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Just mark where you are now so you can go back to it. If the seating is limited and forcing an issue that you can't resolve by moving, the speaker position may be the best you can do.
 

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Well, after all of that, it appears to me that you were correct and you're in about the best place you can be. Not seeing any of those that are better -left and front don't have the dip at 120Hz (and/or it's moved to be either higher or lower in frequency as the graphs show).

At this point, the 120hz really isn't all that bad and appears to be from a multi-dimensional mode. I would concentrate on getting the decay times more under control.

Bryan
 

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Discussion Starter #125
Well, after all of that, it appears to me that you were correct and you're in about the best place you can be. Not seeing any of those that are better -left and front don't have the dip at 120Hz (and/or it's moved to be either higher or lower in frequency as the graphs show).

At this point, the 120hz really isn't all that bad and appears to be from a multi-dimensional mode. I would concentrate on getting the decay times more under control.

Bryan
So apart from the decay time I take it this is a pretty good response that I have achieved, in other words no problems that I would really be able to notice?

Admitedly the sub isn't in the place my wife appreciates it (halfway alon the side wall), she preffered it in the front position, the response below I achieved with the sub in that position, but am I right in thinking that there will probably be an audible difference between these 2?
 

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HTS Senior Moderator
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The 120 likely won't be too noticeable. The 190ish is pretty deep though very narrow.

The front orientation has a couple of pretty wide and deep dips that would make it sound much thinner and much less slam to it in my opinion.

Getting the decay times in line will help tighten things up and provide more apparent extension along with better dialog clarity.

Bryan
 

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Discussion Starter #127
The 120 likely won't be too noticeable. The 190ish is pretty deep though very narrow.

The front orientation has a couple of pretty wide and deep dips that would make it sound much thinner and much less slam to it in my opinion.

Getting the decay times in line will help tighten things up and provide more apparent extension along with better dialog clarity.

Bryan
Sorry when you say the wide dips you are talking about the response from the sub in my wifes favourite position (#125) not the one above that (#123)?
 

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Correct - the front position that's preferred by the wife in #125
 

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Discussion Starter #129
Correct - the front position that's preferred by the wife in #125
Oh well, she will have to stay unhappy :devil:


Anyway she has 20 rabbits and 5 geese in our garden so it's give and take :D

So i can rest easy knowing my main response is good then :T

So I take it isn't going to have much audible benefit to get an eq device then?

In regards to the reverb time I take it it is now time to start room treatment?
 

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You can try to EQ up the 120Hz as long as it's not modal in nature. The other one, I wouldn't worry about too much. Like I said, it's pretty narrow for as high in frequency as it is.

Treatment is definitely the way to address decay times, reflections, etc.

Bryan
 

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Discussion Starter #131
You can try to EQ up the 120Hz as long as it's not modal in nature. The other one, I wouldn't worry about too much. Like I said, it's pretty narrow for as high in frequency as it is.

Treatment is definitely the way to address decay times, reflections, etc.

Bryan
I figured the bare wall behind me should be my first port of call, with some diffuser panels spread out across it, I can't afford to do the lot yet so I'm prioritising, would this be the best place to begin?

Also am I best to leave the front mains where they are, about 2 inches from front wall?
 

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If that close to the wall is the best response, then I'd leave them there. Not optimal but there are always tradeoffs. Eventually, you'll want to address those close walls with something absorptive to catch the very early reflections.

Broadband bass control is usually the best place to start. Having the speakers that close to a corner limits that location though. Next best spots would be front wall/floor junction if there is space, over your head if the ceiling is 8' or less, and center of the rear wall.

Diffusion is definitely secondary as it won't do anything for decay time control and certainly won't get down into the bass range which is what we're concerned about.

Bryan
 

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Discussion Starter #133
If that close to the wall is the best response, then I'd leave them there. Not optimal but there are always tradeoffs. Eventually, you'll want to address those close walls with something absorptive to catch the very early reflections.

