, vinyl will never fall victim to the loudness war that is going on with CDs and streaming music. As a result of the loudness war, vinyl now has better dynamic range than a lot of the commercial music on the digital formats.
First I must say that I am pleasantly surprise at how civilize this tread is, when I saw the title, I tought `here we go again, it will be hugly`.

Now back to the subject, the first time I heard a CD, it thought it was `dry`, it sounded lifeless.
Maybe the recording was not very good or maybe I was missing the noise from the background.

I think the best description has been given already `it sound different`
 

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As a result of the loudness war, vinyl now has better dynamic range than a lot of the commercial music on the digital formats.
How do you figure that? Vinyl is still pressed from the same master as the CD now a days if a vinyl press is even made. The Loudness wars has nothing to do with the format. Its how much compression is used during recording to keep the levels as close to the max db as possible without any rise and fall of the true dynamics.
 

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Has for SACD, here is a quote from Wikipedia

In September 2007 the Audio Engineering Society published the results of a year-long trial in which a range of subjects including professional recording engineers were asked to discern the difference between SACD and compact disc audio (44.1 kHz/16 bit) under double blind test conditions. Out of 554 trials, there were 276 correct answers, a 49.8% success rate corresponding almost exactly to the 50% that would have been expected by chance guessing alone
 

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I used to have a Mitchell Gyrodec turntable with a Sumiko (SME v) tonearm and a Sumiko Bluepoint Special cartridge... I used to cue up the table and my Denon 1600 and let my guests tell me which is better.

I never had a guest tell me the CD player was better. The guests would pick the best sound and it was always the turntable... As a matter of fact they insisted it was the CD that was what they were listening to as the best source, until I lifted the arm on the turntable and the sound went away! All my records were cleaned with a record vac and a lot of them were purchased used in record stores. Once the records were cleaned I very seldom heard any static at all. I believe that part of it was due to the Sumiko cutting into the groove and making a nice new clean groove.

On previous setups the CD def sounded better.

I wish I still had the setup but when I moved to my new house I had no dedicated listening room and sold it. I have since moved on to multiroom audio/video. I have to admit that when I had the turntable I listened to much more music than I do now.
 
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