Hornresp for Dum... hmm... Everyone ;)
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looks interesting, I want to build a sub for music (not HT) are u able to provide more information on your build?
thanks,
gychang
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580 Posts
You do realize that the length and the sizing in the box you show are grouped as one lumped parameter by the drivers. They see the entire volume, and port as an acoustical impedance. The dividing of the box into sections is for the sake of computation of flared horn segments. A straight horn could usually be modeled in three sections or less. Driver positioning as discussed before only has an influence on how the port behaves.
Mark
Let's say that we simulate the two (or whatever) speakers as one, and put this "big speaker" in the S3 position.
Then, yes, I realized that the sections and their distances are just to tell to the software how this "horn" is made, and let it calculate graphs based on flares dimensions.
Many thanks, your help was really appreciated!
Then, yes, I realized that the sections and their distances are just to tell to the software how this "horn" is made, and let it calculate graphs based on flares dimensions.
Many thanks, your help was really appreciated!
Re: Tapped Horns
Design parameters are out of the scope of this thread, but simply remember the length of the horn determines how low it will go, and the distance from the Rear Tap to the Throat is what fills in the dips, not the Rear Tap to Mouth distance.
Good point, but i don't think you have defined "rear tap" or "throat" . I believe you are referring to "L12"
Maybe you could put "(L12)" to reference the drawing, and define the parameter in Hornresp that "fills in the dips"
(my first time through reading this, and I was do'n good until the "rear tap - throat' reference.) Thanks
Design parameters are out of the scope of this thread, but simply remember the length of the horn determines how low it will go, and the distance from the Rear Tap to the Throat is what fills in the dips, not the Rear Tap to Mouth distance.
Good point, but i don't think you have defined "rear tap" or "throat" . I believe you are referring to "L12"
Maybe you could put "(L12)" to reference the drawing, and define the parameter in Hornresp that "fills in the dips"
(my first time through reading this, and I was do'n good until the "rear tap - throat' reference.) Thanks
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116 Posts
I was wondering if I could get some help with hornsrep and the enclosure I am trying to model. I have all of the driver's parameters entered and now I'm trying to figure out what kind of alignment to use in the program.
I'm trying to build a tapered variation T line since I dont have the truck space for a traditional T line. What I have designed is kind of like a reverse horn. If I were to build the traditional T-line, the line would be 106" long for my goals. Since I don't have the space for that, I went with a tapered design which I have calculated my design to be 66" long. Now, does the length of mine have to be the same (106") as the traditional to reach my goal of it being tuned to 32 hz? How would I model this in Hornsrep to see what I have?
My enclosure is 12.75H x 31.5W x 17.5D and is for a IA Death Penalty 12"
The mouth is 4 7/16" wide x 11.25" tall (322.56 cm sq) where the throat area is 9" wide x 11.25" tall (653.71 cm sq)
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Also, I plan on putting 45's in the corners I just havent got to that point yet in my design. The 2 corners at the left of the enclosure will have 45's of equal length, while the corner in the upper right leading to the mouth of the enclosure should have a smaller 45. The throat is
I'm trying to build a tapered variation T line since I dont have the truck space for a traditional T line. What I have designed is kind of like a reverse horn. If I were to build the traditional T-line, the line would be 106" long for my goals. Since I don't have the space for that, I went with a tapered design which I have calculated my design to be 66" long. Now, does the length of mine have to be the same (106") as the traditional to reach my goal of it being tuned to 32 hz? How would I model this in Hornsrep to see what I have?
My enclosure is 12.75H x 31.5W x 17.5D and is for a IA Death Penalty 12"
The mouth is 4 7/16" wide x 11.25" tall (322.56 cm sq) where the throat area is 9" wide x 11.25" tall (653.71 cm sq)
Also, I plan on putting 45's in the corners I just havent got to that point yet in my design. The 2 corners at the left of the enclosure will have 45's of equal length, while the corner in the upper right leading to the mouth of the enclosure should have a smaller 45. The throat is
I guess you can easily simulate that box using the same method used to simulate a ported box, like written in post #6... Just put throat area a s S1 and mouth area as S2, and L12 as distance between the two.
I tried to simulate boxes like that for car audio use, and worked fine!
I tried to simulate boxes like that for car audio use, and worked fine!
I was wondering if any of you w/ skype might be willing to help me understand how to use hornresp, trying to wrap my head around it is literally giving me headaches, i somewhat understand how to use it (trying to design a tapped horn) but the calculated results are far from what i'd want (really peaky).
Can anyone advise me on the following:
I am trying to simulate a horn tweeter using Hornresp. The driver I am using is very unconventional - It is a small modulated corona plasma flame coming from a tungsten rod tip. You could say that the diafragm is completely without mass. I intend to insert this tip into the throat of a ceramic horn. The lower cut off frequency without horn is ca. 5000 Hz. I want to lower this frequency to ca. 2000 Hz.
Is Hornresp suitable for this task and if so I am looking for some guidance on what parameters to use or omit if Hornresp is useful in the first place, or is there a better or more suitable horn simulator out there for this task?
Anyone please?