Broadband bass control is usually the best place to start. Having the speakers that close to a corner limits that location though. Next best spots would be front wall/floor junction if there is space, over your head if the ceiling is 8' or less, and center of the rear wall.
Thanks Bryan :T

So a bass trap panel behind each speaker on the front wall? How high?

Is there a possibility that they might improve the dips? Even if they force the speakers to be moved forward a bit?

Over my head, that's a new one on me. My ceiling is 8.5 feet high but above me I have the pj and the underneath of the hallway stairs protruding into the room?

So if my rear wall is 13ft wide by 8.5ft high how big and what type of absorber do you mean to go in the centre of the wall?
 

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There is a chance that bass absorbers behind the speakers will help. My guess is not in your case but you can certainly try whatever you get for the back wall there as an experiment.

Ideally, front corners would go floor to ceiling.

Rear wall - 4-6" thickness - 3 2'x4' panels would be good.

Ceiling - at 8.5', likely it's not going to be a big problem with height modes so you can skip those.

Bryan
 

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Discussion Starter #135
There is a chance that bass absorbers behind the speakers will help. My guess is not in your case but you can certainly try whatever you get for the back wall there as an experiment.

Ideally, front corners would go floor to ceiling.

Rear wall - 4-6" thickness - 3 2'x4' panels would be good.

Ceiling - at 8.5', likely it's not going to be a big problem with height modes so you can skip those.

Bryan
I was always under the impression that rear wall should be diffuse not absorb?

How far apart should these absorbers be?
 

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There is a lot of misinformation out there. There is no one right answer that works for every room. Diffusion can work IF you don't need to address bass issues from that location, you can get enough other bass control in other places, and you can sit far enough away to make diffusion work properly. Diffusion that will work down to 300ish Hz requires for the most part that you sit a minimum of 5-6' away from it.
 

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Discussion Starter #137
There is a lot of misinformation out there. There is no one right answer that works for every room. Diffusion can work IF you don't need to address bass issues from that location, you can get enough other bass control in other places, and you can sit far enough away to make diffusion work properly. Diffusion that will work down to 300ish Hz requires for the most part that you sit a minimum of 5-6' away from it.
I sit 3 feet from the rear wall and I have bipoles to my left and right that I would have thought needed to use the reflections off the back wall, I would have thought the absorbers would stop the full effect?

If that isn't the case and I should try absorbers how far apart would I need to place them?

Also for the front corners, so I don't have to move these speakers too much, would 2 bass traps in each corner work, 1 on front wall and 1 on side wall, basically forming an L shape around each speaker, if that would work would they still need to go floor to ceiling?

Marty
 

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Having the bass absorbers flat on the walls will limit how low they will reach. It will also require double the expense to cover floor to ceiling. It's doable, just not optimal.

On the rear, the dipoles are higher up. The absorbers would go from say 2' to 6' off the floor so the upper area where a lot of the reflections are is still open and could use diffusion.

Bryan
 

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Discussion Starter #139
Having the bass absorbers flat on the walls will limit how low they will reach. It will also require double the expense to cover floor to ceiling. It's doable, just not optimal.

On the rear, the dipoles are higher up. The absorbers would go from say 2' to 6' off the floor so the upper area where a lot of the reflections are is still open and could use diffusion.

Bryan
Ok I will stick to the corner fitting bass traps, there are quite a lot of varieties with different frequency range absorbtion, is there anything in particular I should aim for?


The bipoles are 5 feet from the floor and if I put absorbers 2 feet from the floor it would mean that a part of the absorber will go down behind the couch?

Thanks
Marty
 

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Part of the rear wall absorbers will go behind the couch. That's fine. Bass is still going through the couch - trust me.

For the corners, look for something that reaches as low as possible and preferably takes up as little space as possible to minimize interference with speaker/sub positioning. As an example, if you look at our 244 panel vs our Tri Trap - the Tri Trap extends out 17" from the corners. The 244's REAR will hit the wall at 17" and then stick out another 5" from there at 45 degrees. Performance still goes to the Tri Trap though.
 
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