I am trying to simulate a horn tweeter using Hornresp. The driver I am using is very unconventional - It is a small modulated corona plasma flame coming from a tungsten rod tip. You could say that the diafragm is completely without mass. I intend to insert this tip into the throat of a ceramic horn. The lower cut off frequency without horn is ca. 5000 Hz. I want to lower this frequency to ca. 2000 Hz.
Is Hornresp suitable for this task and if so I am looking for some guidance on what parameters to use or omit if Hornresp is useful in the first place, or is there a better or more suitable horn simulator out there for this task?
Anyone please?
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580 Posts
In the Eg field enter 0 volts.
That will allow you to model a perfect driver on your horn . Since your driver has no true physical parameters. I have been doing similar work with planars.
That will allow you to model a perfect driver on your horn . Since your driver has no true physical parameters. I have been doing similar work with planars.
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580 Posts
No problem.
Hi ... Does anyone know if this can be modeled in HornResp? The rear chamber is sealed and the throat is in front of woofer. More pictures are here ... http://www.decware.com/ImperialSO.htm
I'm short a few grand to buy the original speakers and will need to find suitable replacements as well as model the woofers I have. The Karlson type slot might make the whole thing impossible.
Thanks, Zene
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I'm short a few grand to buy the original speakers and will need to find suitable replacements as well as model the woofers I have. The Karlson type slot might make the whole thing impossible.
Thanks, Zene
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13 Posts
Thanks Mark.
I tried setting Eg=0 also, the SPL response curve looks flater than before at high fre. range.:clap:
But why? Eg=0 got such kind of change.
alaok
Re: Rear Loaded Horns
anybody can help me?
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please explain on the sketch
where is the
s1
s2
s3
s4
s5
and
L12
L23
L34
L45
and
VRC
LRC
VTC
ATC
?????????????????????
thank you....
may be i am stupid but rreally i dont understand...A Rear Loaded Horn is simply a Normal horn with no Rear Chamber. Really that is all it is. Instead of a Rear Chamber the driver is mounted externally, and you get the sum of the horn and drivers response.
To build one you do the exact same things as the Normal Horn builds (Simple or Advanced,) and just leave the Rear Chamber off. You must then use the Combined Response Graph to get the true FR.
![]()
![]()
Note: Here I am using the cheat to allow the use of a single segment horn in the Loudspeaker Wizard.
![]()
anybody can help me?
please explain on the sketch
where is the
s1
s2
s3
s4
s5
and
L12
L23
L34
L45
and
VRC
LRC
VTC
ATC
?????????????????????
thank you....
Joined
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580 Posts
Your answers will be found here:
http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/diy-subwoofers-general-discussion/36532-hornresp-dum-hmm-everyone.html#post324333
http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/diy-subwoofers-general-discussion/36532-hornresp-dum-hmm-everyone.html#post324333
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9 Posts
Hello Soho54, Your tutorial was and is very helpful, thank you.
I would like to build an offset driver horn with one or two B&C 15NW76 drivers.
You wrote : As the driver is not at the throat, soundwaves are sent up and down the horn at the same time. This leads to cancellation issues above a frequency set by the round trip distance from the driver to the throat, and back to the driver. The longer the distance the lower the cancellation occurs.
If I understand correctly, the shorter the distance between driver and throat, the higher the frequency where cancellations occur.
After modelling an OD horn 380 cm long, it's SPL has some ripples. Could I space a second offset driver at 1/4 wave distance from the first to compensate for major dips or would it make problems worse ?
I don't want to use a back chamber but let it radiate free to air.
Thanks a lot, Marc
I would like to build an offset driver horn with one or two B&C 15NW76 drivers.
You wrote : As the driver is not at the throat, soundwaves are sent up and down the horn at the same time. This leads to cancellation issues above a frequency set by the round trip distance from the driver to the throat, and back to the driver. The longer the distance the lower the cancellation occurs.
If I understand correctly, the shorter the distance between driver and throat, the higher the frequency where cancellations occur.
After modelling an OD horn 380 cm long, it's SPL has some ripples. Could I space a second offset driver at 1/4 wave distance from the first to compensate for major dips or would it make problems worse ?
I don't want to use a back chamber but let it radiate free to air.
Thanks a lot, Marc
Joined
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580 Posts
Don't know if Soho is active.
Your hopping for a filler driver effect if I'm thinking the way your thinking.
The greatest problem is this. There is no way to simulate this in Hornresp, and it will effectively not do what you want in the first place.
Drivers that are within a 1/2 wavelength of the frequency you are hopping to fill in will behave like a compound driver. In other words spacing them next to each other in acoustical terms.
That is why Hornresp is so successful in modeling systems. It treats multiple drivers as a lumped driver having the surface area of the combination.
As for ripple.
You will not hear ripples in use. Room response is definitely not flat, and music tends to mask most of the ripple effects up to about plus or minus 5db. Tests tones played a semitone intervals will to the trained ear display differences. But this generally occurs at differences greater than 3 db.
To get a handle on this the vertical divisions in Hornresp are 5db increments. Plus or minus 2.5db. If you are within this, from personal experience having built many enclosures. Don't worry man!
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